HomeMy WebLinkAbout2004-04-13 � �
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CITY OF PALM DESERT
`" ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMISSION
• ' MINUTES
APRIL 13, 2004
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I. CALL TO ORDER
The meeting was called to order at 12:30 p.m.
II. ROLL CALL
Commissioners Current Meeting Year to Date
Present Absent Present Absent
Ronald Gregory, Chairman X 5 2
Kristi Hanson X 7
Chris Van Vliet X 5 2
John Vuksic X 7
Ray Lopez X . 7
Karen Oppenheim X 7 �
Karel Lambell X 1
Also Present:
Phil Drell, Director, Community Development
Steve Smith, Planning Manager
Francisco Urbina, Associate Planner
Tony Bagato, Planning Technician
Donna Quaiver, Senior Office Assistant
Diane Hollinger, Landscape Specialist
III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: MARCH 23, 2004
Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by Commissioner Lopez to
approve the minutes of March 23, 2004. The motion carried 3-0-2-2 with
Commissioners Lambell and Van Vliet abstaining and Commissioners Gregory
and Hanson absent.
Commissioner Hanson arrived at 12:50 p.m.
IV. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
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A. The new commissioner, Karel Lambell, was welcomed by staff and
commission members.
A. Final Drawinqs
1. CAS E N O.: SA 04-41
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS�: BEST SIGNS, INC., 1550 S. Gene
Autry Trail, Palm Springs, CA 92264
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of two
business signs.
LOCATION: 73-700 Highway 111, Nextel and Automated Telecom
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Bagato stated that he had suggested to the applicant that they
reduce the size of the signage. The proposal is for illuminated box
signs. The recommendation was to reduce the size and also rout out
the letters and make the backing opaque so that only the letters would
be illuminated. Nancy Cobb, representative for Best Signs, Inc., was
present and was seeking approval of finro illuminated can signs.
lan Helmstedder was present and stated that the yellow on the Nextel
sign is a trademark, copyrighted color. This is the onty signage that
Nextel will approve for Nextel stores. Mr. Drell stated that trademark
protection doesn't relate to whether colors are illuminated or not. They
could have the yellow, but how it gets illuminated is the commission's
choice. Mr. Helmstedder commented that portions of the building will
be painted blue, which will enhance the look of the building. They have
invested approximately $200,000. into the building to improve it.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked if the air conditioning equipment on the
roof was screened. Mr. Helmstedder stated that it is not screened. He
has checked into the City's Facade Enhancement Program and may
consider that in the future.
Mr. Bagato asked about the thickness of the sign cabinet. Nancy Cobb
stated that it's only about 6". Commissioner Vuksic asked if the
commission has recently approved an illuminated box sign anywhere
along a major corridor other than where it's very strongly established in
a center. Mr. Bagato stated that the only one that he could think of was
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for Palm Desert Kitchen and they were asked to have an opaque
background so that only the letters lit up. Commissioner Vuksic stated
that if the commission had approved can signs, they did it reluctantly.
They should be held to a higher standard than an illuminated can sign.
The proposed can signs at night would be really bright. Commissioner
Van Vliet commented that he didn't think that the signs should be that
big. Mr. Helmstedder stated that the signs will be on timers so they're
not going to be lit all night long. They'll go off at 10:00 p.m.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the signs will be lit when the majority
of the people are out there.
Commissioner Lopez asked if they intend to leave the landscaping the
way it is in the photograph. Mr. Helmstedder stated that the picture
was taken before the building was purchased. The bushes seen in the
photo have been cut down.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that it would be so much more
tasteful for the corridor if the signage was less intrusive. Having the
letters light up is about as far as it should go. Mr. Drell stated that the
letters are black and wouldn't light up very well. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that he's seen halo-lit black signs that become a very soft, warm,
white color at night and they look very nice. Nancy Cobb commented
that she didn't think that Nextel would approve that type of sign.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that he would recommend reverse channel
black letters haloed by white at night. Mr. Drell stated that they could
have the yellow background that's opaque. It just won't show up as
bright yellow at night. Trademark protection does not relate to
illumination or size.
Commissioner Lopez commented that the signs are too large.
Commissioner Oppenheim concurred. Mr. Helmstedder stated that he
didn't understand what they meant by channel letters. Commissioner
Vuksic stated that it's a three-sided letter with a light inside of it that
lights the surface behind the letter, which is yellow. The channel letter
doesn't throw off enough light to where you have a very bright color on
the wall. Mr. Drell stated that all the signs in the Desert Crossing
Center are halo-lit. At night, the Target sign is black with a white
background. Mr. Helmstedder asked what would be acceptable in a
lighted box format. Commissioner Van Vliet stated that basically the
commission doesn't like can signs and don't typically approve them.
Mr. Helmstedder stated that there's already a can sign on the building.
Commissioner Van Vliet stated that the existing can sign is much
smaller and has a different shape.
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Commissioner Vuksic stated that the proposed lettering is fine but the
box makes it look very "billboard-like". Mr. Helmstedder asked the
commission if they're saying that he can't have a box sign at all.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that they're suggesting other options. Mr.
Helmstedder stated that other signs he's seen in strip malls are more
round in shape but they're basically box signs, such as the old Kinko's
location. Mr. Drell stated that they're using routed-out letters with an
opaque background at this location. Commissioner Vuksic stated that
there are centers that have can signs so it would be unreasonable not
to allow a tenant to have a can sign but the proposed signage request
is not that sort of situation.
Commissioner Van Vliet suggested that Mr. Helmstedder meet with his
sign person, look at his options and resubmit a new proposal based on
the above comments. Mr. Helmstedder stated that this has been 6-8
weeks in the making to get to this point. Everything that was done was
done within the guidelines of what's written in the code. Mr. Bagato
stated that Ms. Cobb came to him approximately four weeks ago and
he told her about the concerns that he had. If she would've made the
adjustments, the signage could've been approved over the counter, but
the applicant wanted to go forward with the current proposal. Mr. Drell
stated that the applicant had the warning that this was not the path of
least resistance. This is a subjective process, inherently, and it's just
not following the guidelines, which are the minimum physical
dimensions you can have. Ultimately, it's a subjective judgement that
either staff makes or this commission makes. If it was simply following
the book then we wouldn't have this board here at all. Mr. Helmstedder
stated that one of the goals being in business is to attract customers
and having them be able to find you. That's the goal of having signage.
Commissioner Van Vliet commented that the commission understands
that but we want signs that enhance the building and the whole
community. If everyone were allowed to put the biggest sign they could
on their buildings, you know what would happen.
Commissioner Lopez commented that they have people who want to
paint buildings various colors that are not acceptable because they
want the same thing-to attract business. Mr. Drell stated that he didn't
think that people are going to choose Nextel service because of seeing
a sign. Mr. Helmstedder stated that part of it is being located and
found. Commissioner Vuksic stated that they want him to be found, but
it just needs to be with an acceptable sign that maintains the standard
that we impose on other businesses in Palm Desert.
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Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Lopez to continue the request to allow the applicant to return with
revised plans. Halo-lit, reverse channel letters were recommended by
the commission. Motion carried 5-0-0-2 with Commissioners Gregory
and Hanson absent.
2. CASE NO.: SA 04-43
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): SANBORN A/E, INC., FOR CANYON
NATIONAL BANK, 1227 S. Gene Autry Trail, #C, Palm Springs, CA
92264
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of business
signage.
LOCATION: 74-150 Country Club, Canyon National Bank
ZONE: O.P.
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 4-0-1-2 with
Commissioner Oppenheim abstaining and Commissioners Gregory and
Hanson absent.
3. CASE NO.: SA 04-45
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� JOHN SCHMIDT, 263 La Cadena
Drive West, Riverside, CA 92501
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of business
signage. SSI Auto Insurance
LOCATION: 73-520 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic to continue the request at the request of the applicant. Motion
carried 5-0-0-2 with Commissioners Gregory and Hanson absent.
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4. CASE NO.: MISC 04-21
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� RICHARD BRUNELLE, 74-125 San
Marino Way, Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of a
detached second unit to a single-family residence.
LOCATION: 74-125 San Marino Way
ZONE: R-1
This request was withdrawn by the applicant prior to the meeting. No
action was taken.
5. CASE NO.: MISC 04-22
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� DENNIS E. NEUSHUTZ, 43-680
Elkhorn Trail, Palm Desert, CA 92211
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Allow increase in lot
coverage from 30.2% to 42% for expansion of single-family home.
LOCATION: 43-680 Elkhorn Trail
ZONE: R-1 9,000
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 5-0-0-2 with
Commissioners Gregory and Hanson absent.
6. CASE NO.: MISC 04-23
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� TAMARA ZALEVSKY, 72-313 Valley
Crest Lane, Palm Desert, CA 92260
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NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Atrium enclosure with
asphait shingle roof.
LOCATION: 72-313 Valley Crest Lane
ZONE:PR-8
Mr. Smith asked if anyone was present in the audience from the
homeowner's association wishing to speak on this issue. No one was
present from the HOA. Mr. Drell stated that there is a dispute between
the homeowner and the HOA over who is going to do the work. This
doesn't have anything to do with the design. If we can approve the
design the homeowner can work out what he has to do with the HOA in
order for him to avoid being sued. All we're approving is the physical
design and improvement. If this is an air-space condominium, then we
may not be able to issue a building permit. It's important to know who
owns the building. Typically, the owner of the building has to sign the
application.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the proposed atrium enclosure is
buried on all four sides by existing building with a sloped roof with
shingles. Mr. Smith commented that Mr. Urbina visited the site and
concluded that it's not visible from anywhere. Mr. Urbina stated that he
sent the HOA a letter and he left a voice mail message informing them
of the meeting but he never heard from him.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked if they should continue the request until
they find out who owns the building. Mr. Drell suggested that the ARC
could rule on it and then staff can handle it. Commissioner asked the
applicant if he would like to say anything. The applicant commented
that this project is so small that he didn't think that they needed to
discuss it for so long. Commissioner Vuksic asked if anyone else in the
audience would like to say anything about this project. There were no
comments. Commissioner Vuksic stated that he thought that the
atrium enclosure proposal was fine and didn't see anything wrong with
it.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Lopez granted approval subject to clarifying the matter of ownership.
Motion carried 6-0-0-1 with Commissioner Gregory absent.
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7. CASE NO.: CUP 04-11
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� CANYON NATIONAL BANK, 1711 E.
Palm Canyon Drive, Palm Springs, CA 92264
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of an 8' x 6'
free-standing automated teller machine with lighted kiosk and business
signage. Canyon National Bank
LOCATION: 72-363 Highway 111, Desert Crossing
ZONE: PC
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 5-0-1-1 with
Commissioner Oppenheim abstaining and Commissioner Gregory
absent.
8. CASE NO.: MISC 04-18
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS�: ANTHONY-TAYLOR
CONSULTANTS, 304 Enterprise Street, Escondido, CA 92027
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request approval of
revised plans and signage for a facade enhancement for a retail store
in Palms to Pines Central.
LOCATION: 72-815 Highway 111, 99¢ STORE
ZONE: PC3
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 5-0-0-2 with
Commissioners Gregory and Hanson absent.
Commissioner Hanson arrived at this point in the meeting.
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9. CASE NO.: VAR 04-01
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� SUZANNE LOPEZ, 3257 Primero, Los
Angeles, CA
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of carport
17'2" from curb face.
LOCATION: 45-807 Portola Avenue
ZONE:
Mr. Urbina stated that this is an existing carport structure. The
applicant is seeking approval from this body on the design. The carport
is comprised of four wood posts with carvings and beams on the roof
with rafters with bamboo poles going across the carport with a shade
cover on top of it. Our ordinance requires a minimum 20' setback from
the front of the carport to the curb face, however, in this case the
existing carport only has a setback of 17'2" which would require
approval of a variance by the Planning Commission. Today the
applicant is seeking comments from the ARC on the materials and
design of the carport. Comments by the Building and Safety
Department stated that, "Construction plans and a building permit will
be required for the carport structure. There appears to be deficiencies
in the lateral bracing, beam size and connections, rafter size and
post/footing connection. Further information would be required to make
a complete determination."
Suzanne Lopez, applicant, was present and stated that she was having
a friend help her with this project because she lives in Los Angeles. I'm
a single parent with a child. My understanding was that it was coming
to the Architectural Committee based on her communication and that
they had looked at the drawings, which I had hand done, and showed
where it was on the property, how we were going to secure it, etc... I
had pictures of the hand-carved posts from Mexico and there's little
brackets from India. It was miscommunicated so I came out over the
holidays and I thought that it had been approved so I built it with my
workers and my daughter over Christmas and then we were sited. I've
never done this before. In the process, when they said there was a
variance problem I went and took pictures because the house next
door has a garage that's exactly 17'2", which is the same as my house
that was built in 1957. Their garage is exactly the same as this carport
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is only it goes back further. When the house was purchased, there was
a problem with the sewer connection and it was torn up for 3%2 months
and it was supposed to be two days. I'm still in small claims court with
the realtors and contractors who did the work. In trying to improve the
curbside appeal of the house, it was very old and hadn't been painted
and being out there and working there's no shade to park the car. As
you know, living here in the desert, if you touch your steering wheel the
skin burns off your hand. My intention was to build a carport that had
some kind of ethnic appeal that was interesting rather than putting up
aluminum posts. My goal is to build a three-car garage and to change
the facade of the house. I want to do a Santa Fe look. I've been
directed to the Redevelopment Agency here as a single parent with my
income to see about getting additional match funding to redo the curb
side. That's my goal, hopefully, by this coming year. The carport isn't
going to stay up for very long. I just needed a place to put the car so
that we could get in and out of it in the summer months. We're trying to
comply. I went and took pictures up and down the street to show that
there are other places in the neighborhood that are not in that variance
from the time that it was built.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked for clarification of the setbacks. The
applicant's carport is at 17'2" and it should be 20'. Ms. Lopez said no,
that the house next door is exactly the same. It is correct in terms of
what the variance is, but for this particular house the carport is in total
alignment with the house, the house next door, the street was cut in...
Commissioner Hanson commented that the reason why there's a 20'
setback is so that when you have guests park behind your cars in your
carport that they don't stick out into the street. Ms. Lopez commented
that with this particular house they cut the street in so in front of the
house it's cut in about 4' and took away the front of the yard. Noone
would ever park behind the car in the carport. They could park in front
of the house. There's no parking problems.
Mr. Urbina commented that the depth of the carport is only 13'. It's not
the standard 20'. You would not be able to have enough room to park
cars behind a parked car there. Commissioner Hanson asked if there
was parking available on the street. Mr. Urbina stated that there was
parking on the street.
Commissioner Van Vliet stated that one of the biggest issues is that the
whole structure is not up to structural codes. Ms. Lopez commented
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that she didn't know because she looked at the drawings and said that
they have to go to ARC first and she had to get a variance. I was told
by Mr. Urbina that it probably needs to have additional supports. I don't
know what would blow it down unless you had a hurricane, maybe,
because it has no bearing weight on the top. It's just natural pieces of
bamboo. Commissioner Van Vliet commented that there is no lateral
structure to it at all. It would go over like a "house of cards". Ms. Lopez
stated that they have about 4 '/2 ` of cement and rebar down into the
ground where the pillars are. I don't have any problem putting
additional braces on it, if that's what's required by the Building
Department. I just want to have it up until I can get the garage built.
I'm in the lending process now to do that. Mr. Urbina commented that
maybe if her long-term intention is to do a Santa Fe-style garage,
should we be requesting those types of plans at this time. Mr. Drell
stated that she'll have more stringent setbacks for a covered garage. If
you're going to the Planning Commission on a variance, you might as
well at the same time ask for approval of the garage at 17' as well. Ms.
Lopez stated that she would like to build another house in the backyard
and fence the front of the house.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that the carport, as a stand-alone, is
interesting. IYs too bad that it doesn't work with the house at all. It
would've been nice if it looked like it belonged to the house. We don't
have the option of granting a temporary approval. I wouldn't have
approved this. I would approve something that looks like it belongs to
the house. Ms. Lopez asked if the carport was painted the color of the
house would it make it look like it belongs. It's just a square structure
with bamboo on top of it. Commissioner Vuksic stated that it needs to
look a little bit more like the house. The house has very distinct
architecture to it. Commissioner Hanson stated that the carport is a
major departure from the architecture of the house. I can appreciate
what you've done with the pillars and they're very beautiful, but they
don't apply in this case. I understand from your perspective why you
think that you should be able to have a 17' setback because that's what
your neighbor has but your neighbor's house was built before they
moved the road. We now have rules that say you have to be 20' away
from the curb and there's a reason for that rule and I think it's
appropriate. We would be doing ourselves a disservice if we approve
this.
Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic to deny the request and determined that the architecture of the
carport should be similar to the distinct architecture of the house.
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Motion carried 5-0-0-2 with Commissioners Gregory and Van Vliet
absent.
10. CASE NO.: MISC 03-22
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): MCA ARCHITECTS, INC., 1247
Pomona Road, #105, Corona, CA 92882
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Final approval of
architecture for remodel of former House to Home to future retail and
office/storage.
LOCATION: 72-700 Dinah Shore Drive, (former House to Home)
ZONE: PC
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for final approval by minute motion, subject to extending cornice
detail 4'-8' on tower elements on the south elevation. Motion carried 5-
0-0-2 with Commissioners Gregory and Hanson absent.
11. CASE NO.: SA 03-113
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): IGNACIO DEL RIO, 73-520 EI Paseo,
Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request approval of
revised exterior colors for a restaurant.
LOCATION: 73-520 EI Paseo
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Smith stated that the applicant is requesting of approval of exterior
color change which is already installed. Commissioner Vuksic stated
that he drove by it and he really noticed it the first time, but after a
couple of times he didn't really notice it too much. Today I drove by
and looked at it and in the context of EI Paseo, it's a small building.
Commissioner Hanson stated that she has a problem with the applicant
coming in and saying that he didn't know that he needed approval. The
applicant has done buildings all over the place and he knows that he
needed approval. My vote is "no".
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Commissioner Lopez stated that the first time he saw it he was
surprised but now he's gotten used to it. The commission wouldn't
have approved it if the applicant would've come in before he had it
painted.
Commissioner Oppenheim commented that she sees the building all
the time because she lives in that area and the color even bothered her
in the back but she's gotten used to it. There's another storefront on
Highway 111 for an interior design store, which is a similar color. It's
doesn't bother her as much as it did originally.
Commissioner Lambell stated that the color is a rapid departure from
anything that's on EI Paseo and whether or not you want to start that
ball rolling is the issue. Mr. Drell stated that EI Paseo is in evolution.
When the first remodels occurred on the west side of the street, I was
accused of turning EI Paseo into Las Vegas, referring to CPK, Daily
Grill, etc...
Commissioner Vuksic stated that he would have two concerns about
approving it. One is precedent. What happens to the next guy that
comes in with those colors. The other one is the precedent of painting
your building and trying to get it approved later. Commissioner
Oppenheim stated that they could go back to what Commissioner
Lopez said regarding the statement that the commission wouldn't have
approved it if the applicant brought the colors in to them.
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by
Commissioner Lambell for denial based on the findings that the
intensity, contrast and extent of application were incompatible with the
prevailing standards on EI Paseo. While some of these colors may be
appropriate as trim or accents, they are not appropriate for entire
building elevations. Motion carried 5-0-0-2 with Commissioners Van
Vliet and Gregory absent.
B. Preliminary Plans
1. CASE NO.: TT 30706
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS,�: MICHAEL KAUFMAN, 12345 Ventura
Blvd., Suite H, Studio City, CA 91604
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of two
prototype single-family residences for a 16-lot subdivision.
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LOCATION: South of Gerald Ford and west of Portola Avenue; Portola
Pointe
ZONE: PR-5
Commissioner Vuksic stated that he had a concern about some of the
wall thicknesses, particularly in the front. A standard that the
commission asks of everyone is to have thick walls in the front for good
shadow lines and improved aesthetics. Michael Kaufman, architect,
was present and stated that he was pretty sure that all the walls were
12" thick. Commissioner Vuksic stated that according to the plans
they're not that thick. Mr. Kaufman commented that he missed that on
bedroom #3 on Plan 2, but he can make the wall 12" thick.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the trim details tend to look minimal
and "planted on" like they did it just enough to make it interesting. He
asked the applicant to consider adding some wainscots on the houses
where they have some change in depth in the walls, rather than
something that's just nailed on. Mr. Kaufman stated that he could
thicken the walls up at the bottom. Commissioner Vuksic asked if they
were using nail-on windows and wanted to know if the exterior walls are
2 x 6. Mr. Kaufman stated that they are using nail-on windows with 2 x
6 walls. Commissioner Vuksic commented that he would like to ask the
applicant to recess the windows to get some reveal instead of having
the glass flush with the plaster. On the wall thickness, even where
they're thicker such as on the garages, it still looks minimal. It looks
like 9" on Plan 1 and about 12" on Plan 2. On something as large as a
garage door opening, that should be a minimum of 18". All the
columns look like they're 12" x 12" and they look awfully spindly. He
asked the applicant if he could make them 24" x 24". Mr. Kaufman
stated that he could do that but his only concern would be on Plan 2
because the area is very small. On Plan 1, it's no problem at all.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the location of the mechanical
equipment. Mr. Kaufman stated that the equipment will be located in
the attic.
Commissioner Van Vliet commented that the chimney stacks should be
thickened up. They look spindly. Mr. Kaufman stated that the stacks
are 2' x 4'. Commissioner Vuksic stated that they look very funny in the
elevations. Commissioner Vuksic suggested making them 3' x 4'. Mr.
Kaufman stated that he could do that.
Commissioner Oppenheim commented on the exterior colors and their
lack of variation. Commissioner Van Vliet asked if the roof material
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was the same for all the units. Mr. Kaufman stated that the roof
material varies.
Mr. Bagato stated that the landscaping is not included in this proposal.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the color of the wainscot. He
suggested using a darker color on the wainscot. Commissioner Van
Vliet suggested that the applicant work out the cofors with staff.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Hanson for preliminary approval subject to (1) increase front wall
thickness on bedroom #3, Plan 2, (2) add wainscot detail to all plans
and submit accent color for wainscot, (3) recess windows, (4) thicken
columns on Plan 1 from 12" x 12" to 24" x 24", and (5) thicken chimney
stacks to 3' x 4'. Motion carried 5-0-1-1 with Commissioner Lopez
abstaining and Commissioner Gregory absent.
2. CASE NO.: PP 04-07
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): ALLAN ZYLSTRA, 12161 Firestone
Blvd., Norwalk, CA, 90650
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request approval of a
new commercial building.
LOCATION: 73-168 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Smith stated that this item was on the ARC agenda three weeks
ago. The applicant was not available at that time, however, he is
present today. The site is located on the north side of Highway 111,
opposite Carl's Jr.
Rick Dirkson, project architect, was present and commented that this is
an office/retail building. They are proposing that the ground floor be
retail stores and the upstairs will be office space. It has a courtyard
with a walk-through. There is proposed extra parking situation where
he's discussed it with the head of the Planning Department. The
building is contemporary with desert colors.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that there are details where the cornice-
type elements are stepped out. It looks like they're cut off at the ends.
He suggested that Mr. Dirkson think about that. Commissioner Vuksic
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commented on the stacked stone. It looks like they're trying to do
something Italian. Mr. Dirkson stated that they were attempting to do a
contemporary-style building but they wanted to soften the hard surfaces
with the stonework. It's not meant to be Italian, but they like that
product. Commissioner Vuksic stated that the ledge stone is a choice
that he should think about. Mr. Dirkson commented that the stone
would go all the way around the columns, which are set apart from the
surface of the building. They have more depth and weight than is
apparent on a two-dimensional front elevation. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that he understood that, but he was talking about the style of the
stone. When he sees areas of ledge stone which are just 2" high
running across some of the openings. That would never actually work
if it was stone. If they're going to run it over top, they need to use
stones that look like they're actually creating an arch that looks
structural. The roof plan shows cornice details that come out a few
inches on the sides, yet on the front the top piece is jutting out several
feet past. IYs no longer a cornice detail, it's just a slab. Mr. Dirkson
stated that it's an eyebrow for shading purposes. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that he understood the function of it, but the way it's done looks
very strange and very top heavy. It would look very odd. Mr. Dirkson
stated that he's prepared to alter the shape of it to give it more depth.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that it's very deceiving because you
assume that the detail goes around all three sides, but it's not like that
at all. Commissioner Hanson stated that iYs going to be odd with the
very narrow posts on either end of the element that appears to come
out away from the wall with a very heavy top. Beefing up the lower
portions might help. Commissioner Vuksic commented that the wall
elements are flush with the window frames. What looks like very heavy
architecture doesn't even have any depth on the window openings. Mr.
Dirkson stated that he would be proposing that the windows actually be
set back from the surface. They weren't meant to be flush with the
front surface. Commissioner Vuksic stated that judging by the plans,
you wouldn't have an opportunity to set them back. Mr. Dirkson stated
that this would be very easy to accomplish to give it more depth and
shadow line. Commissioner Vuksic asked the applicant how they will
get on the roof of this building. Mr. Dirkson stated that they will
probably use hatches in the ceiling because there's really no good
place to put a ladder. There would be roof access within one of the
spaces. Their primary concern on this project was with their parking.
These are only preliminary drawings because if they don't get approval
on the parking, then they'll have to start over. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that what he would be concerned about is seeing a hoop ladder
somewhere on the building. Mr. Dirkson stated that they're not
proposing that and they will put a roof hatch in the building.
Commissioner Vuksic asked if there was mechanical equipment on the
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north side of the building. Mr. Dirkson stated that the major mechanical
equipment will be on the roof. Commissioner Vuksic stated that the
parapet is 36" high and then there will be a platform for the mechanical
equipment, therefore, the mechanical equipment will be visible. Mr.
Dirkson stated that there are some low-profile mechanical equipment
that would work. They're trying to work with the overall height
limitations imposed by the design standards and he's also trying to
accommodate his client's wishes to have a certain ceiling height. If
they can't find mechanical equipment that can be screened, then they'll
have to lower the ceiling heights in order to drop the roof down.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that they have at least 12" of
exposed mechanical equipment on the roof. Mr. Dirkson stated that
they'll have to drop the ceiling heights down a little bit.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that he some comments about odd-
looking details. There is a little line of plaster with stone. Mr. Dirkson
stated that there's a column in front of the wall surface so the stone
work around the column goes all the way around but the wall surface
behind the column is the little narrow strip and the width of the column
also. Commissioner Hanson commented that on the current proposal
the stone looks tacked on. She encouraged the applicant to make the
front element stone and the rest on either side could be plaster so that
it reads as an element, as opposed to the fact that they want to use a
little bit of stone and weren't sure where to put it. Also, because of the
work that they're going to be doing on Alessandro including parking,
they will have two fronts to the building and it should be treated as
such. The rear elevation definitely has less design than the front
elevation.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the buildings on either side of the
proposed building. Mr. Dirkson stated that there are existing buildings
on either side, one has quite a large mass and one is smaller.
Commissioner Vuksic asked if the proposed building will be higher than
his neighbors. Mr. Dirkson commented that he didn't know. The
building on the west side is relatively new but he doesn't know the roof
height.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the exterior color board shows a
really bright color, which is eggshell. He warned the applicant about
using this color. He's used eggshell before and it's so bright in the
sunlight you can't even look at it. Mr. Dirkson stated that they're very
open to color suggestions. Commissioner Hanson stated that he would
be amazed at the fact that the darker the color you pick and how much
lighter is comes out when you paint a large surface. Don't be afraid to
use a rich, dark color.
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Commissioner Lopez commented that on the landscaping he
recommended that they not use oleander. Also, there are strong
landscape design requirements that require water calculations and the
current design won't been those requirements. Mr. Dirkson stated that
his office did the design but they're not landscape architects.
Commissioner Lopez suggested that he get in touch with Diane
Hollinger, Landscape Specialist, for some suggestions.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Hanson to continue the request to (1) rethink ends of cornice detail and
use of ledge stone, (2) thicken support portions of upper shade
element, (3) conceal roof-mounted equipment, (4) continue architecture
at the rear of the building, and (5) use a rich, dark color for exterior as
opposed to eggshell, which will be very bright. Motion carried 6-0-0-1
with Commissioner Gregory absent.
3. CASE NO.: CUP 04-04
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� JAMES CHESTER, 73-845 Highway
111, Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Facade enhancement
and expansion of existing 1,280 square foot fire-damaged restaurant to
include adjacent 1,800 square foot space to east currently operated by
a florist. Total new restaurant square footage: 3,080 square feet.
LOCATION: 73-845 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Smith stated that the proposal is for an existing fire-damaged
restaurant. Mr. Urbina stated that the Manhattan Bagel restaurant had
a fire last year and the owner wants to do a facade enhancement. The
owner also owns the property to the east, which is presently leased to
Palm Desert Florist. He wants to expand Manhattan Bagel to include
the easterly tenant space. The expansion would add 1,700 square feet
to the restaurant for a total of 3,080 square feet. There is an existing
office on the second floor. That is not proposed for expansion, even
though the way the elevations read it looks like the second floor is
being expanded, however, it is not. Staff is doing a parking study to
see if there are any parking issues.
The commission reviewed the color board. Commissioner Hanson
asked the applicant why he chose the lavender color for the awning
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because the sign was red. James Chester, applicant, stated that he's
trying to get the sign colors changed. Previously, the City objected to
so much red. Commissioner Hanson asked why they chose the
rounded awning. Antonio Santamaria, architect, was present and
stated that he wanted to combine squares with a rounded portion.
Commissioner Hanson stated that it makes it look like a diner.
Commissioner Oppenheim commented that she thought that it looks
good and the color doesn't bother her at all. Commissioner Hanson
stated that the only reason that the purple awning would bother her
would be if the signage was red. Mr. Chester stated that he's not sure
if he's going to use a red sign at this point. Mr. Drell asked about the
size of the letters. Mr. Chester stated that the rounded arched area for
the signage is approximately 16' in length. Mr. Drell stated that the
letters would probably be 4" in height, which wouldn't be big enough
and then they might try to put a bigger sign into a smaller space. Mr.
Chester stated that the area for the sign could easily be dropped down
and made deeper. Mr. Drell commented that when you do architecture
it's important to fit a sign that you're going to want, as opposed to after-
the-fact being stuck with a bunch of lousy alternatives. Commissioner
Hanson suggested doing a freestanding sign as opposed to a can sign.
Mr. Drell suggested putting the signage on the awning. A big awning
without signage looks a little blank. Commissioner Hanson stated that
she doesn't mind the building. Commissioner Vuksic asked about the
small squares that look like glass. Mr. Santamaria stated that they're
glass blocks and don't actually go through and are recessed from the
face.
Mr. Drell asked about the rear elevation with the roll-up door.
Currently, there's a wrought iron gate in this location. The roll-up door
will be open during the day and closed at night. Mr. Chester stated that
the door will be hidden underneath the stucco. Mr. Drell stated that in
the interest of the courtyard, you would want some kind of gateway
inviting architecture. Commissioner Vuksic asked why they would
chose an extremely utility set-up. Mrs. Chester stated that if it's a gate,
then it opens up and it's a problem. Mr. Drell stated that it would be
inviting. This looks like the back end of a warehouse. Mrs. Chester
stated that it's not going to be visible during the day. Mr. Drell stated
that even when it's open it won't look particularly inviting as a courtyard.
Mrs. Chester commented that it's a large space that people will be able
to walk through and they'll see their tables and plants. All they're doing
is taking out the old wrought iron gate. Commissioner Hanson
suggested adding a new wrought iron gate that has a contemporary
look to it. Mr. Chester commented that he's had a problem with people
throwing trash into his courtyard. Commissioner Vuksic stated that it
would be nice if the whole courtyard was opened up so that it would be
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more visible and add some life to the back of those buildings. Mr. Drell
stated that there are ways to frame in an opening that would make it
look like an inviting doorway, as opposed to a loading dock with the
garage door up, even if you can't see the garage door. Commissioner
Lopez suggested adding two large decorative doors. Mrs. Chester
stated that the courtyard is a big, inviting open space that you don't
have to worry about hitting a gate coming through. Commissioner Van
Vliet stated that it can be done architecturally with a roll-up door.
Commissioner Hanson stated that it can be a roll-up door with a
decorative look. She suggested adding a couple of palm trees to the
courtyard which would be visible from outside the patio. Mrs. Chester
commented that she'd rather add foliage than change the gates.
Commissioner Hanson suggested adding an awning on the south-
facing window.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the curved detail is off-center with the
door and it's going to look like a mistake when it's done. Mr. Chester
stated that the building isn't flush across the back. It comes out 3'.
The building is 48' wide and in the back it's 27' 6" and it comes out 3'
and then it's 20'. The end on the right-hand side is the florist space
and that sticks out 3'-4' further. The roof lines aren't the same.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that he's reading way more into that
than what he said. All he meant was that the arch feature, which is a
prominent piece of the architecture, is not centered on the doorway.
The doorway is off just enough so that it looks like a mistake.
Commissioner Hanson stated that he might want to repeat the reveal
detail. Commissioner Vuksic stated that they have a lot of places
where he has glass and plaster. The windows aren't recessed and
they're even cheating a little bit and drawing shadows where they don't
exist. He suggested looking at the windows and make them work a
little bit better with the forms that they've created. There's no depth
there and the windows are just on the face of the wall. Take advantage
of the opportunity to finish the architecture that is being created by
creating openings that enhance it. Set the windows back rather than
make them flush.
Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for preliminary approval subject to (1) consider making roll-up
door decorative, (2) consideration for the color of the awning needs to
be in the context of the color of the signage, (3) suggested putting
signage on awning instead of on the arched form or use reverse
channel letters on flat surface of the arched portion, (4) add awning to
south-facing elevation, (5) continue riglet detail at the rear elevation of
the arched portion and center the arched portion of the signage area
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over the actual opening of the roll-up door, and (6) recess windows.
Motion carried 6-0-0-1 with Commissioner Gregory absent.
4. CASE NO.: CUP 04-08
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� DESERT SPRINGS CHURCH, 43-435
Monterey Avenue, Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request approval of a
new school building.
LOCATION: 43-435 Monterey Avenue
ZONE: PR-7
Commissioner Vuksic stated that there was no roof plan so he didn't
know where the mechanicat equipment would be located and how high
the parapet is. Doug Howard, designer, stated that the parapet is 3'
high. Commissioner Vuksic stated that the roof slopes up as it moves
toward the center of the roof. He wanted to know if it was 3' on the low
side of the roof or the high side of the roof. Mr. Howard stated that it's
3' on the low side. Commissioner Vuksic stated that the roof is sloping
up and then there's a curb for the mechanical equipment. Mr. Howard
commented that you won't see the mechanical equipment.
Commissioner Vuksic asked if he has a drawing that shows the new
and the existing parapet. Mr. Howard stated that the elevations show
the existing parapet. Commissioner Vuksic stated that the applicant
did a really nice job. It really looks good. He did state concern about
the mechanical equipment because they say they're going match the
existing and he would still like to see if the mechanical equipment will
be screened. He wanted to know how people would be getting on the
roof. Mr. Howard stated that there wilt be access on the second floor.
Commissioner Hanson asked about the dotted line on the plans that
show a second floor youth flex space. Mr. Howard stated that they
want to build this portion in the next phase. They haven't designed this
space yet.
Commissioner Vuksic commented on the glass and asked if there was
an architectural reason why the windows are flush with the wall. Mr.
Howard stated that the reason is that they want the new wing to match
the existing church, which have flat surfaces, curved corners and glass
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thaYs flush with the walls. They want dark, bronze glass to match the
rest of the building.
Commissioner Lopez asked about the landscaping. Mr. Smith stated
that there will be a landscape plan for the front parking area.
Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for preliminary approval. Motion carried 6-0-0-1 with
Commissioner Gregory absent.
� 5. CASE NO.: PP 04-16
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS�: T. MICHAEL HADLEY, 25 Calle
Bonita, Sedona, AZ 86336
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of a two-building office complex.
LOCATION: 73-301 & 73-321 Fred Waring Drive
ZONE: OP
Mr. Bagato stated that this project is going to be located on Fred
Waring. It will consist of two office buildings with an open driveway in
the middle. The architect did provide a side elevation to address
concerns regarding the flat portion at zero elevation. We're not sure
what's going to happen on the adjacent vacant parcel. There is an
element that's over the 25' height limit. The commission reviewed the
material board and roof sample.
Michael Hadley, architect, was present and stated that this project is
comprised of two office buildings that meet all the requirements but are
articulated as well as he could do. Mr. Bagato asked for the end
elevation and I'm glad that he did because it forced me to think about
that being a parapet wall condition but given setbacks of 5' and 10', it is
possible to get a recess and even some glazing if we step it way back
on the second floor. In thinking about the possibility that there may not
be another building on the lot adjacent, this made a lot of sense to think
about it. There is a central tower element that's over the 25' height limit
and the owners wanted to take their chances with having that approved
by the City Council because it gives some relief to the center of the
building. There's a glazing change at the center portion on the second
floor and it's a couple of feet higher than the two on the sides. That
gives a little vertical relief in addition to the tower. It also provides for a
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little sign band at the top. We're not asking for signage at this time, but
we're thinking ahead.
Commissioner Hanson asked where the blue color will be located. Mr.
Hadley stated that the building on the right will have a blue tower
element on the second floor and also on the recess on the end
elevation. On the other building it will be an olive green. The buildings
are a mirror image but not necessarily exact duplicates color-wise.
Commissioner Hanson asked the applicant how they intend to screen
the mechanical equipment. Mr. Hadley stated that once he discovered
the 25' height limit, this may require that they have split systems but
he's not sure yet. If they can get package units within the parapet
height, they will. If they can't, they may have to use split systems with
small units either on the roof or on a screened pad behind the building.
The intent was to totally screen it within the roof parapet. Whatever
they design, the equipment will be no higher than the parapet.
Commissioner Hanson commented that the windows need to be
recessed within the 6" walls. Anytime it sits in a 6" wall it needs to be
recessed, particularly on the front and rear elevations because the rear
elevations is where the patrons are going to be going. Mr. Hadley
commented that all of his projects have recessed windows, sometimes
18"-24". Commissioner Hanson stated that the commission would love
that. Mr. Hadley stated that mostly likely, they'll be framed with 8"
studs and the windows, at the very least, will be flush with the interior of
the wall.
Commissioner Hanson stated that the use of ledge stone over the large
openings on the top and bottom elevation should be considered as
some sort of an element, not just tacked-on stone. It should look like
architecturally done stone, whether they stack it vertically or they have
a header piece above the center opening on the first floor. Mr. Hadley
stated that there's a deck on the second floor in front of the tower and
there's sort of a cap stone top to the wall. Commissioner Hanson
commented that she has a real aversion for reflective glass and urged
the applicant to pick something else. Mr. Hadley stated that he's used
this glass here twice before on two different projects. The AG Edwards
building has the same glazing and a newly constructed dental building
on Parkview. It's not a mirrored glass. It's sort of semi-transparent and
semi-reflective. Commissioner Hanson commented that it's very
reflective. In a building that's represented on the photograph on the
material board, however, in buildings where the architecture is more
traditional the two things compete with each other and they don't make
sense. It's not an inappropriate material for all buildings, but in this
case it doesn't apply. Both of the buildings that have this type of glass
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are the two buildings that she likes it the least on. Mr. Hadley asked if it
was the color that bothers her. Commissioner Hanson stated that it's a
very contemporary material and it's being used in a traditional building.
Mr. Hadley stated that the owners had a question about the color as
well. The same manufacturer makes a cinnamon-colored glass that's
not highly reflective and is semi-transparent. He does want the energy
efficiency of the glass.
Commissioner Lopez asked if there's going to be signage on the
building. Mr. Hadley stated that signage is not part of this proposal but
the owners are talking about either having small signs along the
driveway or using the area just in the center below the tower roof. Mr.
Drell stated that they're allowed to have both a monument sign and wall
sign.
Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Oppenheim for preliminary approval subject to (1) screen roof-mounted
mechanical equipment, (2) change window glazing color so that it's less
reflective, and (3) use first floor banding element for signage. Motion
carried 5-0-1-1 with Commissioner Vuksic abstaining and
Commissioner Gregory absent.
6. CASE NO.: PP 04-06
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� NOEL ANASCO/BERGMAN
ARCHITECTURE, 13745 Seminole Drive, Chino, CA 91710
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of a single-story automotive tire retail building. America's Tire Co.
LOCATION: 72-320 Dinah Shore
ZONE: PC-3
Mr. Bagato stated that the site is on Shopper's Lane near PetSmart.
From a building perspective, it meets all the setbacks. From an
architectural standpoint there are some concerns. There are some
restrictions on the site from some CC & R's. Some of the elevations
are all on one plane with 20' roof heights. He had suggested doing
something different, however, there are CC & R's on the property that
only allow for a 20' roof height. It was suggested to the architect to
design something that would work better below the 20' to change the
elevation. Dinah Shore is near this site so he requested a section,
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which the applicant provided. There is some concern that the roof-
mounted equipment may be visible.
Pako Pimsico, architect, was present to answer questions. Dan
Wainwright, V.P. America's Tire Company, was also present. Mr.
Wainwright stated that they're interested in a new retail location at the
shopping center in the northwest corner of Dinah Shore and Monterey.
The other big businesses in the center are Costco, PetSmart and
Home Base. When they obtained the title report on this property they
discovered that there was a height restriction held by Home Base of
20'. IYs really created some challenges to create a building in the
architectural style of "fun". That's the direction that they want to go.
The perspective is mostly just the shape of the building but they're
willing to make whatever changes are appropriate. They've spoken to
the new owner of Home Base and there's a good chance that they'll be
allowed to have a 24' roof height. He can't offer that today. He's
having a tough time getting anyone to release the height restriction.
There's another height restriction held by Pet Smart at 24'. They need
to close escrow fairly soon so they'd like to get some feedback from the
commission and if they're able to get the height restriction waived, then
they could come back or work with staff to make those changes.
There are three garage doors that allow vehicles to go inside the
building. All of the work is done inside the building so there will be no
external service. They just to tires and wheels. They don't do
mechanical repairs, oil changes, etc... It really looks like the car is just
parked in there and it's just lifted up a few inches. The showrooms are
very attractive and very clean. They have a real passion for providing a
retail facility that you would feel comfortable doing business with.
Mr. Drell stated that the theme of the "fun" buildings is asymmetry. It's
an asymmetrical design. The proposed plans are "anti-fun". When
you're creating those elements at 24', start thinking about doing
something asymmetrical.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that it would make a huge difference to
have a 24' roof height. You don't need the pediment element. This is
really a composition of square forms and if you can get differences in
planes and differences in heights, then you're there. You don't need to
force this stuff. Respond to your openings. You don't need to balance
things. You can have fun with just making everything fit iYs particular
need. This isn't a tough one. Break the plane so that one plane is
offset from the other. Keep it simple and nice with good shadows. Mr.
Wainwright stated that they have a 6' overhang which will give them
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good shadow lines. When the weather is nice people can sit outside
on stone benches.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that he likes the idea of the wainscot
but it looks like "stock detail number 105". Maybe they should be
different heights. There are some nice lights on the front elevation but
on the side they have wall packs, which don't look good from the street.
Mr. Wainwright stated that they might have to look at pole lights for
security purposes. Commissioner Vuksic stated that they need to
direct the light down where they need it and not in your face. Mr.
Wainwright stated that the standard fixture that they use has a sheet
metal reflector inside the lens that extends beyond the horizontal plane
of the lamp so all the light is directed down and none leaves the site.
Commissioner Hanson suggested having an alternate plan ready with a
24' roof height. Mr. Wainwright asked if they could be re-scheduled for
ARC in two weeks to review revised plans. Mr. Smith stated that if he
gets his plans to us by next Wednesday, he will be scheduled for the
April 27, 2004 ARC meeting. Mr. Wainwright stated that he would like
to go to the Planning Commission in May.
Commissioner Lopez commented that they may not be able to make
their water calculations after reviewing the landscape plans. He
suggested running the water calcs with some of the plant material and
meeting with Diane Hollinger for suggestions.
Action: Commissioner Lopez moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic continued the request to allow the applicant to return with
revised plans. Motion carried 6-0-0-1 with Commissioner Gregory
absent.
7. CASE NO.: PP 03-23
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� GLASSTONE� INC.� 74-780 42nd
Avenue, Palm Desert, CA 92211
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of a new 19,867 square foot building located on 42"d Avenue.
LOCATION: 74-780 42"d Avenue
ZONE: SI
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Mr. Bagato stated that the building meets the height limits. Marlo
Lafontaine, representative for Glasstone, was present. He stated that
the building is in an SI designated zone. The owner has designed the
building primarily for his own use for his granite and marble business.
The building will be used as a design center to further enhance his
existing business. Directly across from the proposed structure is the
new City yard so there's not a lot going on along 42"d Avenue
architecturally. On the north side of the structure is a temporary trailer
that seems to have stayed there for quite some time that's housing the
a granite importer's office. Standing alone as a structure, the proposed
building will probably be the nicest thing on that street.
Commissioner Hanson asked about the roof height and the material for
the railing. Mr. Lafontaine stated that it's 28' in height and the railing is
a tensile structure which will be made out of aluminum and canvas.
Commissioner Hanson commented that the way you've indicated the
stone on the building right now it looks like a ledger stone but in the
color board it's a slate noce. Mr. Lafontaine stated that it will be the
slate noce in a random pattern. The building color is khaki and they'd
like to go with some of the gray slate tones to give it an earthy look.
Mr. Drell asked if the pattern of the building has to be so repetitive. Mr.
Lafontaine stated that each one of those bays becomes it's own
rentable, leaseable unit. Mr. Drell stated that when you have a couple
of interesting ideas and repeat it over and over again it defeats the
purpose of an interesting idea. Mr. Lafontaine stated that it's a
challenge to make a building in an SI zone functional and still look
good. This plan goes far beyond a typical tilt-up building. Mr. Drell
stated that we've seen some very interesting tilt-up buildings that have
far more diversity and variation.
Commissioner Hanson suggested that instead of having every column
go up to the horizontal part of the roof they could just cap it off at the
rail. Mr. Lafontaine commented that what we're missing from the single
dimensional CAD drawing is the fact that the upper balcony portion
steps back approximately six feet. You're getting a real recessed feel.
You can't really see any of the shading from the roof overhang. Mr.
Drell stated that this will be the same shading along the entire building.
It's so repetitive. Don Morely, designer, was present and stated that
the columns go all the way up to the second floor. Each one of the
units are separated and the balconies are recessed 6' from the face of
the building. You can't walk from unit to unit on the balcony. Those
are private decks. The tensile structures that you see in the front can
be changed from unit to unit. They're integrated into the railing system
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and each one has to be engineered specifically for that bay. The fabric
structure can easily be changed.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that he didn't feel that it was as simple as
that. I understand the need to have a module and stick to that. Almost
every building we do has a module and it doesn't force you into a single
architectural element. Architecturally, you can create elements. The
second floor is set back and you haven't taken advantage of that at all.
You can create different forms there with some forms that go all the
way to the second floor and some that don't and break up the roof line.
Mr. Lafontaine commented that design for the sake of design doesn't
necessarily make monetary sense. Commissioner Vuksic commented
that there needs to be a balance between being economical and being
acceptable aesthetically. This is a huge building and it needs a little bit
more going on.
Commissioner Lopez asked about areas for signage. Mr. Lafontaine
stated that they could potentially add a marquee or something at the
street level versus identifying each tenant separately. We could do that
with numbers or addresses without cluttering the building.
Commissioner Hanson commented that a few of the commissioners
can read through the CAD and know exactly what they're looking at. A
little bit more effort needs to be made to break it up. What isn't being
shown is the rear elevation, which is really awful. Mr. Lafontaine stated
that they're limited a little bit because of the parking issues. If they
offset the building too much, we're going to eat into the parking so they
need to be conscious of that. Mr. Drell commented that they're not
talking about changing the footprint of the building at all. Mr.
Lafontaine stated that what the commission would like is adding some
elements to add a little more interest. Commissioner Vuksic
commented that there needs to be some play in the wall lines where
things come over and overlap other things to create some variety in
that very long building. Mr. Lafontaine stated that the wall is at
minimum offset by 24' from the rear property line for access and that
backs the existing Glasstone building. As you're coming around
Corporate Drive there's no way to really visually see that structure.
Commissioner Hanson stated that as you drive by on 42"d Avenue,
you'll be able to look down there to some degree and the building has a
very flat face with no relief so basically you get a shot at all the doors.
Something needs to be done to break it up.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the location of the mechanical
equipment. Mr. Lafontaine stated that iYll be located below the 4'
mansard roof. Mr. Drell asked if they really want a mansard roof.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that he's hoping that when the plans
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are revised, the mansard roof would be gone. Mr. Drell stated that he'd
rather have a vertical parapet than a mansard roof. The mansard roof
is probably more costly without adding interest. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that they don't have to necessarily add that much cost to the
building, it's just a matter of how you're going to take the surfaces
you're going to need anyway and manipulate them. By not having a
mansard, you'll have a bunch of money that you can do some other,
more interesting things with.
Mr. Lafontaine asked how the commission feels about the end of the
building. Commissioner Hanson stated that it needs some work.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that whatever they're doing on the main
elevation needs to wrap around and continue with the same care.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Hanson continued the request to allow the applicant to return with
revised plans showing architecture that is less repetitive with more
variation and additional architecture on the rear elevation. Motion
carried 5-0-0-2 with Commissioners Gregory and Van Vliet absent.
VI. ADJOURNMENT
The meeting was adjourned at 2:50 p.m.
STEVE SMITH
PLANNING MANAGER
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