HomeMy WebLinkAbout2004-05-11 �
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CITY OF PALM DESERT
ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW COMMISSION
• ' MINUTES
MAY 11, 2004
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I. CALL TO ORDER
The meeting was called to order at 12:30 p.m.
II. ROLL CALL
Commissioners Current Meeting Year to Date
Present Absent Present Absent
Ronald Gregory, Chairman X 7 2
Kristi Hanson X 9
Chris Van Vliet X 7 2
John Vuksic X 9
Ray Lopez X 8 1
Karen Oppenheim X 9
Karel Lambell X 3
Also Present:
Phil Drell, Director, Community Development
Steve Smith, Planning Manager
Francisco Urbina, Associate Planner
Tony Bagato, Planning Technician
Donna Quaiver, Senior Office Assistant
III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: April 27, 2004
Commissioner Van Vliet moved, seconded by Commissioner Oppenheim to
approve the minutes of April 27, 2004. The motion carried 6-0-1-0 with
Commissioner Lopez abstaining.
IV. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
A. None.
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A. Final Drawinqs
1. CASE NO.: SA 04-61
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): SOUTHWEST SIGN, INC., 40475
Vista Murrieta Road, Murrieta, CA 92562
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of business
signage. Country Wide Home Loans
LOCATION: 73-261 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Smith stated that Ted Groulx did the building renovation at this
location. He asked the applicant about the raceway design for the sign.
The applicant stated that there is no raceway and that there was a
misprint on the plans.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that the sign looked crowded at the
top and bottom. Mr. Drell asked the applicant what the dimensions
were on the top and bottom of the signage. The applicant, John
Erickson, stated that it's 10" from the top of the "H" to the bottom of the
"L". Commissioner Van Vliet asked the commission if 6" would be
enough room at the top and the bottom of the sign. Commissioner
Vuksic thought that 6" would be enough and the sign may need to be
reduced slightly to accomplish that. It may work if there is at least 6" on
the top and 6" on the bottom.
Commissioner Hanson asked about the blue monument sign. Mr.
Erickson stated that only the house and letters are illuminated on the
monument sign. The blue is paint, which will probably be semi-gloss,
but he could use flat paint. Commissioner Van Vliet commented that
flat would be better. Commissioner Gregory stated that flat paint would
look wretched. Commissioner Hanson stated that she would like to
retract the comment regarding the monument sign. Mr. Erickson stated
that blue is the corporate color.
Mr. Smith noted that 800 millilamps needs to be reduced to 430
millilamps to be consistent with the code requirements.
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by Commissioner
Lambell for approval subject to (1) having at least 6" of space at the top
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of the sign and 6" of space at the bottom of the sign, and (2) 800
millilamps reduced to 430 millilamps to meet code requirements.
2. CASE NO.: SA 04-66
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� BEST SIGNS, INC., 78-078 Country
Club Drive, Suite 106, Bermuda Dunes, CA 92203
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Approval of signage
for JPL Bible Church.
LOCATION: 72-745 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Smith stated that the request is for new signage for JPL Bible
Church at the former theater location near MacDonald's on Highway
111. Mr. Urbina stated that the proposed sign will be located on the
existing former Cinema III freestanding sign. JPL Bible Church is
leasing space in one of the three former theaters. Kasandra Ahlgren,
applicant, stated that they've actually taken over all three theaters. Mr.
Drell asked if there are still three separate spaces. Ms. Ahlgra stated
that one of the theaters is for their Kids Rock program, one is the adult
sanctuary and the other one is for administration. Mr. Urbina stated
that the proposal is to have individual cut-out letters with an aluminum-
type background with a reader board underneath. The sides will have
some future murals or paintings.
Commissioner Gregory stated that this was originally designed as a
marquee for a theater, which is a different use. The size of the sign is
rather unusual. Where you're indicating on the sides for future artwork,
we'd typically like to know what that is if it's part of the sign. Ms.
Ahlgren stated that they still haven't come to a determination of what
the artwork will be. It'll be something that's complementary to the City
of Palm Desert. It will not advertise anything. Commissioner Gregory
stated that the problem with anything that becomes art in a public place
is that you start getting people who have different opinions. This is
integral to the design of the sign and maybe this is something that we
should see first. Mr. Drell stated that this is an interesting problem. We
don't regulate art unless it can be shown to be detrimental to public
health and safety. Commissioner Hanson commented that if it's
artwork that's on a sign, then it's part of the sign and so we do look at
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that. Mr. Drell disagreed and stated that it's only commercial speech if
its subject matter is directly relating to the commercial establishment.
In the 80's in Indio there was a supermarket that had a grocery store
with a big mural on the side of their building. Indio tried to regulate it as
a sign and they ended up losing their entire sign ordinance as a result
of it. Commissioner Van Vliet stated that the area for the proposed
artwork is such a huge area of the sign. Mr. Drell stated that typically
we haven't counted monument size when we look at monument design
as part of the sign area because we didn't want to discourage people
from doing substantial monuments. Obviously, this is the other end of
that spectrum. It's an existing thing and the applicant doesn't want to
tear down an existing sign but wants to adapt it. It's definitely unusual.
Commissioner Hanson stated that she felt that the sign is abnormally
sized for a project. The sign that was at Westfield Shoppingtown was
too big and we made them take it down. Commissioner Lopez asked if
the sign was visible from both sides. Ms. Ahlgren stated that it's double
faced. Mr. Drell stated that the reader board probably isn't going to be
readable from traffic going by on Highway 111. The big issue, is
whether or not the applicant can use the existing monument. Not being
able to see the quality of the art and how it fits into the overall design of
the monument makes it hard to decide if the monument is acceptable.
Commissioner Gregory stated that he assumed that the applicant
would like to use the existing monument because it would be a lot less
expensive than building a new one. It's unlikely that we would approve
this from scratch because it's way too big. We don't like oversized
signs because we establish precedent if we allowed the applicant to do
it.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked about the size of the existing sign. Ms.
Ahlgren stated that iYs about 24' long and 8'/2 high. That's not
including the poles that it stands on, which are about 5' in height. It's
quite a large sign. Mr. Drell stated that it's set back quite a distance
from the street so it's not all that obtrusive.
Commissioner Lopez commented that there were some large signs put
in La Quinta which were 15' tall and 30' wide. How they made the
scale go down was by adding large palm trees behind it . The
proposed sign is just sitting in the middle of a lawn area. If there was
landscaping around it or something to soften it, it might not look as big.
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Commissioner Hanson commented that as the signs original use, it
wasn't offensive. It's too big of a sign for the current use. If this was a
regular church, we would never approve this size. Mr. Drell stated that
they would be entitled to a 25 square foot reader board plus their
normal sign. They would have the middle part of the sign, plus
something on the top. Commissioner Hanson stated that she doesn't
feel that they're being unfair to the applicant. Maybe there's a way to
modify the sign for that use.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked if the applicant could focus on the
artwork so we can see what it looks like as an attempt to salvage this
sign for them. We could continue the request and see what the artwork
is going to look like.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that you sort of accept a theater marquee
sign to be in your face, but this is no longer a theater. Commissioner
Lambell stated that she had a problem with the aluminum. Ms. Ahlgren
stated that the current sign has plexi-glass faces with runners with
changeable letters but all the rest of the sign is aluminum, which can be
painted. They planned on skinning the old sign face with new
aluminum and either painting it to match the existing color or paint the
entire sign a different color which would be complementary to the area.
Commissioner Lambell stated that she's having trouble with the color
and the size.
Commissioner Lopez stated that he would like to see a bigger picture
that shows the area around the sign. Commissioner Vuksic stated that
the pictures that were presented to the commission don't do it justice.
Mr. Drell suggested that the commission go out and look at the sign in
person. Staff will take some photos to be used for reference during the
next meeting.
Commissioner Gregory asked if the applicant should produce some
ideas of art for the commission to review. Mr. Drell stated that it is
important in the design of the sign to get some idea of impact of
something in those blank spaces. Commissioner Gregory asked if the
commission would be establishing a negative precedent. Mr. Drell
commented that each item is subject to a unique, case-by-case,
subjective evaluation.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Lopez to continue the request to (1) allow the commissioners to visit the
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AGENDA
site, and (2) allow applicant to submit proposed artwork. Motion carried
7-0.
3. CASE NO.: MISC 04-28
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): JUAN FRANCO, 74-155 Parosella
Street, Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request approval of a
second unit at a single-family residence.
LOCATION: 74-155 Parosella Street
ZONE: R-1
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by Commissioner
Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 7-0.
B. Preliminary Plans
1. CASE NO.: TT 31490
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� PONDEROSA HOMES II, INC., 6671
Owens Drive, Pleasanton, CA 94588-3398
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of model units for 237 single-family lots.
LOCATION: 74-000 Gerald Ford Drive, Northwest corner of Portola
and Gerald Ford
ZONE: PR-5
Mr. Smith stated that the site is located on the north side of Gerald
Ford, east of Portola. The commission has a site plan and basic
designs for the models to review. Jeff Shraeder, representative for
Ponderosa Homes, was present to address the commission. Mike
Penrose, representative for JBZ Architects and Joe LaScala,
representative for Summers Murphy landscape architects. Mr.
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Shraeder stated that the same models exist on another project in La
Quinta on the corner of Fred Waring and Jefferson. If anybody is
curious, you can see them there. It's called Mosaic. Mr. Drell asked if
they were the same models or similar models. Mr. Shraeder stated that ,
they're using the same plans with the same elevations.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the thickness of the exterior walls
and wanted to know what kind of stud they're using around the
perimeter of the house. Mr. Shraeder stated that they're using 2 x 4
and 2 x 6 studs depending on how it's framed. There's some double
framing.
Mr. Drell asked the applicant if he's sure that they want to duplicate a
tract. I don't think that anyone has ever done that. We've had similar
tracts but I don't think that anyone has ever duplicate the same plans.
Mr. Shraeder stated that the project design and landscape architecture
are not identical. The projects are far enough away so that it wouldn't
be confusing. The project in La Quinta will be sold out before this one
even opens up.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the thin fascia line and he asked if
the fascias were all plaster. Mr. Shraeder stated that they're wood
fascias. Commissioner Vuksic asked if there was plaster behind the
fascia board or are there exposed truss tails in that area. Mr. Penrose
stated that it's his understanding that there is stucco behind the fascia
board. Commissioner Van Vliet stated that there's no detail on the
plans. Mr. Penrose stated that it may be that the stucco is on the front
and the back has rafter tails. IYs been three years since we did the
previous project.
Commissioner Vuksic asked about the location of the air conditioning
units. Mr. Shraeder stated that the units are on the ground, either at
the rear or the side. If there's a setback issue, they're located in the
rear yard. Commissioner Vuksic asked about the location of the air
handlers for the forced air units. Mr. Shraeder stated that they will be
located in the attic. Commissioner Vuksic asked about the chimneys.
Mr. Shraeder stated that they're all gas units so there is a pretty small
vent, but no chimney form. Commissioner Vuksic stated that on Plan 1,
would there be venting on the wall through the back. Mr. Shraeder
stated that it vents through the roof. It's a gas appliance; not a wood-
burning fireplace. There's no reason to have a full chimney.
Commissioner Hanson stated that she doesn't like looking at the vents
very much. Mr. Shraeder stated that you won't see it from the street.
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Commissioner Hanson stated that the neighbor will see it. Mr.
Shraeder stated that it'll be like a gas water heater vent.
Mr. Drell stated that the roof plans and floor plans don't seem to match.
Commissioner Gregory stated that other than wall thicknesses, which is
nice, are there any concessions to the desert environment here relative
to passive solar shading? These are prototypes that are built
everywhere, but we have a pretty tough climate here. Is there anything
that provides any shade? Mr. Shraeder stated that there are covered
loggias on all plans. The overhangs are approximately 24".
Commissioner Gregory commented that this will be a lower-type cost
home, relative to some of the other projects in the area. Mr. Shraeder
stated that these homes will sell for $500,000. Commissioner Gregory
stated that when he looks at something that sells for that amount of
money, I expect more. I don't see anything that makes me feel like it's
desert oriented. It doesn't mean that it has to be a desert-style, but a
house that's compatible with living here. I don't see an effort made on
the design of the home to relate to our climate here. Mr. Shraeder
stated that the homes are pretty similar to a lot of the homes that are
being built in Palm Desert, La Quinta or other areas of the desert that
are tract-type, production houses. We provide a pretty decent spec
package with slab marble-type interior spec package. They have
aluminum reflective roof as a standard item so they exceed Title 24
standards. We probably build the best tract home in the desert using
quality construction materials. Commissioner Gregory asked to see the
materials board.
Mr. Smith stated that he had comments back from the City's Landscape
Department, which is fairly extensive. Mr. Shraeder stated that he's
working with the City on his landscape plan.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked about the building heights. One looks
like it's 20'3" in height on Plan 2. Mr. Shraeder stated that he thought
that they were 16'-18' in height.
Mr. Drell stated that they look like very ordinary homes. I'm not sure if
that has any reflection on price. Mr. Shraeder stated that on the tract in
La Quinta, the last phase is selling for $545,00-$650,000.
Commissioner Lambell commented that if she was going to spend that
kind of money, she would want something that has a personality. Mr.
Shraeder encouraged the commission to go look at the models
because the drawings don't do it justice. Commissioner Lambell stated
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that this is what the applicant has given them and it's not thrilling her to
spend $650,000. Mr. Shraeder stated that iYs the market. Mr. Drell
stated that we're talking about architecture and whether there are ways
to put a little more panache or architectural interest into the project. Mr.
Shraeder stated that they didn't color all of the elevations and they
should've done that. They've been waiting to process this project for
some time and so they had a chance to bring this to the ARC pretty
quickly. Mr. Drell stated that the project meets the requirements but it's
underwhelming in terms of design.
Commissioner Gregory commented that one of the problems with this
particular city is that Palm Desert has had one of the unique
opportunities to strive for something a little bit more than what you can
do somewhere else. Even though you meant well when you said that
you already built this in La Quinta, we don't want to hear that. We want
to hear that it's more special here. What we see is something thaYs not
special. You said that this has been sitting for some time because of
the moratorium. If you had the opportunity to "gussy" this up
somewhat, can you bring things a little bit more up to speed? Mr.
Shraeder stated that he could do that.
Commissioner Hanson stated that Plan 2 shows an entry gate, which
doesn't show on the elevations. It might help to show this. Mr.
Shraeder stated that this is a landscape element. Commissioner
Hanson stated that it looks like a structure on the floor plan and it
doesn't show up on the elevations. Mr. Shraeder stated that she was
right. Commissioner Vuksic stated that this would be an opportunity for
an architectural feature. Commissioner Hanson stated that the
traditional model needs more work.
Commissioner Lopez asked the applicant if he's done any preliminary
water calculations. Mr. Shraeder stated that he has and they've been
through a couple of revisions and needs to discuss this with Diane
Hollinger. Mr. Drell stated that one of the ideas in Palm Desert is that
we don't apologize that we're in the desert, therefore, we don't want
lawn on public corners.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Hanson to continue the request to allow the applicant to return with
revised plans showing (1) chimneys designed into house with
substantial thickness and decorative tops, (2) plaster fascia, (3) walls
visible from the street will be a minimum of 12" thick, other walls will be
2 x 6 walls with 2 x 4 nailer at the window to allow for some recess, and
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(4) all models need improved architecture, especially traditional models.
Motion carried 7-0.
2. CASE NO.: PP 04-07
APPLICANT �AND ADDRESS): ALLAN ZYLSTRA, 12161 Firestone
Blvd., Norwalk, CA 90650
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request for
preliminary approval of revised elevations for a new commercial
building.
LOCATION: 73-168 Highway 111
ZONE: C-1
Mr. Urbina stated that the applicant has returned with revised elevations
for the front and rear of the commercial building. The stonework has
been extended all the way to the top on the ends and the middle.
Stuccoed parapet features have been added. The applicant has
addressed the previous comments made by the Architectural Review
Commission.
Commissioner Vuksic wanted to know what the thought process was
regarding the ledgestone and the choice of the narrow stone on a very
Italian building. Also, the application of the stone over the large
openings. Allan Zylstra, applicant, was present as well as his architect,
Rick Dirkson and stated that the ledgestone is in the center so there's
only ledgestone over one opening. One of the comments that was
made previously was that it felt too shallow so he increased the depth
of the ledgestone to increase the feeling that there's enough support
and that it's structurally viable. Proportionally, the ledgestone looks fine
now. Previously, it was a little shallow but now the ledgestone wraps all
the way around so it gives projections a more substantial and solid look
to it than it did previously. They increased the parapet height.
Commissioner Vuksic asked if the stone itself is architecturally
appropriate for this building. Mr. Dirkson stated that he doesn't see a
problem with the ledgestone. The building has evolved to become
more of an Italian-style building and the ledgestone fits in with that
style. You see more of a quarry stone look in Italian architecture, but
ledgestone is something that his client is very fond of so he tried to
incorporate it into the facade of the building. Commissioner Vuksic felt
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that they had a miscommunication on the application of the ledgestone.
He meant that when you have a large span and you have ledgestone
going across it, it doesn't look structurally sound. It could never be built
that way. It needs to be structurally keyed in some way. Mr. Dirkson
stated that he could put something beneath the ledgestone that gives it
a feeling of structural support. Commissioner Vuksic suggested adding
a lintel. Mr. Dirkson agreed.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that the color looks good on the
drawing. When they were talking about this project previously, he
noticed how the rear elevation windows had good proportions that
looked good with the style with larger windows on the first floor and
smaller windows upstairs. In the front, he didn't do this. There's as
much glass as possible on both floors. Mr. Dirkson stated that this is
true. This is a commercial establishment and view windows are very
important to conducting business and having visibility to display
products. Commissioner Vuksic stated that you need to strike a
balance. He asked the architect what the second floor was going to be
used for. Mr. Dirkson stated that they will have offices upstairs.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that they don't have to advertise wares
through the windows of an office. Mr. Dirkson stated that he could tone
the windows down in scale on the second story. Commissioner Vuksic
stated that this would make a big difference, especially if they could
break it up into smaller windows, like on the rear elevation. This would
create a geometric system that would be more in keeping with the style
that you're generating and offer more interest to the eye. The section
on the plans was confusing. It looks like there are eyebrows on the top
of the building but they don't show up on the section. Mr. Dirkson
stated that they're higher extensions for the parapet. They are the
section. They're pieces of the parapet that aren't as high as the middle
part and they're a different color. Commissioner Vuksic stated that he
sees a grey surface and a chocolate brown surface and he wanted to
know if they were on the same plane. Mr. Dirkson stated that they're
on the same plane. He could project them forward to give them a
change in plane and add a shadow line. Commissioner Vuksic stated
that what concerned him was that they were out and never imagined
that they were in the same plane. Commissioner Hanson asked if it
would make more sense to move the high portion back so that it would
shield the equipment better. At this point, just having a thin 6" parapet
line wouldn't be substantial enough. Mr. Dirkson stated that he could
put a separate equipment screen further back. Commissioner Hanson
suggested removing the eyebrow and putting a separate screen further
back. Commissioner Vuksic concurred. Mr. Dirkson felt that the
eyebrow enhances the overall balance of the building. He could run the
parapet straight across or put a step in the parapet and make it all the
same color. Commissioner Vuksic agreed that he would need
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something there, otherwise it would look very plain. Mr. Dirkson
suggested thickening the parapet and making it one color.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the applicant should thicken the walls
on the rear elevation so that it looks richer and look more substantial.
Mr. Dirkson agreed to do this.
Commissioner Gregory commented that the sign fascias appear to be
very thin for the signage. He was concerned that when the tenants try
to add signage, there won't be enough room for a nice sign. Mr.
Dirkson stated that they could offer more sign area. Mr. Zylstra is not
interested in having gaudy signs. He wants simple, non-illuminated
signs. Commissioner Gregory stated that his concern was with the
location of the signs.
Action: Commissioner Vuksic moved, seconded by Commissioner
Hanson for preliminary approval subject to (1) adding a lintel under
ledgestone to give appearance of support for stonework, (2) second-
floor windows on the front elevation to be smaller, (3) remove eyebrows
on top of building and put them back further on roof, (4) step parapet
and make it thicker, (5) thicken walls on front elevation and recess
windows, and (6) create appropriate area for signage.
3. CASE NO.: PP 04-01, C/Z 04-01, TT 31836
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� PDCC DEVELOPMENT, LLC, c/o
Larry Kosmont, 601 Figueroa Street, Suite 3550, Los Angeles, CA
90017
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of revised plans for maintenance facility design.
LOCATION: Palm Desert Country Club
ZONE: OS
Commissioner Gregory left the room during discussion of this matter.
Mr. Smith displayed a site plan for the commission to review. The
applicant showed the commission colored renderings of the
maintenance building.
Randy Case, applicant, was present and stated that they were before
the commission at their last meeting on April 27, 2004. At that time,
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they received some very good comments from the commissioners and
members of the public. We went back and Richard Denzer, architect,
revised the site plan. There was a lot of discussion about the previous
location for the maintenance building. We were asked to go back and
see if they could reconfigure the maintenance facility and put it closer
to the park. We went out and met with approximately 25 of the
residents, primarily the ones who live around the circumference of the
where the maintenance facility will be. We recognize that you'll hear
that there are still issues with respect to the access point. I want to
remind everybody that this is an access point with a 20' easement that
the golf course has had since it's conception 40 years ago. The
maintenance facility was originally located there. We're taking into
consideration that there will be vehicles coming through that access
point. We're going to construct an 8' decorative wall next to the house
on the corner to help alleviate noise and light. This facility is built to
accommodate the maintenance equipment, as well as the staff and
their vehicles. Currently, the facility is inadequate in size and it's run
down. Part of the reason why the golf course isn't being adequately
maintained is because they don't have equipment to do it or a place to
store equipment. The proposed facility is large enough. It's on the
small side of large enough for 27 holes but we believe it is adequate.
We've taken great pains to revise the plans so that they're acceptable.
The original plans showed an 19'6" roof height and now it starts at 12'
along the front side and transitions up to 16'. The maximum height has
been reduced by at least 3'6". We enlisted Ron Gregory and
Associates as our landscape architect. We enlisted them to do a
landscape plan that wasn't the wall of trees that we had before. We've
bermed the area and transitioned it into a natural golf course
topography. It's bermed and shaped like a golf course normally is
around greens, tees and sand traps. We certainly feel like this plan is
an improvement based on the recommendations of the commission
and recommendations from the people who live around it. We think
that this plan is adequate to house the maintenance facility.
Richard Denzer stated that the landscape plan says it all. The building
is about the same as it was the last time, but it now has a shed roof.
It's a low-slung, simple building buried in landscaping. A desert color
will be used on the building. The idea behind any maintenance facility
for a golf course is to make it disappear in the landscape.
Rob Parker, representative for RGA & Associates, was present and
stated that the landscape concept for this, as opposed to the wall of
trees that were previously proposed, is consistent with more of a golf
course feeling. There is a mound height of approximately six feet,
however, we would like to undulate that mound, especially on the golf
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course side of the project, so that it blends with the golf course
landscaping and doesn't feel as if we're trying to hide something. It is
directly adjacent to the cart path and it is our intent to take the turf line
and continue it up the side of the mound and to use a more open
canopy of trees to soften the view of the building, but not to totally block
it out. Flowering plant material will be added in front of the mound so
that from the homes, there are no longer homes down the fairway that
are blocked.
Commissioner Lopez asked about the restrooms. Mr. Case stated that
they will refurbish the restroom. Commissioner Lopez asked about
access to the bathroom from the golf course. Mr. Parker stated that the
access goes across the surface road. Commissioner Lopez asked if
the cart path would swing around behind the tee boxes. Mr. Drell
suggested that people could walk to the restrooms. Commissioner
Lopez commented that he's played golf all of his life on college and
high school golf teams so he's done this a lot and has had to dodge
maintenance vehicles. You can walk, but it's not the best solution. It
looks like it wasn't thought of. The restrooms are just over there and
you have to get over there some how. Will there be signage, because
it looks like it's hidden? Mr. Drell stated that there should definitely be
a path to the restrooms. Mr. Case stated that it's not really hidden and
the golfers will be able to see it. There will be signage, if need be.
Commissioner Van Vliet wanted to know about screening on the park
side and wondered if there was enough room for landscaping. Mr.
Parker stated that they intend to add a berm against the retaining wall.
Commissioner Hanson commented that this is a major improvement.
Commissioner Vuksic stated that the applicant did a good job taking
the previous comments and incorporated them into the revisions. They
came up with a great solution and tucked the building to the side.
Charlie Ash, Palm Desert Country Club resident, was present and
stated that a benefit to this is that there's a chain-link fence that was
put up by the association and the golf course back in 1995 and it runs
along the back side of the park. The kids are cutting holes in the fence
and are going out onto the golf course through the park area. The new
maintenance facility will eliminate that problem.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked if there are any members from the
audience who would like to speak. Barbara Coltwhite, resident, was
present and stated that she lives on the other side of the lake off of
Michigan. She asked about the type of security lighting that would be
used at night. Mr. Denzer stated that there will be ground lighting that's
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all pointing down. The lighting will be very, very minimal. Mr. Drell
stated that the trespass beyond the edge of the building can't exceed a
quarter of a foot candle.
Theresa Pawley, PDCC resident, was present and stated that she's the
second house on California next to the access road. I'm going to
speak for Bob Peterson, Mrs. Curry, Jack Becker an.d myself. Most of
us met with Randy Case the other day when he came out. Visually, the
proposed plans are definitely an improvement, but in our minds vision
isn't the only product. I think we all concur that we would prefer to have
the eleven homes that they're building on the existing maintenance
facility beside us as neighbors, rather than the maintenance facility and
all the noise that goes along with it. We've had absolutely no
notification. All of the impacted residents around this whole area have
had no notification whatsoever from the development group. Mr. Case
committed two weeks ago, on the 29th, that he would send out letters
alerting people as to what the plan was. We're still waiting for
information that hasn't gone out yet. We're still concerned about both
Michigan and California on the golf course side. There will be a
complete loss of privacy. I can't imagine myself sitting out on the patio
with 18 greens keepers coming and going. I don't think this is going to
work for me. Noise is still a major problem. The vehicles would arrive
between 4:30 a.m. and 5:00 a.m. I did go by and visit with some of the
other maintenance facilities. It's not only the worker's vehicles the first
thing in the morning, but it's the mowers and all of the equipment. One
of the Waste Management containers that I looked at is 24' long and
12' wide and a truck comes in from the access to dump that. It has to
be a huge, huge truck to dump a container of this size. Access
continues to be an issue. Storage equipment, negative impact on
property values and peaceful enjoyment of our property are all issues.
Access continues to be the greatest concern. The approximately 17'
wide access will be 5' from the Peterson's bed. My understanding is
that the trucks can go by on the access road at 5' from their house. No
wall can successfully soundproof against grounds keeper's cars,
maintenance equipment and Waste Management disposal trucks. Can
the main and only entrance to a 27-hole golf course be in this one
specific area? One thing that Mr. Case and I have talked about is
possibly bring in an entrance through the parking lot behind the Palm
Desert Country Club pool area. Mr. Ash commented that if they intend
to go through the rose garden, that will never, ever "fly". Ms. Pawley
stated that it would go around the rose garden. Mr. Case stated that he
would look at the access, work with the City and the homeowners and if
there's a reasonable plan, he's absolutely in favor of doing that. Mr.
Ash commented on the trash dumpsters. The dumpsters they bring in
have a single unit on the back of the truck. They just lower it down onto
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the ground, pull around and hook on and pull the other one up. They
don't dump those and it's just a normal size trash truck. That's all there
is. I watch them do it all the time. Commissioner Vuksic asked how it
was different then the Waste Management trucks that go all over the
city early in the morning. Mr. Case said that they're up and down
California all the time and it's not any different. Ms. Pawley stated that
in closing, cities do not allow contractors to begin activity before 7 a.m.
They do not wish to disturb local residents prior to that hour, even
temporarily for days, weeks or months. It doesn't seem congruent that
a city would allow pre-existing residents to be bombarded with
intolerable noise vibration commotion beginning at 4:30 a.m. everyday
for the life of that property. Please do no approve the maintenance
facility without allowing time to resolve the important remaining issues
including access.
Commissioner Van Vliet asked if any other members of the audience
wished to speak. No one came forward.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that the applicant has gone above
and beyond. They've done a great job of addressing the comments.
Whether the access is in the proposed location or on the other side, it's
approvable.
Commissioner Hanson stated that the responsibility of the commission
is for architecture and general design. Access points and noise issues
are handled by an entirely different group. I feel that the applicant has
done a very good job in locating the building in a way, visually. It
doesn't impact the neighbors and actually opened up some views. By
the work that they're proposing for the golf course changes in that
particular area, it'll actually enhance the property values in that location.
Commissioner Oppenheim stated that the proposed facility is a huge
improvement compared to the pictures of the current maintenance
facility.
Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Oppenheim for preliminary approval. Motion carried 6-0-1-0 with
Commissioner Gregory abstaining.
4. CASE NO.: PP/CUP 03-18
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS): FOUNTAINHEAD SHRUGGED, LLC,
1400 Quail Street, Suite 135, Newport Beach, CA 92660
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NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of revised plans for a Wendy's fast food restaurant with a drive-through.
LOCATION: 78-078 Country Club, northwest corner of Washington and
Country Club.
ZONE: C1
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by
Commissioner Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 7-
0.
5. CASE NO.: PP 03-23
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� GLASSTONE� INC.� 74-780 42nd
Avenue, Palm Desert, CA 92211
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
revised elevations for a new 19,867 square foot building.
LOCATION: 74-780 42"d Avenue
ZONE: SI
Mr. Smith stated that the plans have been revised since the
commission last reviewed them two weeks ago. The applicant was not
present.
Commissioner Hanson stated that it looks a little boring. I would like to
see the awning on the left added to the element to the right. It would
add some extra shaded parking. There was a question about the area
above the upper windows and also about materials. Commissioner
Gregory suggested adding some richness to the color of the building.
Commissioner Hanson stated that she wanted to see a roof plan and
specifics on the materials.
Commissioner Vuksic commented that the street elevation has a
composition that will work, but it needs another pass. The wall needs
to be thicker if they're going to have openings (nine windows). It needs
to be more substantial.
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Action: Commissioner Hanson moved, seconded by Commissioner
Lambell to continue the request to allow the applicant to be present and
to return with (1) roof plan, and (2) material/color board. Motion carried
7-0.
6. CASE NO.: PP 04-12
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� BRAVA DEVELOPMENT GROUP,
LLC, 73-081 Fred Waring Drive, Palm Desert, CA 92260
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Preliminary approval
of 38 triplex units (total of 114 units).
LOCATION: North side of Country Club, east of Monterey Avenue
between Merrano and Suncrest.
ZONE: PR-7
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by
Commissioner Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 7-
0.
7. CASE NO.: PP 04-11
APPLICANT (AND ADDRESS� RANCHO MIRAGE BUILDERS, INC.,
41-945 Boardwalk, Suite 4, Palm Desert, CA 92211
NATURE OF PROJECT/APPROVAL SOUGHT: Request for approval
of a precise plan of design for a 1,820 square foot office building and
street abandonment.
LOCATION: 44-875 San Jacinto Avenue.
ZONE: OP
Action: Commissioner Oppenheim moved, seconded by
Commissioner Vuksic for approval by minute motion. Motion carried 7-
0.
C. Miscellaneous Discussion
Mr. Bagato stated that Denny's is not on the agenda, but they want to
change their colors. The roof is currently light green and they would
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like it to be a darker green. Mr. Drell stated that the rest of the color
change would mainly involve the trim and windows. The commission
suggested adding this item to the next agenda.
VI. ADJOURNMENT
The meeting was adjourned at 2:15 p.m.
STEVE SMITH
PLANNING MANAGER
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