HomeMy WebLinkAbout2010-03-16 PC Regular Meeting Minutes ����-� MINUTES
PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION
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TUESDAY — MARCH 16, 2010
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Chair Limont requested a moment of silence in memory of former Councilman Walt
Snyder.
I. CALL TO ORDER
Chairperson Limont called the meeting to order at 6:00 p.m.
II. ROLL CALL
Members Present: Connor Limont, Chair
Mari Schmidt, Vice Chair
Sonia Campbell
Nancy DeLuna
Van Tanner
Members Absent: None
Staff Present: Lauri Aylaian, Director of Community Development
Dave Erwin, City Attorney �
Jill Tremblay, Assistant City Attorney
Tony Bagato, Principal Planner
Kevin Swartz, Assistant Planner
Missy Grisa, Assistant Planner
Ryan Stendell, Senior Management Analyst
Mark Diercks, Transportation Engineer
Tonya Monroe, Administrative Secretary
III. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
Commissioner DeLuna led in the pledge of allegiance.
IV. SUMMARY OF COUNCIL ACTION
Ms. Aylaian summarized pertinent March 11, 2010, meeting actions.
V. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
None.
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VI. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
Request for consideration of the February 16, 2010, meeting minutes.
Action:
It was moved by Commissioner Campbell, seconded by Commissioner
Schmidt, approving the February 16, 2010 meeting minutes. The motion
carried 5-0.
VII. CONSENT CALENDAR
None.
VIII. PUBLIC HEARINGS
Anyone who challenges any hearing matter in court may be limited to
raising only those issues he, she or someone else raised at the public
hearing described herein, or in written correspondence delivered to the
Planning Commission at, or prior to, the public hearing.
A. Case Nos. MP/PP 01-16 and TPM 30226 Amendment #2 — PALM
DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, Applicant
Request for approval of an amendment to Planning
Commission Resolution No. 2089 removing portions of
Department of Public Works Condition Nos. 3 and 9
referencing a proposed traffic signal at EI Paseo and
Painters Path requiring a $150,000 fee in lieu of
construction.
Assistant Planner Missy Grisa reviewed the staff report. She stated that
one person from the nearby Sandpiper development came in requesting
further information. When the request was explained, he agreed that a
traffic signal was not needed at that location. No other feedback was
received from the public notice. Staff recommended adoption of the
findings and the draft resolution approving Amendment #2 to Resolution
No. 2089.
Commissioner DeLuna noticed that it has not yet been ten years since it
was enacted. She asked if there was any reason they were doing it sooner
or if there was anything that prevented them from releasing the funds
early. Ms. Grisa indicated there was nothing that prevents it; part of the
condition said ten years and at the fourth and final building onsite. There
are already four buildings onsite. The one remaining pad is so small that it
was requested by the Redevelopment Agency for the return of these
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funds, and upon review by the Director of Public Works, he determined
that it wasn't necessary to continue holding these funds and they could be
returned at this time.
Chair Limont o�ened the public hearing and asked if anyone wished to
speak in FAVOR of or in OPPOSITION to the request. There was no
response and Chair Limont closed the public hearing.
Action:
It was moved by Commissioner Tanner, seconded by Commissioner
Campbell, approving the findings and recommendation as presented by
staff. Motion carried 5-0.
It was moved by Commissioner Tanner, seconded by Commissioner
Campbell, adopting Planning Commission ReSolution No. 2521, approving
MP/PP 01-16 and TPM 30226 Amendment #2 removing portions of
Department of Public Works Condition Nos. 3 and 9 as they pertain to a
proposed traffic signal and $150,000 in lieu of construction fee, subject to
conditions. Motion carried 5-0.
B. Case No. CUP 08-108 Revocation - CITY OF PALM DESERT,
Applicant
Request for revocation of an existing Conditional Use Permit
(CUP) for Anna's Health System, a massage therapy
establishment within an existing commercial suite located at
72-655 Highway 111, Suite B-7.
Assistant Planner Kevin Swartz reviewed the staff report and
recommended adoption of the draft resolution revoking CUP 08-108.
Chair Limont opened the public hearing and asked if anyone wished to
address the Commission in FAVOR of or in OPPOSITION to the proposed
revocation.
MR. TODD HILL, 20 Mission Court in Rancho Mirage, informed
Commission that he is a friend of the owner, Anna. He said that
Anna and his wife have been friends for about ten years. There are
a lot of different ways he has known her. He has known her to be a
religious lady, honest and dependable; all that goes with it. His
reason for being here number one was, going back to the beginning
of her business her credit was not good enough to sign a contract,
which he and his wife said they would do. Personally, he has lived
in the desert since 1967. He has run a business here in the desert
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going on 20-some years. If he felt in any way that this lady was not
an honest, upstanding, legitimate business-running person, no way
would he or his wife have ever taken the extra step to help her out.
He said he was nervous and he never expected to be here, but he
was happy to do it on her behalf because he believed in her.
Mr. Hill said he read the material that was mailed to them. He didn't
disagree with anything as far as the City of Palm Desert and their
standards and what they expect from someone conducting
business in Palm Desert. He totally agreed with it. That being said,
he thought Anna understood the severity of what was being
charged here. She actually worked for one day, or two or three
hours, at an establishment on Washington Street about two or three
years ago. She quit. She saw what was happening there and didn't
like it. She didn't know where to go. She has 750 hours of training.
She asked them if they would support her to open her own
business so that pretty much brought them up to date. The reason
she wanted to do this was because she didn't like what she saw
happening and thought she could have control of her business.
Basically, since she opened her business she has had four
• employees. The first employee lasted about two weeks and she
didn't trust her and didn't believe what she was doing was what
Anna wanted to be represented as; she was gone. She found a girl
that was very good, but she wanted to be closer to her family in Los
Angeles and since she didn't really want to leave Anna hanging,
she referred another girl. Anna was pretty cautious at this point.
She always had them sign disclaimers that they understood the
parameters and the legalities. For this particular one, Anna asked
him to go in two times and get a massage. The lady didn't know
who he was and he had never met her either. Two times she did
everything correctly, good massage, and he told Anna and Anna
said okay. This girl basically stayed for two years.
Mr. Hill said once a month the local Sheriff's Department and Mr.
Pedro Rodriguez from the City come in and inspect her premises.
They go through a checklist and recommend things that need to be
fixed, replaced or done correctly. The only thing she's had a
problem with is her sign-in register and after he talked to Mr.
Rodriguez he got it straight and printed up a master copy here of
what she should do. Her English isn't as good as it should be or
could be, but she tries to do the right thing.
On these monthly visits, it seemed, and he didn't want it taken the
wrong way, but it seemed to him that there was a particular sheriff
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who was a little aggressive. She seemed to be a little intimidating.
He actually got to look at the film of her speaking very loudly and
certainly intimidating. The reason he talked about the third girl was
because after being there for a year and a half or two, she quit
because this sheriff intimidated her. In her eyes she had done
nothing wrong and she didn't feel as though she should be treated
in that manner. Mr. Hill said he talked to Mr. Rodriguez about it and
he knew he was politically correct, although Anna says he is a good
man and he thought they built a good relationship. He asked him
what he should do and Mr. Rodriguez said he could call Lt. Shouse.
His feeling was that the way this lady spoke to these ladies was
uncalled for. You don't speak to anybody that way. He has had over
46 employees at one time and you don't talk to people the way he
heard this particular officer talking to her.
Mr. Hill said that once this lady quit because she felt intimidated,
Anna didn't have any where to go. She went and talked to Claudia
at the office over here and Claudia indicated that there's a new
code that they have to have a California license, as well as a Palm
Desert license. Now she had one lady who has had a permit in
Palm Desert for two or three years. She called this lady to come in
and help her because she needed help, although truthfully she
wasn't making enough money to employ two people, so he wasn't
too sure about that. This was the lady who committed the issue and
he didn't think there was any dispute. He personally didn't know if �
she did or didn't, but if the officer said she did, she did it. His point
here, and he hoped there was some compassion in the City
Council, but she isn't a bad lady and he knew she wouldn't do this
sort of thing. And he knew the minute that phone call came to him
what it was and who it was and he knew it wasn't this lady.
One last thing he wanted to bring up was something he read here,
and this wasn't something he was really familiar with, but there is
one item and it is item number three, Municipal Code Section
5.87.100B and it says that, "It is unlawful for any person owning,
operating, or managing a massage establishment knowingly to
cause, allow, or permit in or about such an establishment any
agent, employee or any other person under his control or
supervision to permit acts in violation of Chapter 5.90, including,
specifically, Section 5.90.140..." What he got out of that was
knowingly. Had she known this girl was up to something, she
wouldn't have existed; she wouldn't have been there. He knew
Anna that well and he thought there was a track record there with a
previous employee. He asked that they take that into consideration.
She is very aware of the severity of this, but he was here to tell
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them that she is an honest person and she doesn't perform that
kind of service for anybody.
Chair Limont thanked him. She asked if anyone else would like to speak
in FAVOR of or in OPPOSITION to the proposed revocation. There was
no one. The public hearing was closed and Chair Limont asked for
Commission comments.
Commissioner DeLuna noted that there was a two-year summary of
activities list from the Police Department. One resulted in an arrest for
prostitution. On two other occasions there were solicitations for sex; on
two different occasions there were daily logs that were not brought up to
speed. So there had been five different violations. She said that it was a
hard decision to make, but she would move for revocation of the CUP.
Action:
It was moved by Commissioner DeLuna, seconded by Commissioner
Campbell, approving the findings and recommendation as presented by
staff to revoke CUP 08-108. Motion carried 5-0.
It was moved by Commissioner DeLuna, seconded by Commissioner
Campbell, adopting Planning Commission Resolution No. 2522, revoking
CUP 08-108. Motion carried 5-0.
C. Case No. ZOA 10-41 — CITY OF PALM DESERT, Applicant
Request for approval of a recommendation to the City
Council of an amendment to the Hillside Planned Residential
(HPR) zone relating to definitions / development of "rock
outcroppings," and amendments to the HPR Zone Approved
Ridgeline Map.
Sr. Management Analyst Ryan Stendell reviewed the staff report and
recommended that the Planning Commission approve the resolution
recommending approval of the Zoning Ordinance Amendment to the City
Council.
Commissioner DeLuna noted that a map was provided with some
proposed changes, some of which no longer include certain areas from
the ridgeline or outcropping definition. She asked who prepared that map
and if there was a study, engineers hired, or if it was done by City staff.
Mr. Stendell said that he and the GIS Department made the determination.
It was mostly visual. He simply scouted the area and used topography
data that they have available to the City. He could run through a few of his
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tools. He showed the topography map and a hill shade file; he explained
that the GIS Department prepares this and this was created using
topography data and using a monochrome computer generation to
actually create contours and shows us in plan view what is going on in the
hillsides. So utilizing all of the data that is available to staff, it was
prepared by staff. For the record, Commissioner DeLuna requested that
Mr. Stendell identify the term GIS. Mr. Stendell clarified that it stands for
Geographic Information Systems, the map guys.
On these rock outcroppings, with all the developers they have had on the
hillsides and also individual land owners, Commissioner Campbell asked
how many of them have really touched these outcroppings. Didn't they
kind of stay away from them and leave them as they are or restore it to
their own original condition? Mr. Stendell said his personal experience
with the hillside has been any number of developers approach things in
different ways, but his experiences have generally been that they work
with the contour o# the land and typically try and avoid them. In his most
recent case, not only was it a cost savings to them since taking down an
outcropping costs a lot of money, but it also adds beauty to their project.
Typically speaking, a developer tries to work with the contours and not
disturb as much as possible, but that has been his dealings so far.
Commissioner Campbell asked if he would say 75% or 80% are not
touched by the developers. Mr. Stendell said he was uncomfortable
actually trying to throw out a number. In his most recent case, they had a
number of 80% to 90% that were not being touched.
Commissioner Tanner had a question. When they were talking about the
outcroppings and disturbing an outccopping, before any kind of
disturbance occurs, they will come to staff and say they have identified
this as an outcropping and can they reestablish it someplace else on the
property and if not, they would work around it. Was that the sequence of
events? Mr. Stendell said yes, staff is the first line. They encourage pre-
application meetings. If a property owner came to them and said they
have this five acres and was thinking about putting a house there, the first
thing staff does most of the time is they want to get a field study, so they
get up on the site and take a look. They get a look of their maps and plans
and then staff will approach them and say it is on top of an outcropping or
on a ridge, so ultimately staff is the first line. Commissioner Tanner said if
it is identified as an outcropping and can't be moved, then they will have to
redo. Mr. Stendell said that many times there are applications that come
before staff that Planning Commission would never see because if a
property owner was proposing something like that, they would get an
answer that staff would recommend denial of their project, and at that
point they would either redesign or proceed with staff's recommendation.
Commissioner Tanner asked if this would be consistent with the whole
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ridgeline or five-acre mountainous parcels. They see a small area right
now that Mr. Stendell has identified with some areas that should be
ridgelines. He asked if that would be consistent with the entire area for
potential builders. Mr. Stendell also recalled that they've had a lot of
lengthy discussions regarding where it is difficult to define ridgelines
versus outcroppings, especially as they get low on the hillsides close to
the valley floor. He said that is the area that probably has the biggest
challenge to staff, the lowest area right at the base. They do have other
areas that are low, but generally speaking, the part that is city-owned
property or were very steep coming down. He showed one of the lowest,
easiest slope areas that staff had been the most concerned about.
Commissioner Campbell asked if Mr. Stendell was just dealing with city-
owned hillside property. He didn't have anything to say about the county-
owned land. There was nothing he could say about that; he was just
talking about the small area that the city owns. Mr. Stendell said that the
County sometimes allowed the City to share comments on projects, but
the City has no jurisdiction over that area, just the land in the city.
Commissioner Schmidt asked what percentage on the map that Mr.
Stendell provided in their packets is ridgeline issue in the city. Is it most of
it or just a portion? Mr. Stendell said most of it. Commissioner Schmidt
asked since it is gray matter, if it is difficult to define them? The others are
more obvious? Mr. Stendell explained that they are brought to staff on a
case-by-case basis. Looking at the hillside map, this was the area that
they've been concerned with the most. To say that they wouldn't ever find
any more? Generally speaking, he couldn't find any other problem areas
on the hillside map.
Commissioner Schmidt was very much in favor of adding language about
rock outcroppings, but she had a deep concern about them approving staff
guesswork, good guesswork, but this had not been engineered. She
asked if that was correct. Mr. Stendell concurred. Commissioner Schmidt
thought that perhaps this was a standalone issue and shouldn't be tagged
onto the outcropping issue. She didn't know quite how to come to that, but
really did wish the City would take this particular problem area, and maybe
that would be the recommendation to Council, to approve a survey, a real
bona fide survey of those questionable areas so they don't encounter what
they did with Stone Eagle. Because the very first problem they
encountered was about ridgelines and that was nice, except it didn't
address the real transgression on the property, which was one home or
six. So she wanted to mention it as a concern. She wanted the
outcroppings to appear, but she didn't like setting staff up even though
they've taken great pains to draw the lines, and she would love to have
some authority who has the background and licensing to do it to bless it
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and say this is right, this is wrong. We need to do more work and she
didn't know how best to get to that.
Commissioner Campbell recommended that they actually separate the
two. Commissioner Schmidt asked if that would be two separate
resolutions. Commissioner Campbell concurred, for the ridge and for the
outcroppings. So they could go ahead and see how much time they would
need. Chairperson Limont asked if it would be alright to simply add the
verbal changes to the hillside ordinance without the map. Mr. Erwin said
certainly; so far as the outcroppings were concerned, they are entitled to
recommend the changes to the ordinance, and adding the outcroppings
and the prohibition on the outcroppings and excluding from that the map
and dealing with the map separately if they wished to do so.
Commissioner Schmidt asked if amending the resolution would require it
coming back to them again. Mr. Erwin said no. Commissioner Schmidt
indicated they would be dropping the part in the resolution that deals with
the map, which she believed was Exhibit B. Mr. Erwin said they still have
the public hearing. Mr. Stendell said they would be deleting number three
relating to Exhibit B and the reference in the title to the ridgeline map.
Commissioner Schmidt thought they were all heading in the same
direction. She just didn't want them to hurry and have it come back to
haunt them. That was her main objective. She asked Mr. Erwin to explain
how they could do this. Mr. Erwin said that basically they would eliminate
that part of the resolution dealing with the map. In other words, not
recommending it and deleting the Hillside Planned Residential Zone as it
relates to the map.
Commissioner Schmidt said she would so move. Chair Limont asked if
that was her motion. Mr. Erwin indicated that they needed to open the
public hearing.
Chair Limont o�ened the public hearing and asked if anyone wished to
speak in FAVOR of or in OPPOSITION to the public hearing. There was
no response and Chair Limont closed the public hearing.
Mr. Erwin explained that the resolution would be amended by deleting off
of the title and amendments to the approved HPR zone ridgeline map. The
case number would stay the same. And deleting number three at the
bottom of the page, and deleting the map that is attached. Commissioner
Campbell asked if they would then have another resolution for the
outcroppings. Was that correct? Mr. Erwin said this would be the
resolution for the outcroppings. Commissioner Schmidt reiterated that
what they were doing was separating them. Mr. Erwin said that's what
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they would be approving, the resolution which defines outcroppings and
indicates that destruction of the outcropping is prohibited. What he stated
deletes from that resolution any reference to the ridgeline map. Chair
Limont asked if there was a motion.
Action:
It was moved by Commissioner Schmidt, seconded by Commissioner
Tanner, approving the findings. The motion carried 4-1 (Commissioner
Campbell voted no).
Mr. Erwin stated that the other item that they mentioned was the potential
survey. He asked if they would want to convey to the Council a suggestion
with regard to the ridgeline map. If they wished to do that, it would be a
matter of inerely the Chairman of the Commission, if that was the wish of
the Commission, conveying that information to the City Council.
Chairperson Limont asked if they should do that as a Miscellaneous item
or as part of this. Mr. Erwin said this. Basically that has been the
discussion so far. He suggested a motion and second and a vote
requesting the Chairperson to convey that information to the Council.
It was moved by Commissioner Tanner, seconded by Commissioner
Schmidt, by minute motion, authorizing Chairperson Limont to convey to
the City Council a request for a survey by a licensed professional engineer
to identify ridgelines in the HPR zoned area.
Commissioner Schmidt stated that she did not want to discount the work
that Mr. Stendell and staff have done on this and encouraged them to
have that as a starting point. Mr. Erwin said that could be included in the
conveyance. Chairperson Limont called for the vote. The motion carried 5-
0.
(**See additional discussion on pages 18-19, items 1 and 3**)
D. Case No. ZOA 10-69 — CITY OF PALM DESERT, Applicant
Request for a recommendation to the City Council to
approve a Zoning Ordinance Amendment adding Chapter
25.130, Location of Miscellaneous Uses, to the Palm Desert
Municipal Code.
Assistant Planner Kevin Swartz reviewed the staff report. He noted a
change on Page 4 of the resolution under E, Miscellaneous Uses, where it
listed thrift stores. The words "thrift stores" should be replaced with
"independent massage establishments." Staff recommended that the
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Planning Commission recommend to the City Council approval of the
Zoning Ordinance Amendment adding Chapter 25.130 Location of
Miscellaneous Uses to the Palm Desert Municipal Code. Mr. Swartz
informed the Commission that staff also advertised this item to all the
businesses mentioned in this ordinance. They also handed out copies to
individuals at the counter, but only received one response in writing. That
response was before the Commission from Bert Bruning of Palm Desert
Tobacco. Mr. Bruning was recommending that the Commission add on
Page 4 under G under smoke shops the wording to the sentence half way
down the page that states, "A retail tobacco establishment is an
establishment that generates less than 50% of its gross revenue from the
sale of tobacco paraphernalia and generates more than 80% of its gross
revenue from the sale of tobacco products." Mr. Bruning wanted to add at
the end "excluding cigarettes." Mr. Swartz asked for any questions.
Commissioner Schmidt asked why they would exclude cigarettes. Mr.
Swartz said that in speaking with him on the phone, he sells higher end
tobacco and he was worried about an influx of lower-end tobacco cigarette
stores. Commissioner Campbell asked if he meant one like the
establishment in the Palms to Pines center. Mr. Swartz said yes, he was
worried about an influx of stores such as that.
Commissioner DeLuna asked what it would take to add "excluding
cigarettes". Did they just add it in to anything they approved? Mr. Erwin
said they are permitted to add or delete anything that they wish when they
finally make a decision with regard to this resolution. They were absolutely
free to add it if they wished.
Chairperson Limont opened the public hearing and asked if anyone
wished to address the Commission in FAVOR of or in OPPOSITION to the
proposed Zoning Ordinance Amendment.
MR. BUDDY HAYNES, 73338 Highway 111, Suite 5, asked if the
existing tattoo shops on Highway 111 would be considered
grandfathered in, but if they were to move a year from now down
the road, would they still be permitted to stay on Highway 111 or
would they have to locate off of Highway 111.
Mr. Erwin said if he moved the location, it would have to be off of Highway
111.
Mr. Haynes asked if that was off of Highway 111 permanently.
Mr. Erwin said yes.
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Mr. Haynes didn't agree with the change. He couldn't speak to the
other Miscellaneous Uses, but if he had a 99-year lease at his
present location versus a two-year lease, he didn't see what the
difference would be if he was to move two doors down or stay at
the same spot. With the economy fluctuating, if business gets
slower and he needs to downsize, he would still like to stay on
Highway 111. Or if business got better, he would like to move to a
bigger building. He recommended that those already on Highway
111 should be able to choose if they would like to leave where
they're at and still stay there, but at just a different address. He
wanted them to put in a compromise or addition to the ordinance.
MR. TROY LAWRENCE, 73-640 Highway 111, said he wasn't
there to dispute anything, he was there to commend them for
hearing them out initially and letting them speak their piece when
this came out. The City was able to listen to what they had to say
and make recommendations, listen to their advice. He did agree
with it and there was only one thing to add and it didn't have
anything to do with his business. There was another business they
might want to consider to try to monitor and it was right next to him
and it had to do with adult toys and stuff like that. He knew that
wasn't in there, but he was willing to bet that was something that
might come up, so it something they might want to try to spearhead
before they start having some of those start popping up down the
street. Once they have this ordinance, and he wasn't sure there
was anything to control that, but once they see they are set in stone
where they're at, someone might get an idea to start working their
way down Highway 111 and then they would be right back here
with that issue. He commended them again for letting them take
care of business and that's why they live and work in this city.
Commissioner Tanner asked what type of business he was referring to
next to his establishment.
Mr. Lawrence said it is called Skitzo Kitty; it's adult things.
Mr. Bagato indicated that there is an existing city ordinance that deals with
adult entertainment. When that business was initially approved, it was
supposed to be mainly a lingerie store. If they have expanded that beyond
the realm of what they would define as lingerie, they could look into it.
Adult book stores are currently not allowed on Highway 111.
Mr. Lawrence said it seemed to be fairly decent; however, he just
wanted to bring it up to make sure it didn't get out of control.
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Commissioner Tanner asked for confirmation that it is addressed in an
existing ordinance. Mr. Bagato said that was correct. Locations are
supposed to be in industrial areas like Cook Street or off of Dinah Shore.
Staff would look into it.
Commissioner Campbell asked Mr. Lawrence if he was happy to be
grandfathered in.
Mr. Lawrence replied extremely happy.
Commissioner Campbell asked if he owned the building or if he was
renting or leasing.
Mr. Lawrence said he was leasing right now.
Commissioner Campbell asked if his landlord knew he couldn't move
anywhere else because it wouldn't be allowed on Highway 111 and his
rent went up, what he would do then.
Mr. Lawrence said it was controlled by a management company
and he knew there were stipulations and laws that they aren't
allowed to do that. He has known the gentleman, Mr. Otto Lupia, for
15 years and he didn't think he would take advantage.
Commissioner Campbell said that was just him. What about the other
tattoo owners? They may have that possibility where they are caught like
that and can't move anywhere else.
Mr. Lawrence couldn't speak for the others, but concurred.
MR. JAMES LIVINGSTON, 73338 Highway 111, Suite 5, said he is
co-owner of Inksanity Tattoo. He wanted to address what Mr.
Haynes said earlier as far this being grandfathered in. If his lease is
up within two years, he would like the option to move two doors
down or a street down on Highway 111. Another issue was they
were excluding permanent cosmetics. Permanent cosmetics were
no different from what he does. It's the same thing. They break the
surface of the skin just as much as he does. They use the same
needles; the machines might be different. By excluding them, the
tattoo industry, they needed to involve permanent cosmetics also
with them. He wanted to bring that to everybody's attention; it had
not been mentioned. To move them and not letting him be able to
open a business within five years down the road if his lease is up,
that should apply to them too. He said about 38% to 40% is tourist
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business from out of town. They come from Lake Elsinore, Moreno
Valley, and Orange County.
There was no one else wishing to speak and Chairperson Limont closed
the public hearing.
Commissioner Tanner knew they talked about tattoos and permanent
makeup; he asked if there was any distinction between them. It clearly
was similar. Mr. Bagato stated that according to the State and Riverside
County Health and Safety there is no difference. They talked about from a
Health Department view there is no difference. But staff was asked to look
at the impact in terms of a resort community in the commercial core and a
concentration of them in one area. They didn't treat them with beauty
salons because they weren't looking at them from a health and safety
standpoint, but from land uses that are compatible in a resort community
for visual character along the commercial core when the concern was first
brought up. That's why they separated the two. But by the Health and
Safety Code, they are completely the same.
Commissioner Campbell's recommendation was that they leave
everything as is. She didn't think by removing the tattoo parlors and the
tobacco shops on Highway 111 that it was going to make Highway 111
look any better. It needed a complete revamp and to leave them as it is,
and when they have other applications, go ahead and have a conditional
use permit that would come in front of the Planning Commission to
approve or not approve them. Commissioner Tanner asked if that was a
motion. Commissioner Campbell said yes.
Action:
It was moved by Commissioner Campbell, seconded by Commissioner
Tanner, to keep the current ordinance and have the applications come
before the Planning Commission with a conditional use permit.
Commissioner DeLuna asked if there was anything they had talked about
that would limit their vicinity to schools, parks, or churches. Commissioner
Campbell explained that would come with the conditional use permit when
it comes before them. Commissioner DeLuna thought they decided at the
last meeting that requiring a CUP for this type of business was not the
best solution. They already decided that. Commissioner Campbell
explained that it hadn't been voted on yet. Commissioner DeLuna
indicated that it was in the staff report. And they asked staff to analyze
other land use compatibility requirements. Commissioner Campbell said
that was true.
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16, 2010
Commissioner Schmidt asked for clarification. Commissioner Campbell
said her motion was to leave everything as it is and have any application
come before the Planning Commission for consideration where they could
approve a conditional use permit or deny it.
Commissioner DeLuna asked if she was asking them to deny what staff
was recommending. Commissioner Campbell concurred. Commissioner
Schmidt reiterated that she was requesting them to do nothing. In relation
to how they would vote, Commissioner DeLuna asked if that meant they
vote no for staff's recommendation. Mr. Erwin pointed out that they were
talking about conditional use permits and there were no existing
conditional use permit requirements for these businesses.
Commissioner Campbell said they could go ahead and require a
conditional use permit for these services. Mr. Erwin said if that was the
desire of the Commission, staff would need to bring back to them an
additional recommendation to include these as conditional use permit
requirements in other zones.
Chairperson Limont requested clarification that Commissioner Campbell
was recommending that they deny staff's recommendation to change the
current ordinance and direct them to come back with a conditional use
permit requirement. Commissioner Campbell concurred.
Commissioner DeLuna asked if that was the motion that has been
seconded. Commissioner Tanner said that would be his second.
Commissioner DeLuna requested that they clarify one more time what
they were voting on. Mr. Erwin understood the motion to be made to deny
the staff recommendation; to instruct staff to bring it back to the Planning
Commission with the additional requirement of conditional use permits for
these businesses in other locations. Commissioner Campbell said that
was correct.
Commissioner Schmidt clarified that a yes vote would be in favor of denial.
Mr. Erwin concurred that a yes vote would be in favor of denying the staff
recommendation and instructing that they come back with something
additional to this ordinance that would impose conditional use permit
requirements on these businesses in other locations other than Highway
111 and EI Paseo. Commissioner DeLuna reiterated that a no vote
supports the staff recommendation. Mr. Erwin confirmed that a no vote
would support the City staff recommendation. Commissioner Schmidt said
they would have to take a separate action again on the resolution if
Commissioner Campbell's motion fails. Chairperson Limont concurred.
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16, 2010
Commissioner Tanner asked if there was still room for discussion.
Chairperson Limont said yes. Commissioner Tanner said his concern has
been aired twice here and that it is for local establishments on Highway
111 currently. The long-term leases or ownership property secures that
presence on Highway 111. His concern was for a short-term lease or an
owner just deciding at the conclusion of that lease that they no longer
want to have�this particular establishment in their building. They could say
no, they are not going to extend the lease. This denied an already
established performing business in the city of Palm Desert the opportunity
to continue that endeavor on Highway 111; that's where they want to be.
At the same time, he wanted it understood when adopting the requirement
for a new CUP that they suggest that there is no more room for these
particular types of establishments and that they not eliminate the
opportunity for established businesses to continue, either in a smaller
place or a larger place on Highway 111. Because the way he understood
it, once they are out of that one particular spot, they are no longer going to
be able to lease, even if they come to the Planning Commission because
a conditional use permit will say no more establishments of this type.
Mr. Erwin clarified that a conditional use permit wouldn't say that, this
ordinance says that regardless of a conditional use permit. If they wished
to put in the ordinance that they could move, then they would have to talk
in terms of same location, similar location and determine if they then are
required to comply with the other distance restrictions from other
operations; can they expand their business, etc.; a number of things.
Commissioner Tanner said he had a difficult time taking the ability of one
to make money away at the whim of a building owner or what have you.
Commissioner Campbell stated that her motion still stood to come to the
Planning Commission with a conditional use permit and Commissioner
Tanner had seconded the motion.
Commissioner DeLuna asked if in the worst case scenario what they were
talking about occurs, they are not precluded from doing business in
another location in the city, they are just precluded from being on Highway
111; Service Industrial zones or such other designated zones could still
accommodate the business, just not the location. Mr. Erwin said that was
correct.
Mr. Erwin asked for clarification that the conditional use permit as he
understood it would not apply on Highway 111 or EI Paseo, but would
apply in other zones within the city off of EI Paseo. He had the feeling that
perhaps they were talking about a relocation of one existing on Highway
111 and EI Paseo requiring a conditional use permit. He asked if that was
what he was hearing. Commissioner Campbell said that was correct. Mr.
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16, 2010
Erwin said that if an existing business on Highway 111 wants to relocate
to Highway 111, they go through a conditional use permit process. Both
Commissioners Campbell and Tanner concurred. Mr. Erwin said that
anyone who wished to locate on Cook Street or a place like that also
required a conditional use permit. Commissioners Campbell and Tanner
both concurred.
Commissioner Schmidt noted that her fear in requiring a conditional use
permit is that it runs with the land. It doesn't terminate when the end of a
lease terminates. Mr. Erwin said that was correct. Commissioner Schmidt
said that if the ownership changes, iYs still allowed. Mr. Erwin said that
was correct, unless they restrict that in their granting of the conditional use
permit. They do have the ability to do that, if they specify that it is for a
particular operator so that they make it so that it does not run with the
land. Without some restriction on it, it would run with the land and be
available for that location.
Commissioner DeLuna said that in that case, it could conceivably allow
someone to stay in that location with the same use and allow someone
relocating to start the same business in another location, so in effect they
would have two businesses? Mr. Erwin said no, it would not expand into
two businesses; it would still be just one business.
Chairperson Limont noted it would be comparable to how we treat stand
alone massage parlors. The CUP is to the owner, to the person operating
the business. Mr. Erwin said that was correct. Commissioner DeLuna
asked if it would then affect the owner of property, not the lessee. Mr.
Erwin said it may, he didn't know. Chairperson Limont said they could
condition it to the person leasing and it could go with their business
license. Mr. Erwin said that was correct.
Chairperson Limont noted there was a motion on the floor and called for
the vote. The motion failed 2-3 (Chairperson Limont, Commissioner
DeLuna and Commissioner Schmidt voted no).
Mr. Erwin advised Chairperson Limont to see if there was any other
motion the Commission wished to make.
It was moved by Commissioner DeLuna, seconded by Commissioner
Schmidt, approving the findings and recommendation as presented by
staff. Motion carried 3-2 (Commissioners Campbell and Tanner voted no).
It was moved by Commissioner DeLuna, seconded by Commissioner
Schmidt, adopting Planning Commission Resolution No. 2524,
recommending to the City Council approval of ZOA 10-69 adding Chapter
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16. 2010
25.130, Location of Miscellaneous Uses, to the Paim Desert Municipal
Code, as amended by changing the words "thrift stores" to "independent
massage establishments" in E of Section 25.130.020 Definitions and
adding the words "excluding cigarettes" to G of Section 25.130.020.
Motion carried 3-2 (Commissioners Campbell and Tanner voted no).
IX. MISCELLANEOUS
None.
X. COMMITTEE MEETING UPDATES
A. ART IN PUBLIC PLACES
Commissioner Campbell reported that the next meeting would be
March 17.
B. LANDSCAPE COMMITTEE
Chairperson Limont also reported that the next meeting would be
March 17.
C. PARKS & RECREATION
Commissioner Tanner stated that they had a presentation by the
City Attorney regarding the Brown Act and reviewed upcoming
events and discussion items.
D. PROJECT AREA 4 COMMITTEE
Commissioner Schmidt said they met last Monday and primarily it
was updating and the City Attorney spoke about the Brown Act and
the need for everyone to adhere to it. The next meeting would be in
a month.
XI. COMMENTS
1. Commissioner DeLuna said she apparently missed something
when they were discussing the definition of rock outcroppings and
that part of the motion that got bifurcated. She had something that
she wanted to include in the definition and missed the opportunity
because she didn't realize what the process that was occurring
would exclude any further discussion on the section of the rock
outcropping. She didn't know the proper forum to address that. Mr.
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16. 2010
Erwin said unfortunately, the public hearing on that issue was
closed here and an action had been taken. If there was something
that she wished to add, he suggested that she convey it in written
form to the City Council, which is where the Planning Commission
resolution would go so that she got that input into the process
there. Commissioner DeLuna asked if she should do that as a
private citizen. Mr. Erwin said yes.
Commissioner Tanner asked if Mr. Erwin wanted that put on the
agenda as a Miscellaneous item. Mr. Erwin said no, that will go
when this particular resolution goes to the City Council. It would be
joined with that and the Council will see that at the same time they
get the Planning Commission resolution recommendation, so it
goes together. Commissioner DeLuna asked if it should be in letter
form to the City Council. Mr. Erwin thought that would be better. Mr.
Erwin said she should make sure either Ms. Aylaian or Ms. Monroe
has it to go with the staff report.
2. Ms. Aylaian had a reminder about the Housing Tour on Thursday.
The flyer said 10:00 a.m., but she had been advised to be there at
9:45 a.m. and the bus would leave at 10:00 a.m. She asked them
to be here a little early. She also gave a reminder about the Joint
City Council and Planning Commission meeting on Wednesday at
4:00 p.m. Also, at this point they planned to have the next Planning
Commission meeting on April 6, but staff didn't have any items
scheduled for a second meeting in April.
Commissioner DeLuna asked if there would be a packet provided in
advance of the Joint City Council and Planning Commission
hearing. Ms. Aylaian said yes, the staff report was being completed
and staff planned to deliver them on Friday afternoon.
3. Before adjourning, Mr. Erwin indicated that staff advised that the
Planning Commission had not yet moved for approval of Resolution
2523, which is the one dealing with outcroppings. He said they did
need a motion, second and vote. Mr. Erwin explained that they
approved the findings, but they didn't make the second motion.
It was moved by Commissioner Schmidt, seconded by
Commissioner Tanner, adopting Planning Commission Resolution
No. 2523, recommending to City Council approval of ZOA 10-41,
amending the Hillside Planned Residential (HPR) zone relating to
definitions / development of "rock outcroppings." The motion carried
3-2 (Commissioners Campbell and DeLuna voted no).
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PALM DESERT PLANNING COMMISSION MARCH 16 2010
XII. ADJOURNMENT
It was moved by Commissioner Schmidt, seconded by Commissioner
Campbell, adjourning the meeting by minute motion. Motion carried 5-0.
The meeting was adjourned at 7:13 p.m.
�-�,� G___------
G " �-
LAURI AYLAIAN, Secretary
TT ST:
M. ONNOR LIMONT, Chair
Palm Desert Planning Commission
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