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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2002-06-05APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY WEDNESDAY, JUNE 5, 2002 8:30 A.M. ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICES CONFERENCE ROOM I. CALL TO ORDER Mayor/Chairman/Chairman Kelly convened the meeting at 8:34 a.m. II. ROLL CALL Present: Mayor Pro-TemporeNice Chair/Vice Chair Jean M. Benson Councilman/Member/Member Buford A. Crites Councilman/Member/Member Jim Ferguson Councilman/Member/Member Robert A. Spiegel Mayor/Chairman/Chairman Richard S. Kelly Also Present: Carlos L. Ortega, City Manager/RDA Executive Director Sheila R. Gilligan, ACM for Community Services/City Clerk Richard J. Folkers, ACM for Development Services Justin McCarthy, ACM for Redevelopment Homer Croy, Director of Building & Safety Phil Drell, Director of Community Development Paul S. Gibson, Director of Finance/City Treasurer Teresa L. La Rocca, Director of Housing Martin Pinon, Director of Human Resources David Yrigoyen, Director of Redevelopment Lt. Steve Thetford, Palm Desert Police Dept/Riverside County Sheriff's Department Chief Brad Harris, Western Desert Chief, Riverside County Fire Department Steve Aryan, Assistant to the City Manager Mike Errante, Engineering Manager Mark Greenwood, Engineering Manager J. Luis Espinoza, Finance Operations Manager Spencer Knight, Landscape Manager Martin Alvarez, Senior Management Analyst Rachelle D. Klassen, Deputy City Clerk III. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS None APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 IV. NEW BUSINESS A. CONSIDERATION OF THE PRELIMINARY CITY MANAGER'S FINANCIAL PLAN FOR FISCAL YEAR 2002/03. The following is a verbatim transcript of this portion of the City Council meeting: Key RSK Mayor/Chairman/Chairman Richard S. Kelly CLO Carlos L. Ortega, City Manager/RDA Executive Director RAS Councilman/Member/Member Robert A. Spiegel JF Councilman/Member/Member Jim Ferguson PSG Paul S. Gibson, Director of Finance/City Treasurer BAC Councilman/Member/Member Buford A. Crites JMB Mayor Pro-Tempore/Vice Chair/Vice Chair Jean M. Benson HC Homer Croy, Director of Building & Safety JM Justin McCarthy, ACM for Redevelopment TL Teresa LaRocca, Director of Housing RJF Richard J. Folkers, ACM for Development Services MG Mark Greenwood, Engineering Manager SRG Sheila R. Gilligan, ACM for Community Services/City Clerk RDK Rachelle D. Klassen, Deputy City Clerk ST Lt. Steve Thetford, Palm Desert Police Department/Riv Co Sheriff's Department BH Chief Brad Harris, Western Desert Chief, Riverside County Fire Department PD Phil Drell, Director of Community Development MP Martin Pinon, Director of Human Resources ME Mike Errante, Engineering Manager DY David Yrigoyen, Director of Redevelopment RSK The first on the Agenda is...the City Manager is going up to and comment, but I want to make one quick comment before we open it up. And that is, on page 29, it says, "During the budget process management cut over $3 million in expenditures in order to balance the budget." I just want to make it clear that we have not cut the budget. I don't know if there is any person here or not today, but we certainly have not cut the budget; in fact, as I was going through it, there are five additional employees proposed and two motorcycle policemen, and I'd call that a healthy...everything I see here is a healthy increase, in fact about a million and a half dollars increase in the budget this year over last year. So I want to 2 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 keep it clear that we all, in our comments about the budget, that there's no budget yet, and over last year there is a healthy increase proposed, that nobody uses that word "cut" the budget. With that, Mr. City Manager... CLO And that's what I was going to clarify. You should all have received this large booklet, the Preliminary Budget. You should also have received the White Papers in this black binder, and you should also have received an Agenda which contains an up-to-date budget. We were still working on it when this went to the printers, but you are correct in that both on the revenue side and on the expenditure side represents a little over 5% increase in both. We are recommending to you a revenue estimate of $35,240,000. I need to underscore that it is conservative. I asked Paul, particularly for this year, to be conservative, and then what we did is we started out with a preliminary budget and worked our way through it. As a result of further work, what we've done is added back some positions if the Council would approve it, and we've also provided for enhanced retirement benefits, there again if the Council were to approve it. The most significant areas of increase, of course, are the police, fire, and the proposed new personnel. The proposed budget also includes an increase in meeting compensation for the City Council. So, with that, I think we'll go ahead and have Paul give us a summary of where we are. There is still the pending State budget. As of right now, about the only thing that we know, the closest thing to being approved is a substantial chunk of money that the State wants to take from Redevelopment Agencies. But with regard to vehicle license fees and sales taxes, none of those have been finalized. I think when we look at the budget, we should keep that in mind. As we go through it, we need...we want to make the decision that even though we may approve some things, it would be with the provision that we don't implement them at least until the State has approved the budget and we know what they've decided for us. RAS Mr. Mayor....question. I still go back to the original question. This is a case of we cut the budget $3 million. What did we cut? (Inaudible) JF How can you avoid it? Everybody's going to read it, and they're going to say what did we cut? RAS (inaudible) what did you cut out of the budget that you wanted in the budget... JF Were these requests? 3 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO This is from the initial department requests. Essentially we had requests that exceeded some $37 million. It doesn't mean that we cut anything from the existing budget. In fact, as I pointed out to you, there is a proposed increase in the new budget from the existing approved budget. RAS So what kind of things were cut out that staff wanted? CLO Well... RSK I'd still rather use the term that...what kind of things are you not proposing that staff recommended? JF Well, the accurate way to say it is that you denied over $3 million in expenditures. CLO Well, this is going to be edited before it's finalized. There are a lot of things here that are going to change before it's finalized. (Inaudible) CLO The major cuts were not cuts at all. Basically, there were some departments that had counted expenditures twice, and we sat here and went through them, and they had been included two or three times, so that was not a cut at all. The other major item that we shifted, and if you look at the budget, our process has been to pay for capital improvements, and I'm talking mostly vehicles, large expensive street sweepers and that, from the current yearly budget, so what tends to happen is that in lean years, we really have to think hard about whether we need that equipment. What we did is instead, and as Paul explained, my recommendation is that every year we set up an equipment replacement reserve, and that way we always have money. So, in essence, we cut that out from the expenditure, but on the other hand, we're setting up the reserve. So those were the major areas where we, as staff, made cuts, if you will. RAS So there's nothing that would dramatically affect our City from what you said? CLO There's nothing that...basically, it calls for status quo. There are some increases, of course, in some of the things that the Council proposed we look at when we looked at the preliminary budget two months ago, and that is you wanted us to look at increasing the motorcycle cops. That is a big increase in there. So in essence, we're providing for increased current services. JF At the beginning of the budget year, you said for the first time in the history of the City we were going to adopt a zero -based budget approach. Did we do that? 4 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO In a way, we did, because in looking at all the requests, we talked about what is it that we have now, what is it that we're spending, and really scrutinized what the requests were for and whether they were justified, and simply whether at least for this year we could do away with it because as you know with the whole specter of whether we're going to have a good economy (inaudible). I know that some of the major revenue sources for the City, of course, like the TOT, have indicated to me that they made a pretty good recovery. But whether they've recovered everything that was down right after September, we really won't know until all the numbers are in. So in essence, we took the current budget and said okay, that's the zero base, and we have to really justify any increases. And in some areas, we scaled back so that we could reach the target revenue projections we had. Initially, we went below that, so that gave us confidence to come back and add some of the positions that department heads requested...initially that we had cut back, we added some of them back, and those are indicated. JF I guess my question is more...taking the Mayor's direction that we did not cut $3 million in funding, we simply denied $3 million in additional requested expenditures, yet overall we have a net 5% increase in services. I don't know that we've got any data yet that shows we've recovered from 9/11, since we're so heavily dependent on sales tax and TOT... RSK Do you have any data that we...that it has affected us... JF Could I finish before you start questioning. Secondly, we have a $22 billion deficit at the State level that the Majority leader has already said will not be covered by a tax increase, and the only funding source really is local government, whether it's VLF and sales tax. I don't know that we'll get hit on property tax. I was told yesterday there was a report out that they want a million dollars from Palm Desert's Redevelopment Agency. And so it seems to me that we have tremendous peril on the revenue side, yet we're producing a 5% increase in expenditures, supposedly on a zero -based budget. I guess I just need to reconcile those two conflicting (inaudible). CLO As I told you in the beginning, I told Paul to be particularly conservative on the revenue side, so it is already conservative. But if you look at the line items with individual revenues, some of them have projected no increases and some have projected increases if you look at the individual revenues. Now, the impact of the State budget, there is one, and we'll talk about it in more detail, we may be impacted on the Vehicle License Fee, but that's the only one that we know that is out there. The other ones, all the sales tax shifts, they're something that are no different from prior years, and we'll have a lot of discussion about that. I think 5 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 the one that is being discussed the most is the one that cuts our local sales tax by 15% and then tries to make it up on the property tax side, and that's one that we have already started to oppose because we just want them to leave the current system intact. With regards to the Redevelopment Agency, the proposal is that it be on a State-wide basis, there's about $74 million that the State is asking agencies to give back to what they call the ERAF, the Education Revenue Augmentation Fund, which the State uses to fund schools. For us, it means over a million dollars, and I think we've discussed it. Does it have an impact? I think it has more of an impact on our ability to fund things rather than an impact on the Agency. We will miss a million dollars, and that's cash, but when you look at the total revenues of the Agency, we're projecting an $8 million increase in total from one year to the other due to all the growth. So the fact that the State has the ability to take our money has more of an impact with the firms in New York that look at our bonding capacity, not to say that we're not going to be impacted initially. Yes, we're going to be impacted initially, but that's cash. When you look at our increase, our projected increase, and these are real increases because they're from property taxes, and they're from preliminary numbers that we get from the County. I think we can absorb it. Historically, the last time there was an ERAF shift, we had to send more than $2 million, I think, to the State, at a time when we had a lot lower base, and we came out okay. If the Vehicle License Fee gets shifted, some of it, I've already asked Paul to calculate how much that is, and relative to the whole budget, it's not a significant amount. Yes, we will have to take a look back at some of the positions and that's why have said specifically that even though you might approve in concept, they're really not approved until the State adopts its budget. RSK What's our carryover going to be for this year? PSG About $26 million, which I guess, worst case, once we get all the revenues in through August, the worst case is a negative million dollars net revenues versus expenditures. The best case is probably a break even, meaning... RSK Well, we have projects in this year's budget, which I know haven't been done, so there must be carryovers there. In my humble experience, I've never been involved in any budget like this that didn't have tremendous carryovers, and almost every year we take all the projects, and the organizations I've been affiliated with never have been able to accomplish an expenditure of the total projected budget. They just don't...there are too many unknowns that slow up the projects, and my experience is that you never have enough people to get it all done, and so it seems to me that we always have a large carryover that we don't really address. Some of the concerns that Councilmember Ferguson has I think 6 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 there ought to be also a concern about we're not able to spend the money that we budget here. JF Well, if I heard Paul correctly, he said under a worst case scenario, we're going to finish a million short; under a best case scenario, we're going to break even. RSK I don't believe it. I'd bet anything we're going to have a big carryover. We don't get the work done, I mean it's not done, there's got to be money we've budgeted that's not going to get spent. CLO A couple of things, Mayor....what we're talking about I think for the last 15 minutes was really the General Fund, okay, and as you know the General Fund, 60% is TOT and sales tax, and that goes for... RSK But you were talking Redevelopment too. CLO ....right. A lot of the....most of the expenditures, if you look at the total budget, the General Fund is $35 million. If you look at the total budget, it's over $100 million. So there's a lot of capital improvements that are not going to impacted by the budget; for example, all those things that are funded by Measure "A", all the funds that we have from development fees, reserves. So those, in and of themselves, are a big part of the budget, and we're carrying over a lot of money in those special funds. I think the one that has been of concern to staff here is, of course, the General Fund, and even with that fund, from June 30, 2002, the projected surplus in that that we have is about $26 million. And when you look at, to have that explained, we start out with a projected carryover at June 30th, we add the projected revenues, subtract the projected expenditures for this year, and then we wind up with a projected surplus at the end of June 30, 2003. And that's just for the General Fund. In addition, of course I agree with you that we have a big carryover in all the special funds and all the capital projects. What happens, however, and it's something that we're going to discuss, and we're going to discuss about maybe adopting some policies where we have developer fees for capital improvements...I know that we already do for Measure "A", the agreement with CVAG already allows you to do that...is to charge some of the personnel expenses to those capital improvement projects because what winds up happening, and if you look at the White Papers, a lot of those requests are for people to administer capital improvement funds, which we are budgeting out of the general revenue. So even though we may experience a decrease in general revenues, we still have a need for the personnel because we have a big capital improvement budget. I think that proves a point. 7 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK One last thing. On page 29, it goes through and talks about increases and decreases, so I think we'll have an opportunity to get a better answer to Bob's question of what decreases...what they are...when we get to page 29 in this book. RAS Okay, just a couple of little things before we get started. Page 21 is a Debt Summary for the Redevelopment Agency. As I understand it, under Debt Capacity, it says we have a legal debt margin of $967 million. Is that correct, Paul? PSG That's what the City could issue in debt. RAS Okay, and under Debt Outstanding, if you add the assessment districts and the Redevelopment Agency, that's about $290 million. Is that correct? PSG Yes, around that figure. RAS Does that mean that the difference of almost $700 is available? PSG Not necessarily. Our policy for the General Fund is not to issue any bonds from the General Fund. RAS I understand that. PSG So, technically, those bonds that were issued were either through an assessment district or through the Redevelopment Agency. With the Redevelopment Agency, you're limited to what the bond rating companies will allow you per tax dollar what they want you to have here in place of the debt service. (inaudible) every dollar you pay in debt service, they want $1.60 in tax increment. So that's what really (inaudible) what Redevelopment can issue. Those are the only two areas we issue bonds currently, so really we don't have that capability. RAS I'm not suggesting that we should... PSG We have about $50 million currently in RDA that we could issue once we get past the Western Center issues and that. RAS But how much of the $967 million minus the $290 million is available to the City for major Redevelopment projects? PSG Currently about $50 million. 8 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Okay. And my last question is on page 27. You indicated a few minutes ago that the best case scenario would be a break even on last year, and a worst case would be to lose a million dollars. Yet as I look at the projected revenue, projected revenue is $34,600,000 against a budget of $33,300,000. Now which figure do we want to look at? Have things changed since you did this or what? PSG The $34.5 million is probably reasonable still, realizing that the expenditure side...during the year we approved a number of increased costs above the $33 million that we had in expenditures. RAS This is an adjusted number. PSG The revenue is an adjusted number based on what, at the time in March/April, what we had per estimates. RAS But the adopted budget is not an adjusted number. PSG Correct, it is the original budget. RAS So what do you think (inaudible) adopted? What do you think, with all the stuff that was added on, all the adjustments that we made to the budget... PSG For revenues...the $34.5 I still stand at that number. RAS Okay JF Do you still stand by your earlier statement that the best we can do this year is break even? PSG That's my best guesstimate until we get through August when I receive another $5 million in revenues, it's still... JF A guesstimate. And, Mr. Mayor, I'm not trying to paint a doomsday scenario because I know we have ample reserves, I know we have Tots of money in special projects, but I look at a budget like a household budget, and you try and not spend more than you make in any one year, and in the history of the City, we have never spent more than we've taken in, and this year our Finance Director is saying the best we can do is break even, and that causes me to want to reconsider some of these new requests. So before we go through the requests, and I may seem a little negative on being receptive to them, it's only because I'm looking at our budget based on what happened this year. No, I don't (inaudible) 9 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 9/11 empirically, but I do know that this is probably the leanest budget year we've had in the history of the City, and it does cause me some concern. RSK I just want to make sure that we don't base a budget on something that might happen because it is only a budget, it's our plan, and if something that doesn't happen the way it was planned, we make adjustments, and we don't make adjustments before we find out what happens. JF Okay RSK And I don't think that we should cut services on the basis of something we think might happen because we can do that when it happens. JF Right. I agree with you completely. It's when we ask for new positions and new services that causes me to be a little more conservative. RSK Some of those are just keeping up with growth. Oh, can we start through the White Papers now? CLO The area of interest to all Department Heads every year is what is the workload and what are the number of personnel that I need to do that workload. And as pointed out before, when you look at the requests...and I need to underscore that, there again, even though it's not in here initially, the initial requests from the Department Heads were upwards of $800,000. Through the process of, really, going through a process of looking at whether we need that type of personnel or whether some projects can be done in ensuing years, we put that back to the existing recommendations. There again, I need to underscore that even though we are only projecting a 5% increase in the General Fund budget, when you look at our carryovers for streets and roads and major projects that still need to be managed, that is a substantial amount. (inaudible) talking about those particular projects. The major need for personnel continues to be our duty to administer special projects for Public works. Of course, as I projected three or four years ago, we are going to have before we wind up here in the next few years with a big Housing Authority with a lot of housing projects. And if you look at that, that is the majority of the requests. When you look at the amount or the positions being requested for reclassification, that is a minor amount. Even when we looked at the requested classifications, if you look at the justifications, we formulated a questionnaire that really asks, number one, why is the reclassification requested, what will not be done if this reclassification is not approved, and like I said, that has been gone through with a fine-toothed comb, and we only recommended those that we felt were justified. 10 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS Mr. Mayor, could we take it division by division? JUNE 5, 2002 RSK My idea is that we are going to go through here page by page, so each one of these White Pages...and Finance is the first one. PSG The first one is dealing with our Investment Manager. When Thomas was out at the State Capitol dealing with the bill last year, it was sort of an embarrassment that he was up there with the title of "Investment Manager" versus most of the positions up there would be considered a "Deputy Treasurer" or "Assistant Treasurer". In looking at...in fairness to him, we did a survey of all the cities out there, and basically there is no (inaudible) "Investment Managers" out there as far as titles go. He does act as my Deputy as far as his position goes. So that is where that request comes from. JF That's $1,300 a year? PSG Yes. It's a minor change as far as...he wants to be classified in the same area where other similar positions are. RSK Council comments? RAS Knowing that...the other two people that you want... RSK We'II take one at a time. RAS Okay RSK Does the Council concur with that? Okay, Council concurs with that. PSG Thank you. The next position is taking our person doing Business Licenses...we have two positions; one is a front counter, and the second one basically is dealing with any delinquent accounts, dealing with any issues that may come up with questions regarding the ordinance and regarding just operating Business License. I don't have the day-to-day time to be involved with the day-to-day operations. If there are any critical issues, he'll come to me, but otherwise, this individual is really overseeing Business License. I've looked within the Department, in fairness to this person here, to see where it fits organization -wise within my department. The Accounting Technician is required to have a little higher technician level and that, so I felt that this was justified similarly. There is less clerical involvement in this position than the front counter position, so (inaudible) 11 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Was that the one you had a question about? BAC If it is, we can come back to it. RSK So, hold that until it (inaudible) BAC Right, and then we can make comments (inaudible) RSK Sounds like you had a problem, and we were going to deal with it when he's not here. JF Well, my hunch is it's the next one that's a lot more money. RSK What, the $45,000 one? JF Yes, I think that might be... RSK Better hold it until he gets back. He didn't say anything to anybody about how soon he's going to be back? JF (inaudible) right there. JMB Here he is. RSK We think we may have hit the one here that you were asking questions about. RAS Oh, okay. Thank you. RSK (inaudible) the second one for... (Inaudible) JF $45,000 Systems Technician RAS Is that the Technician who's going to do the website? JF Which one did you have a problem with? RAS This one, the Information Systems Analyst. PSG Alright, we'll move on to that one. In the process...the current year, we are to the point where we want to move ahead with the department, move ahead where 12 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 Doug can have the time freed up so he can actually work on future projects, work on going through departments for what their needs are. Currently, at least 50°/0 of his time is devoted to dealing with fixes, be it the system in the computer room, individual PCs, or the Sheriff's Department, etc. Unfortunately, the new position created last year did not fix the problem. We did do a survey out there, and basically, if we are going to meet the standards of other cities with the number of PCs we have, the number of printers we have, etc., we will need two additional positions. But as far as what Doug had asked for, he said what I really need for is somebody who can work on the various computers in the computer room, make sure that they don't go down, that they don't get infected by viruses. In addition to that, the website we're developing right now is going to require people to upload information to that site to keep it up to date. Although they will maintain that site, we have to get it into form to bring it up to that site, and we don't feel that the staff throughout City Hall will be able to get it in the format that will be meeting their standards. So this position would also assist in that area. That's what we're recommending here. And hopefully it will also free Doug up with the time so that he can now develop (inaudible) develop in the future. If we don't, we'll never move ahead with this department (inaudible). JMB So are we asking for one or two? PSG One position...I requested two, but in the process we eliminated one. JMB (inaudible) fiscal impact of 1.5 doesn't apply. PSG Where is that? JMB On page 14-1. PSG That is correct. RAS Hopefully by this time next year, our website will include everything that's going on in the City for our residents, including Minutes and Agendas, etc., etc., etc. Who will be in charge of that? PSG Doug, and his people will assist him. RAS So he will make sure that this happens. PSG Yes...if we can free him up so he can be devoted to that, yes. If we don't, it's tough because (inaudible) 13 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Let me (inaudible) a little bit. If you take a look at Rancho Mirage, they've got a pretty good website except it's antiquated. If you go in and look for the Agendas and so on for various committees and commissions, they go back to December, which means nobody's been keeping them up. So it isn't worth anything, is it? Will this person make sure that everything is up to snuff? PSG With the help of each department. So, for example, the City Clerk will have to provide the Minutes so we can then upload them. The goal is for this person to assist in that area. RAS Okay, good. RSK Does everybody concur with that, then? JF Well, I was taking a slightly more cautious approach. We have a vendor that we're paying in excess of $100,000 to develop our e-government site who on a best case scenario estimates that the end of October will be the earliest that we have a website, which means probably by the time you get through the holidays and Christmas and January, you won't be actually be fully up, running, and functioning and needing this position. I'd rather do it as a mid -year budget adjustment based on the development of the site rather than simply authorize it now when I'm not sure whether or not it will be necessary. PSG I guess to (inaudible) if Carlos does hold these positions vacant until the State adopts its budget, which it looks like probably October or November at the earliest we could even start the process, and you go through the recruitment process, we're probably already starting in January as the earliest the position could be filled anyway. That's just my best guess. RSK Did that... JF That didn't change my mind. RSK Didn't change your mind. JF No. RSK So... JF I'd rather see us have a website first and then hire the person to maintain it because we've been working on our website for seven years. 14 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK So we have one non -concurrence on this one. JF On this one, yes. RSK Jean? JMB Okay. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Robert. 4-1 then. That takes care of the Finance Department, or did you want to talk some more? HC What I've done is I've been looking at the user fees... RSK Think we ought to let him sit at the table? HC What I've done is I've reviewed the user fees that we charge for plan review service and for inspection services, and our fees have been set 21 years ago and have not been adjusted for any cost of living or any cost of operations since that time. So according to the new laws, we cannot use the fees that are established in the Building Code any longer, nor can we compare ourselves to other cities. We have to use real fees, the operating costs for our organization. RSK (inaudible) problem with the Building & Safety Plan Review and Inspection Fee Study? RAS Just this carpet. RSK Well, we'll go down...the carpet is separate here, isn't it? HC Yes. RSK I think everybody concurs we need a building (inaudible) HC I've also (inaudible) RSK You don't....mainly with your department we're dealing with these items, not with any additional personnel, is that right? HC Correct RSK Well, let's just go down through these items, then, one by one, and (inaudible) everybody concurs we have to do a fee study. So that first one is (inaudible). 15 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 And the second one is Sound Meter Purchase, and I don't see how...anybody have a problem with Sound Meter? Now we get down to carpet. RAS I was being facetious, Mayor. RSK Anybody have a problem with the carpet? And Microfilm Cabinet...sounds like we need to modernize it. I take it we're going to modernize it. HC Yes, sir. Ergonomically (inaudible) RSK Keep control of the planning cabinets, that's the best way to keep (inaudible) modernize it. Anybody have a problem with the planning cabinet? Is that all you have? HC Yes, sir. RSK Thank you. HC Thank you, sir. RSK RDA. Are you at 80%? JM Yes, we are. We have a couple of initiatives that we'd like the City Council to consider. One is we would like to transfer the Facade Program from the Redevelopment Agency to the City's General Fund, primarily to be able to address the efficient delivery of the program and move the program out of the requirement under SB 975 that requires prevailing wage. By having this program under the City's General Fund, then we could go ahead and do the program without prevailing wage and have a more efficient allocation of both our money and the applicant's funds in that program. As part of that, we are also requesting some internal increases in the allocation of how much money we would use in the program in terms of our participation, increasing the maximum to $35,000. I think the current is approximately $25,000. We think this would accelerate the program and also open up the market for more users out there. We have made, also, adjustments to address the impact on the City's General Fund through an offset in interest and/or administrative costs. BAC Let me try asking a real simple question. Moving this over to the General Fund is revenue neutral? JM Correct. 16 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 BAC And the approximate number/percentage of dollars saved by doing it this way versus the other way. (Inaudible) JM It is revenue neutral to the General Fund. That is a true statement. We are increasing it internally in terms of the allocation of... RSK (inaudible) neutral in the General Fund. PSG Within the General Fund revenues, we've increased revenues from the Redevelopment reimbursing to the General Fund (inaudible) RSK We're able to do that? JF How can we do that? PSG Because the State law allows you to charge up to 12% for RDA interest rates. JF I know, but how can you take for public safety Redevelopment money which requires prevailing wage, pay for it through General Fund, and then repay the General Fund with money that was supposed to be used for prevailing wage? PSG We're not doing that. JM We've made adjustments in the allocation of costs for reimbursements from the Redevelopment Agency to assure that this is a revenue -neutral event to the General Fund. It is not a direct quid pro quo. It is an offset elsewhere, either in one, the interest rate that the Redevelopment Agency pays to the City's General Fund for funds that is borrowed or an offset in the internal administrative costs that are allocated to the Redevelopment Agency for administrative costs that the City provides to the Agency. JF Okay, so let's take a $35,000 facade enhancement. At the end of the day, when the paint's dry and all the transactions are done, you're saying there will not be one dollar taken out of the General Fund after all the financing is completed. It will be completely replenished by Redevelopment money? JM What I'm saying is that the City will take over the burden of this program, and the Agency has made adjustments elsewhere to ensure that there are offsets that make it a revenue -neutral event. 17 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK But you can make some adjustments anyway, and we'd have a larger General Fund, and we wouldn't have to (inaudible) JM (inaudible) understand the primary benefit here. I think the question was asked, "What does this do for the program or the applicant?" What happens under SB 975 is that not only is our participation required to be funded at a prevailing wage rate, also it taints the entire project. So is you have, let's say, a $100,000 project, and you increase that by 20-30% under prevailing wage, you in essence have a $130,000 project. RSK I think we all understand all of that. The thing we have a problem with is using the money out of the General Fund instead of RDA. And we all, I think, think the program is wonderful. I think we probably all agree with increasing the amount we would give. I think our problem is where the money is coming from. JMB If you don't transfer it, you'd have to pay the prevailing wage, and that's what...I think this came from a friend of mine that called and was doing a facade, and that caused the Redevelopment to look into it because he said by paying the prevailing wage, he couldn't get the job done, and he could have used the $20,000 extra that was in there on the facade and not on the prevailing wage. RSK We all agree with that. JMB I know, but it has to be in the General Fund and... RSK And we all understand that. RAS Do we have a legal opinion? JMB So what's the argument about (inaudible) RSK It's simply....you can transfer it, and then it's coming from the RDA. But according to the way you're doing it, you could do it anyway and use anything you wanted to in the General Fund. So really, it's coming straight out of the General Fund. And if we want to do that, hallelujah, but let's understand what we're doing. JF Well, but the other....l mean, no good deed goes unpunished. We're giving people free money to do a facade enhancement. State law says that you need to use lowest prevailing wage, which I think is 18-20%, and if they're doing $100,000, and they want $25,000 from us, I can see it may add to their cost. So if you increase the grant amount by 40%, which is what you're proposing, that 18 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 offsets any increase in lowest prevailing wage, and we can still do it entirely through the Redevelopment Agency. But to give them an increase and take it out of our General Fund, I agree with the Mayor, I think that's ridiculous. I mean, we're giving existing businesses that already operate in a very successful program, not that I'm wild about them, but Jerry Meintz has remodeled his wonderful El Mirasol, it's wonderful, it's a program that works, and if one guy or gal had an increased cost because of lowest prevailing wage and we increased the grant amount, it seems to me that addresses the problem, but to start taking money out of the General Fund, however revenue -neutral at the end of the day, makes me really nervous. CLO Sure. You've got two decisions you need to make. One is to keep the project under the Agency and merely increase the grant amount by $10,000. Or you can go with staff's recommendation. Or you can go with staff's recommendation and say but we do want to limit that to $25,000. I think that lowers the impact. What we tried to do here is keep the program, without increasing the cost, and make it revenue -neutral to the General Fund. That's what staff recommends. RAS Well, I personally have no problem with increasing it to $35,000 because I agree that it's a wonderful program that we have in the City. It's the only one in the Valley that I know of. I mean, it's all one pot. It's all our money, whether it's Redevelopment money, whether it's General Fund money, it's all our money. If we had a legal opinion as to whether or not there's an effect on taking Redevelopment dollars and putting them in the General Fund so we don't have to pay prevailing wage... CLO Well, let me explain it in a little more detail. This is not a direct reimbursement to the City for a project that the City is doing. RAS Yes or no....do we have a legal opinion? CLO Yes, we have. Many times when you have a Council meeting, there is a specific request for a reimbursement for a City expenditure. I think we do that a lot with the Fred Waring Drive project. Basically, it's a City project, the City spent the funds, and then there is a request to reimburse the City for that. This is not that at all. Basically what we're saying is the City is now undertaking this facade improvement project, okay, and because it's going to cost the City's General Fund an additional amount, there are other laws that allow the Agency to reimburse the City for loans, okay, and as Paul said, the policy has been that the City will pay...the Agency will pay the City whatever the City is getting in its own investments. But by law, it could be up to 12%, and here's where it's up to the City Council to determine how much you want to charge the Agency, okay? The 19 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 other is that, as you know, everybody that works for the Agency is a City employee. The law also allows the Agency to reimburse the City for the cost of that overhead. So what we're saying is by merely adjusting those, okay, we can give the City General Fund the money without making it a specifically direct reimbursement. I agree with you, if it was a specifically direct reimbursement, there would be (inaudible). What we've done here is we've... RAS If you don't have any problem with it, I guess I don't have any problem with it. RSK Regardless of our feelings about what we're doing, do you concur with...Councilman Crites, do you concur with the recommendations? I'm going to go through and... BAC Yep RAS Yes JMB Yes RSK So, I guess that's...I'm going to vote yes, but I want everybody to know I'm not fooled. RSK The next one — Creation of Alternative Design Concept JM From the Agency's perspective, we would like to kind of initiate a design effort to look at a way of, I guess, celebrating, acknowledging, and inviting people to shop on El Paseo. When you approach El Paseo, you have a couple of...from whatever avenues that you are approaching it....you've got kind of a hodgepodge of arrival signage, no signage, and really it's not until you actually pass across 74 and go into El Paseo and you see the distinctive architecture and the shops and everything and you kind of know that you've arrived at some place different. see this as possibly a collaborative effort that we'll work through the folks in Art In Public Places who are, I believe, looking at some design and identification signage (inaudible) City-wide program. One of the things that we would like to do at the Agency is go ahead and bring in a design consultant to look at El Paseo and say what are the things that we can do to create a central arrival...that you are indeed here, this is how you get here...over and above just a green placard/traffic sign somewhere on 111. So that's what we're requesting here. RSK Comments/questions? 20 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS From my standpoint, I think it makes good sense. I don't know what the answer is. I think when we get our Visitor Center open, that'll enhance the entrance to El Paseo, but two of our main streets (inaudible) and I don't know how we can get there any better than we're getting there, but if there is a way to make people go there and give them the opportunity to see it, it would be advantageous. RSK Any other comments? JMB I didn't see how much money was requested. RSK $45,000 BAC Maybe I didn't exactly...what are you going to use the $45,000...1 agree with Bob. I think we can do a better job of signage, but I have memories of obelisks and various things we did the last time we were going to do a signage program. Can't we sit down internally as staff and say yes we want to do something better (inaudible) use the $45,000 and actually do something. JM Well, I think we use the $45,000...you bring in a design consultant...I know you hate that idea, but (Inaudible....several people talking at once) BAC I have yet to see... JMB (inaudible) for a design consultant BAC I have yet to see a design consultant do anything but aggravate all of us and then go home with their money and never reappear. JMB We could bring out the other one we bought. BAC Yes, we've got a bunch of those (inaudible) we have a whole bunch of different things that we can do. JM Well, let me take a different tack here. Let's look at El Paseo for what it is. El Paseo is a... RSK (inaudible) we're convinced we need something. JM Oh, okay. 21 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK So don't sell it. You don't need to sell it. What you need to sell is that this $45,000 or whatever you do is going to buy us something to tell us what to do. BAC Versus some yahoo who's going to come and spend $45,000 to do something that we don't use and then they leave town. JM Well, I don't think this is going to be just a sort of a black box approach where you hire a design consultant, you get a product, and you go oh, we hate it. I think that has to be an interactive process in which you're working with your Architectural Committee, you're working with your other design committees or relevant committees, your retail committees, and very likely pulling in the El Paseo Committee and saying hey, what do we need to achieve here, to help us through a collaborative process go ahead and achieve it? But I do think you need somebody that, you know, let's say that after interacting with all those folks who can draw the pretty pictures and give you the design concept that you might want to entertain. I know I can't do that. JMB It would be my recommendation that we not put this forward until after we do El Paseo Entrada because that is going to create the gateway to one end of the City. And we don't even know how that is going to turn out (inaudible) it's taken three years to know that own the property let alone how it's going to go on. And that is supposed to be the entrance to El Paseo. If some consultant came in now and didn't know what that was going to look like, and we don't know what it's going to look like... RSK We'd have to pay him. JMB Yes...he'd be designing the other end of El Paseo...I think we need to wait until we finish the street, get the park in, which well might be the entrance to El Paseo, and nothing else will be needed except some enhancements along the way. So I would suggest that that be moved to the next year or until that project is finished. JF Well, my comment was going to be the same thing, only eliminate this in its entirety because we're paying the master architect for the Entrada del Paseo enough money that he can say what we do here we might want to do down here and have a uniform monument theme coming in, and it's already budgeted for, and there is already a committee in place doing it, and if RDA go out and hire somebody else to come up with a different theme is just a waste of money. RSK Mr. Crites 22 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 BAC My suggestion...comfortable with everything that's said...is that you do gather together some El Paseo merchants and those other different folks that you want to get together, see what they think is necessary, and then when you're ready to pass some recommendations (inaudible) this process and talk to the committee that's working on the Visitor Center and see if we can do something that globally enhances all the entrances all the way down to the other end of El Paseo and various spots and hold onto the existing process and if we need to appropriate at some point some money to help that happen to improve the facade of the entrance to El Paseo, we'll find some General Fund money and (inaudible) RSK Any additions, Bob? I think that one's dead. ?? Deferred RAS Okay PSG Next one for RDA is 3-4, Senior Management Analyst. RSK 3-4? Who's going to do that one? RAS How many people are you asking for, Terre, in total? TL For Housing, we're asking for two new positions (inaudible) we're asking...in the Housing area, we're asking for a Technician to assist with the coordination and distribution and applications and intake of applicants for both the Home Improvement Program and the Commercial Facade Improvement Program. That chore has become tremendous and overburdening for the staff person trying to implement the program to the extent that he's having to really work extensive hours to try and get the paperwork processed because of the fact that we have been receiving (inaudible) monies with the HIP program and trying to get the work done out in the field. So it's become a real burden for him in that respect. JF Carlos, you said earlier that RDA money can be used to pay for employees of the City to work on projects (inaudible) 20% housing set -aside? The bottom line is are Terre's positions paid for out of Redevelopment money or General Fund money? CLO They are paid out of Redevelopment. JF 100% out of Redevelopment. CLO 100% 23 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Well, go back here on page 3-73, we've got 5,031 applicants in the HIP program? TL Yes, we do. Bryce is handling the HIP program, and he undertook the Facade Improvement Program, and as you know, that took off like lightning. So the program is backed up. RAS So this would be someone working with Bryce. TL This would be (inaudible) to help him accomplish the paperwork and do the intake and (inaudible) documentation because we have to do credit checks, we have to do current employment checks, we've got all that and escrow type of documentation. RAS And the other one...what is the other person going to do? TL The next position would be the Senior Management Analyst position, and that would be...that position would allow our current Management Analyst... RAS Who is the current Management Analyst? TL Janet Moore is handling both Redevelopment and Housing, and there again, because of the monitoring and because of the (inaudible) trying to work with the Housing Authority properties and working very closely with the management companies... RAS She's over all of the apartments that we have. TL Yes. Once again, it's a huge burden on them, and she's doing double duty by handling Redevelopment and Housing.. RAS Is she going to be involved in the new apartments that we're building out by the soccer complex? She'll be involved in... TL That position will be involved with the Hovley Garden Apartments, certainly. JM Just a clarification... RSK Let's make sure....anybody have a problem with the Senior Management Analyst position? JF No 24 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB No RAS No BAC No RSK No one has a problem with that. Do you want to talk anyway? JM No, sir. RAS I don't think anybody has a problem with the second one, the request for... JMB I don't think we have... JF (inaudible) 20% set -aside mandatory and we don't have a choice... RSK Does everybody approve of those three Housing requests? TL Thank you RSK Okay, does that move us to... RAS Public Works RSK Public Works. JM Excuse me, you have two staffing issues under RDA also, two staff reclassifications under RDA. PSG I believe they were saying they're fine with those also. JM Okay, thank you. RSK Public Works CLO Public Works...you have equipment and vehicle purchases (inaudible) concerned about that. RSK Does anybody have a problem with the vehicle replacement? No problem with vehicle replacement. 25 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO And then we have what will eventually be everybody's favorite project, and that is the arrangement of parking at City Hall. You have a request from the Assistant City Manager for Development Services that we create a specific designated area to park all City vehicles, and it would be just north of the former electric vehicle parking area. I know we've also discussed issues of the current shaded parking and how that is used, how it's allocated, so it's all related to the same discussion. BAC Mr. Mayor... RSK Buford... BAC A suggestion....that you take whatever comments people have this morning, that you appoint two Councilmembers and appropriate staff folks to look at allocation and space use and so forth and all that kind of stuff. (Inaudible) BAC And I think it deserves a real....folks out there looking at, talking about, you know I think we all have concerns. RAS Yes, I have concerns because as the Magnesia Falls Bridge gets built, there'll be more and more traffic on San Pablo, and as you drive past our charging station, between our charging station and our skateboard park, we've got a used car lot. JF Right RAS And, in my opinion, it's not the way to use that. Maybe, if you have the ability with the additional space out at the Corporate Yard, to put some of our vehicles out there and use that as a place to go from rather than going from the City. And I certainly don't see that grassy area being utilized to excessive damage by a parking lot. RJF One of the problems we have, and I think this is excellent to have two Council people because we have some real parking deficiencies out here, and by utilizing that for parking, that would tend to not make it look like a used car lot. BAC A very good used car lot. JMB And I think the committee should also look at the million dollar structure that we so nicely approved that we waited for...so we'd have a place to park in the summer...but I have yet to find a place in there. And we didn't build it just 26 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 primarily for the employees, we did build it for everybody, and people coming to committees and commissions have to go to the back forty and have to walk over because the employees park out there ten hours a day, and I think that's great, but I also think it was meant for some public use as well, so there's got to be some places marked "Committee/Commissions" or whatever. BAC Or two-hour parking. JMB Two-hour or some such thing because I get nothing but complaints from people coming and telling me "I had to park clear over at the Y to go to your meeting and was ten minutes late." And then at five o'clock you go out, and the whole place is empty, and the Commissioners are walking clear back to the Y to get their cars, so we need to have it marked better. RSK Mr. Ferguson JF Well, it seems like everything we're talking about in here doesn't involve spending money, and I for one don't want to set aside $350,000 when it sounds like we have no clear direction as to what we want to do and maybe, again, we could put this committee together and come back with mid -year budget adjustments when we know what the State's going to do and we know what our revenues are. RSK Could I make...adjust that recommendation just a little bit on the basis of what Councilmember Benson....Mayor Pro Tem Benson said. I know there are two Councilmembers that don't want to put a yard between the skateboard park and City Hall, probably more than just two of us. I know we have problems, but that doesn't mean...there are lots of ways to deal with problems. But can we do the committees, two Councilmembers, but in the meantime set up some visitor parking under the shade here up near the building on both sides for all of those constituents who come in constantly to do business here at City Hall instead of having them park in the north forty? ?? How many? RSK Well, just some on both sides up front. Does everybody concur with that, concur with the committee and not put this in the budget yet until we decide what we're going to do? JMB (inaudible) BAC Well, yes, I mean (inaudible) 27 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK We may want to move some of the offices for the people that have big trucks out to the yard (inaudible) for the new building (inaudible). So everybody concurs with that. RAS Absolutely, and also I think we could even take a look at another permanent parking area. RSK Who would like to be on the committee? Bob, are you volunteering for the committee? Jim? So we have Bob and Jim working on that committee, and if other Councilmembers have ideas, we can give them input. CLO Mr. Mayor, I have a couple of questions. Is there a specified number of spaces that the Council would like to see for visitor parking, or are you leaving that to staff to figure out? BAC Why don't you make that the first item of your little...why don't you meet next week and stand out there and actually figure that out with your committee. Whatever you guys decide is great with me. RAS And in the meantime, would you take a look to see what could be moved out to the Corporate Yard? JF Mark, didn't you completely redo the Palm Desert High School parking lot in terms of deficiencies or at least made recommendations? Couldn't you sit down and do the same thing with our parking lot and see if we couldn't fix that in our parking lot? MG Yes, we can do that, we have that ability. RSK How are we filling our vehicles now, the ones that are natural gas? RJF We take them out to the (inaudible) facility. RSK So they don't come here and use ours at City Hall? RJF No, sir. That's deactivated. RSK Did we do that because SunLine just didn't want to come any more? RJF 1 think it was a mutual decision. The feeling was it was more efficient to have our people go out there instead of driving around to (inaudible) 28 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK It's all working okay, you're not losing a lot of time? RJF As far as we know, it's working well, yes, sir. RSK I noticed in this proposal that there was a slow -fill... RJF Yes, sir. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Since we're going to probably always have some natural gas vehicles here at the City Hall, would it pay to put a slow -fill...? RJF We still feel there is an advantage to having a slow -fill facility here. As the committee studies this, we can look at that. RSK They are more popular now, so this committee can look at whether we need a slow -fill here at the City. That takes us to Project Administrator. CLO This is a request from Public Works. RJF Unfortunately, Joe Gaugush is sitting on jury selection right now, so I've brought Mark and also Mike Errante. Anyhow, this is something that we have felt is necessary to continue to move programs along that we have. As you are aware, we've got quite a few programs going, and it's staff's feeling that to continue or to actually move a little faster on getting the various projects done, we need to have a Project Administrator. JF You currently pay $100,000 in consulting fees for this function? RJF Over that amount, sir. We picked up some of the stuff in-house. JF You estimate it's going to cost you $58,000 to hire somebody. RJF Well, plus benefits. JF I think that includes benefits. Oh, I'm sorry. I was looking at the Management Analyst. So we're saving about $28,500. RJF Right, plus the efficiency with having (inaudible) CLO Please also note that because some of these positions also work on RDA projects, only half of that will come from General Fund monies. The other will come as an additional reimbursement from the Agency. 29 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JF How do we get half? JUNE 5, 2002 CLO Well, what we have to do is every year we go through all the City personnel and actually allocate costs. All of those that do exclusively Redevelopment get charged 100%. People like me, City Clerk, some of the Assistant City Managers unfortunately are, I guess, charged to the Agency...we do half. RSK Everybody agree with that one? RJF The next one is the senior...the Management Analyst. When we had our reorganization in September, 2000... (Inaudible) RJF Oh, I'm sorry...the amount of workload has increased, as you are probably aware. We do service the Visitor Information Center and... RAS Did we not used to do that? RJF It's been an additional workload. RAS Did we ever consider contracting out for certain locations? RJF We considered it a few years ago, and it was felt that it would be better to have a staff person. RAS Because you've got the Corporate Yard you want to clean, you want to clean the Visitor Center, the new Visitor Center... RSK We used to contract out, and boy, that was really a pain in the neck. RAS I agree that (inaudible) here at City Hall is different. But I'm talking about someone that's going to go into the Corporate Yard once a week and clean it. RJF It's our feeling that the problems would outweigh the benefits, and it would still be better to have a staff person. RSK I agree with that. JMB I agree with that. 30 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK I think we have a majority here who want to keep our own janitors. JMB I agree they need help, so... RSK Anybody opposed to hiring a new janitor? Think about one thing, that's a person who's actually going to work. Not like the rest of us, you know, they wouldn't miss us if we weren't here, but if the janitor doesn't show up, man, you've got a problem. JMB (inaudible) all the rest of the people and make them work for the janitors. RAS If we don't show up, there won't be any janitors, will there? RSK It reduces the workload if we don't show up. Management Analyst... RJF Yes. In September 2000 when we reorganized, I took Tom Bassler, who was the Senior Management Analyst, with me. Now Martin Alvarez is working for me, and that position was pulled out of Public Works. With the workload that they have, it is our feeling there is a need for a Management Analyst who would be handling a lot of the items so Joe Gaugush can handle the more involved things. So it's...based on that, this person could be attending...he or she could be attending a lot of the different task forces through CVAG, PM-10....it's listed on page 4-6. There are just a lot of committees and assignments that Joe doesn't have to attend, but it's still (inaudible) having either Mark or Mike or Spencer have to go to those. So this person would be preparing reports and having administrative tasks. RSK Any comments or questions? RAS You would know more about this, Mr. Mayor, than I would. Is this person useful to you at RCTC? RSK Well, I've got a note here because a lot of these meetings that I am involved in...SunLine and RCTC and (inaudible) involved in with CVAG...but we never have anybody at SunLine, and Mark doesn't come to the regular RCTC meetings, but he serves as our TAC person. And we don't need another analyst unless they know as much as Mark does and has that respect there because when he goes there, he's competing for money, and not a little bit of money, sometimes a lot of money, sometimes a couple hundred thousand dollars or more at one crack. So we need somebody like Mark to go to the TAC Committee at RCTC. 31 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RJF Well, I think the intent is that Mark or these other people would go to the important meetings, but this person would be handling other meetings that would be in their prevue. RSK We all have to have backup for the meetings, but it seems like we need to take a good look at do we need people at the meetings. Sometimes we have meetings here, and half the people here will be on the committee, and half of them will be staff people. We need to really make sure we need as many people as we have (inaudible) Jim? JF You have down here that this person would be a "Dust Czar" for AQMD. What the heck does that mean? MG That's actually a term that AQMD came up with, "Dust Czar". Each city is to appoint one in order to control dust emanating from construction sites and whatnot. You know AQMD is very serious about our dust situation with PM-10. It's something that is taking up a tremendous amount of time now, it's a new job that is taking much more time than it used to, the meetings last half a day, and they occur quite frequently, a couple times a month. This position is not necessarily to attend these meetings and represent the City but to provide a support behind it to do all the paperwork and all the research that goes behind it so that when we do attend these, our interests are looked out for. RAS Would they be making sure that on new construction, the dust is under control? MG Well, we do have inspectors going out there right now, and they're trying to do their best, and it is a daily task, somebody who you can talk to one day and agree that everything is going to be fine tomorrow even though tomorrow is not fine, so...the actual control of the dust is something the inspectors are doing, and it takes quite a bit of time also. JF So this is just somebody who goes to the meetings and... RJF No, I think... RSK (inaudible) responsible, if you don't have any person that is responsible, the dust starts blowing. CLO Let me answer your question. If you look at all the organizations that we're involved with, starting with CVAG, we spend a lot of time at meetings. That's just the way, I guess, we do business, so a lot of time...there's a lot of meeting time, reading of Agendas, that's the way we're doing business lately. With 32 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 regards to the "Dust Czar", as you know, we are under a sanction, basically, that if we don't clean up our act, basically all development is going to stop. That's it. RSK Jean? JMB Why can't....just in light of what you just said and all the things that we've had with the dust, why can't some of this be paid by Redevelopment because most of the projects come out of there...Fred Waring is coming out of there, the dust is coming out of there, the Marriott...a lot of the ones that come under seems to me would be half RDA. RSK Would the golf course when we do it? JMB Yes. So why couldn't they pay half of that? CLO Well, when we look at the cost allocation and talk about a lot of those, we'll look at that and see how much we can justify. JMB Well, it would make it easier to get approved. CLO Well, we need to look at it that it's directly related to the administration of Agency projects. JMB Well, Fred Waring certainly is. RSK Very good point. CLO We can find a way...I don't know that you can justify 100%... JMB I didn't say 100%, but I don't see why 50% couldn't (inaudible) RSK Does everybody concur with that one? ?? No RSK No? RAS No RSK Jean... JMB Well, I concur with it, but I'd like to see it funded the other way. 33 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK I would be with Jean. I would approve it if it's funded properly, where the problems come from, so I guess we have a weak 3-2. We need something written up there to make us feel better about our yes vote there, Mr. City Manager. CLO And just to clarify, you know, with all of the projects that we (inaudible) with Measure A with CVAG, they allow us to charge the City's Project Manager and overhead. So if this person is doing that, it's something that we just add as a reimbursement item, part of it, because that's what this person is doing, really making sure that the dust is kept down (inaudible). RSK Okay BAC Mr. Mayor, I would concur with the fact that I think we ought to relook at this in terms of...to be honest, this is an area where most of us don't see what does and doesn't happen, somewhere inside rooms and this and that, and I'm operating on trust in Dick Folkers and the City Manager and so on on this one. And it almost sounds like we're hiring someone to go to unnecessary...some unnecessary meetings, to which there is another solution, which is to not have so many unnecessary meetings. So, somewhere there needs to be something written up both in terms of where the money is going to come from and in terms of what things will be the outcomes that we would see "on the street" for what this person will accomplish. What are the outcomes of this position, and I'd like to see that, too, before we get a final budget. RSK Can we leave this one hanging and see that before we make the final decision? RJF Absolutely. CLO You're not making a decision today. JF Yes, we are. RAS Yes, we are. PSG We've done that in the past (inaudible) RSK Yes, we are making a decision as far as you've got them approved so you can include them in the budget, but this one we haven't actually approved until we've seen a little more detail. Everybody concur with that? 34 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JMB Yes. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Okay, so that one's hanging. Is that it for Public Works? That takes us to Community Services. (Inaudible) SRG keep the programs going, especially in light of the (inaudible) RSK But the two positions, what's the Council's feeling about the two positions? RAS What is a floater? SRG That is an entry-level office position that will back up...right now we have no backup (inaudible) for the last year because we had both gals out on maternity leave, so we were bringing in temporary employees. This floating position would back up the switchboard, the mail, the Visitor Center, telephone coverage, City Council agenda preparation (we have one person doing that now, and two people really should be working on it and getting it out), backup for Special Events (everybody is pitching in and coming in for special events, this would give us some assistance in that area), and we have backup for Art In Public Places (inaudible)...we have one person doing it right now, and she also attends special events, does the Marketing, she also assists in Robert Kohn's area, so we haven't had an additional...we have not requested, although it says in two years, we really haven't had any requests for clerical in eight years. RSK Comments on the two positions. JF Two questions. We contract out with somebody to do our Minutes currently, and we also contract out with somebody to do the exhibit on El Paseo. SRG Correct JF Would the inclusion of these new positions and reclassification of these positions allow everything to come in-house, or would we still continue to contract out? SRG In Art, we would still contract out. We've had a recommendation for... JF I mean at the end of this current contract, are we going to renew it? SRG We would still probably contract out because it's just...in order to get the Minutes done by the Agenda deadline, there's not very much time, and this allows us to, in 35 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 a very expeditious way, get the Minutes to the City Council in the Agenda packets. JF I was talking about John Nagus. SRG John Nagus...we have a recommendation in our budget to promote our Senior Office Assistant to Public Art Technician. That would help us in (inaudible) our Art & Essay Contest, the Gallery, helping curate that exhibit, and that recommendation is coming forward, so I would say at the end of the year we will probably come back to you and ask you (inaudible) RSK Comments on the two positions. Approved, approved? Okay, the next one then...that takes care of those two...Contract Administrator reclassification. SRG (inaudible) in addition, we're bringing in a new Energy Management Program. We've taken on the After School program, anything to do with grants and After School. There are additional recycling programs that we're getting involved with. Mobilehome Rent Control continues to be part of our responsibility, franchises, environmental conservation programs, we're still doing the Community Gardens. Energy Management Program is the large one, especially in light of the fact that we are bringing in the Energy Coalition to start a new program, and that grant was approved by the way (inaudible) energy program for the City of Palm Desert. Mr. Kohn has been incredibly helpful over the period of time that he has been here in assuming responsibility when I'm not here (inaudible), for Art In Public Places when we lost our Art Director, he jumped in and kept the program running. He's assumed a lot of responsibility, and it also gives an additional person within the Division at a Director level...right now we only have one Director, and that is in Human Resources, and that pretty much (inaudible) PSG It's just basically Lisa Constande's old position that we never really filled. SRG (inaudible) expanded JF I see there's more, but we never filled her position, so even though it's a reclassification, it's filling an empty slot and then some. SRG Correct. The one thing that's not... RSK Anybody opposed? 36 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB I'm not opposed but seems to me there should be a better name than Special Programs. SRG Well, I came up with one...if you see the memo...my memo dated May 19th, Director of Special Programs. JMB Well, that's what I said. SRG Well, I think we had it as Programs and Communications, but... JMB Well, you requested Director of Special Programs. SRG That's what we are requesting that we name it. JMB And my comment is, to me, it's Special Programs, but we also have other people doing Special Programs. RSK It's a little confusing. SRG We'll work on that, but it won't be Communications. RSK Okay, that was approved. Anybody have a problem with the City Clerk? SRG I did want to say one thing. I've been with the City 27 years today, and I have absolute confidence in turning over the City Clerk's job to Rachelle. She knows the job inside and out... RSK Me, too. No argument. I think we're unanimous. I think we all enjoy working with Rachelle already, and we look forward to it. RDK (inaudible) RSK Okay, next is the Art Coordinator. SRG This is taking a position that we brought in, another intern, last year. The workload in Art in Public Places is tremendous, and this gal has (inaudible) she has assumed incredible responsibility; she has brought in new programs. Losing her would be a tremendous loss. She works with the developers in coordinating whatever is going to go out in... RSK Basically, she's going to keep doing what she's doing, we're just making it permanent. 37 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY SRG Exactly. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Okay, everybody...anybody have a problem with that? Next one is Public Art Technician. SRG (inaudible) not recommended. BAC So it's not recommended. RAS Not recommended, okay. RSK What's that? BAC This one's not recommended. RAS That one's not going to happen. RSK Can we still take a look at it, since it's in here. BAC Well, the Assistant City Manager does not recommend it, and I concur then. RSK Oh, you're concurring with the... BAC With the City Manager RSK Oh, concurred with the City Manager, and there's no attempt to sell it? So that would be (inaudible). I just thought when you put them in here that we would discuss them, but that's okay, I guess. Okay, that completes that. We'll go up to the City Manager. CLO And there's a whole lot (inaudible) PSG The only reason I left it in there was because we originally had it in the budget book, so that's the reason why I had left it in here. RSK City Manager reclassifications. CLO I think on previous occasions, the Council had asked me to look at the clerical pool available to the City Manager. What has happened in the last two years, of course, you know we created the position that is occupied by Pat. He works under the City Manager and basically Monica provides all of his clerical backup 38 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 and of course we've hired a new Assistant to the City Manager, so basically this is a request that we recognize what this person really does as opposed to just an Office Assistant to...and as you look at the...it's more of a title change. The benefits...the annual wages cost about (inaudible) RSK Council pleasure. ?? Approved RSK It's approved. You want to take a five-minute break? BAC Yes, sir. RSK Five-minute break. RSK Who's going to present this? CLO I can (Inaudible) BAC We're at the Sheriff now. CLO Well, if we were really doing zero -based budgeting, to answer Jim's question, basically we'd have the Sheriff justify each and every dollar, but I don't think we want to do that. As we've indicated before, basically it's a status quo, they are normal increases, and I believe that the only increase (inaudible) was the additional motorcycle cop...person...and that pretty well... RAS Let me ask you ask a question about the salary. They just did a new contract, Riverside, with the Police, is that correct? ST Riverside Police Department? RAS Yes ST (inaudible) RAS So (inaudible) this by 10%. ST It was an estimated 10% because at the time I put the document together, Sheriffs Administration hadn't put out the figures yet. Since then, they have put 39 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 the figures out, and we're really close to 10%. It was like (inaudible) about 8.9% increase total, which is 5.6% with another 3.3% or so based on the new 3% at 50...that was what the kicker was. Rather than a 5% increase, it was 10% because of the new 3% at 50 that we, as a Sheriff's Association, gained in the last year. RAS I thought I read something in the paper about the police that are part of Riverside County Sheriff's weren't happy because they were paid less than a lot of the other police departments in California. Is there any... ST I don't know what you're talking about as far as the (inaudible) Sheriff's Department. The Deputy Sheriff's Association has agreed with the pay increases and so has LEMU, our management unit. So there hasn't been any publicity that I know of us not being happy. In fact, everybody is ecstatic with the 3% at 50, that was a very big thing for us to get in the last year. RAS It's a union, they're part of a union, correct? ST Correct RAS And when is their contract up, or is it up annually? ST I don't know if...l think ours stays a five-year contract, and I think their MOU is up in another year. LEMU is on a different cycle, and I think we have two more years before our cycle goes. RAS Okay, thank you. BAC Is there a reason that COLA that we base, which is I think 2.8% or something like that this year, and the total there is 3.3% or 3.5%, is that one of those statistical index for urban versus... PSG It's dealing with their MOU, what they agree with the union as far as what month is being used because each month has a different rate as far as how much year to year it changes. So you can have two different months, and they'll have two different rates, one could be 3% and one could be 2%. If you look at the inflation tables every year, each month has a different increase. But their MOU is really what (inaudible) BAC Okay RSK Any other questions? Jim? 40 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JF Yes, on the motorcycles, if memory serves me correctly, we got two motorcycles and then used two existing officers to utilize those motorcycles. ST We did. JF And you're not now asking us to go to four motorcycles, you're asking us to simply hire two persons to be dedicated to the two existing motorcycles? ST Yes. I'm asking for two additional positions because taking two bodies off our existing traffic team took my traffic enforcement, which is patrol car ability to respond to traffic collisions, so we... JF We're not (inaudible) motorcycle program, we're simply giving you permanent personnel so that you can... ST We're actually adding two more bodies for two more pieces of equipment... JF I understand, but you're not putting two more motorcycles (inaudible)... ST Yes, we are. The proposal is two more bodies. You already have the two bodies that were on the existing team that were basically... RSK Is it two more bodies and two more motorcycles? ST Yes, the approval was for two more bodies. Two more motorcycles is another issue that will come based on grant funding that comes next year. But on the personnel themselves, two bodies that we took off the original initial program, we rolled them off the traffic team into this position, which had... RSK So you're adding two now. ST Yes, that's what we're requesting, to add two more. BAC But you're not, then, replacing the (inaudible) ST No, we are not. What's going to happen, as I was getting to, when we rolled them out as regular traffic deputies at deputy salary, when they roll onto motors, they get specialty pay for being on motors (inaudible) if this is approved, when we do the amendment to the contract to add the two positions, we will also reclass those two as motor officers dedicated. Right now they're dedicated as dedicated traffic officers, plus they get an enhancement...it's just the semantics 41 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 of making the contract read correctly. So I'm asking for two additional...and that hinges on the grant money that we get after July 1 we'll find out hopefully what the grant money we'll get from Cal COPS, which should cover the cost of the motorcycles, as we did the first year. RAS And if it doesn't? ST And if it doesn't, then we don't hire the positions. (Inaudible) PSG We could cover it under contingencies. ST That's another $60,000; we could find the other $60,000 for the... RSK But (inaudible)... my druthers would be that whether we get the grant money or not, we'd find another way to get the motorcycles. ST It's my understanding...I'm pretty sure that Cal COPS is coming again, but because of what's going on with the State budget, you can't actually be sure. I know that the technology grant money is probably not going to be there next year. I'm not sure about LEBG...it probably won't be enough to cover this anyways. I'm being told that $100,000 is coming again for Cal COPS, which would totally cover this program, and that was my intent to use that money for that. RSK Well, if it didn't we would have a chance to decide if we want to make adjustments for that. Bob? RAS I have not yet seen statistics, and maybe they've been made available and I missed them, on what this has done to our red light runners, having two motorcycle police. ST What they're doing is they're keeping statistics as far as their ability to cut traffic and give citations is what they're keeping, not specifically...we track light violations as they relate to traffic collisions, and right now that's about, in all of our collisions, red light violations is about 10% of the primary collision factors. We're finding out that the motors are becoming about 80% of our enforcement of our traffic from everything from light violations to speeding, which is our biggest problem. That's the largest chunk, and that collision factor is 42%. They're doing that, but we're also getting the extra enhance bonus of them responding to priority one calls or emergency calls which are not traffic related, and they actually have about a 3.8 minute response time to priority one calls. Right now, .a.4 42 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 with the City of Palm Desert's patrol, priority one response is 4.6 minutes, which is the lowest in Riverside County of all the contract cities, all of our incorporated area. The motors even beat that, so response time and their ability to cut traffic...they were able to cut traffic 300 times during just this evaluation period, which is about a ten-month evaluation period...they were able to cut traffic 300 times and catch violators for stops that patrol cars wouldn't have to, and in those 300, 15 of them were to respond to major injury traffic collisions, so in 15 of those cases we were able to get to the traffic collision scenes and render assistance whereas patrol cars (inaudible). JMB What hours do they work because I never see them? ST They are on flex schedule. (Inaudible) we don't see them until we run a program with them, and people don't usually see them because (inaudible) JMB Well, I'm glad I don't see them, but I see them leaving the yard here sometimes. ST We run them on the flex schedule, and we base it on our collision stats rather than just running them on a regular shift. We run them based on where we are having our problems, and one example is Monterey and Country Club. We had a major traffic collision problem, like nine in a week. We put them out for a week, and it went down to like two, so that's a 72% decrease. That's effectiveness (inaudible) a lot of times I don't see them. I heard them on the radio and go out there, and I don't see them, and I'm looking for them. RAS At one time you discussed the possibility of working with other cities that had motorcycle police, where they would all come together on a given day and really do their whoop-de-doo. ST I put a proposal for that...the City of Rancho Mirage has two motorcycles, we have two, and La Quinta now has two. I originally put a proposal together, called the Motorcycle Enforcement Program, where one time a month they all get together and do required training with cones and patterns, things they have to do on a motorcycle to keep them safe. It's a ten-hour training day, five hours of training five hours of riding through the City. I put a proposal together for all three of the cities to get together, so one day every third month we would have six motorcycles in our city riding. It fell flat because, I'll be quite frank, La Quinta, one of our officers in La Quinta, thought it was kind of (inaudible) our motorcycles, so I said no. I'm in the process of working with Rancho Mirage to do that. We'll probably have the ability to have four motorcycles, and if we get two more, six in our city every other month. So it's still in the proposal stage. 43 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS Mayor, could I ask you to get a hold of the Mayor... RSK What was that you said? JUNE 5, 2002 RAS La Quinta does not want our motorcycle police to be there unless they have a La Quinta badge, and the point is, you've got six motorcycles... RSK What upsets me is one of our cars with a Palm Desert thing on it is...you're going to take it somewhere else...I don't care if they come over here and help us with our traffic. RAS Well, La Quinta is opposed... RSK They ought to be glad to have those... ST To be clear, I'm not so sure that that was (inaudible) RSK I won't talk to him about...I'll just talk to him about the program and how beneficial it is. I won't needle him about... ST I think that might be on the station level. I don't know if it was even proposed to the City because when I... RSK Don't worry, I won't quote you. Any other questions on the Police/Sheriff's? RAS I move approval. RSK Looks like it's been approved all the way around here. Mr. (inaudible)... BH We have two proposals or two requests for (inaudible). The first one is for our annual budget. We're requesting $9.7 million for the fire services for the Cove Communities and then additional resources and that for additional equipment. It was approved by the Public Safety Commission and by the Cove Commission, and Palm Desert's contribution towards that under the Cove formula would be (inaudible) percent. RSK Questions about the fire... RAS And you're also asking for money to do something to Mesa View? BH (inaudible) 44 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Everybody comfortable with the Fire plan? Okay, that takes care of the Fire. RSK Community Development... JF We're going to do Mesa View, even though it's here, at a different time? PSG No, you can (inaudible) right now. JF Do you have a question, Bob, about that? RAS No, I just...we need it because the paramedic (inaudible) (Inaudible) BH When Mesa View was originally built in 1981, it was designed to house a much smaller staffing level than we have right now. Over the course of the last twenty years, we've increased that staffing from one to five at that particular fire station, so we need to expand the fire station accordingly. The firefighters live in the fire station a minimum of 72 hours per week, so it's getting a little cramped in there. RAS I just moved approval for that, too. RSK Okay. Does anybody have any objection to that? RJF Mr. Mayor, one more question. Does that include landscaping for (inaudible) or not? ?? I don't believe it does. RSK Okay. PD Paul, the request was for grade 820 (inaudible) 800...do you have the number of what the actual cost will be? My understanding is that the way the grade works, it will be significantly reduced by two to three thousand, not eight thousand because of the irregularity of how the grades work. PSG So it's basically a $2.3 an hour difference...you're right (inaudible) PD Yeah, I think we kept it more like, with benefits, maybe $2,500 not $8,000. A position was created in 1989 (inaudible) other cities (inaudible) JMB And what grade level... 45 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PD 800 RSK So is the City Manager's recommendation 800, is that what they're proposing? PD Yes, and I think with benefits it's more like $2,500, not... JF What was the original grade request? PD 820 JF And was it the 820 that was $8,000? PD Yes JF And this is for... RAS 800 PD 800 JF Okay....why...19-year employee, do you think he doesn't deserve 820. CLO We looked at other positions, and I had Martin do a survey. When you look at, also, the...how it fits with other similar positions within the City because you also have to look at that, not just the market, we have to see how it fits within the City so that our own internal structure doesn't get out of position. I think the...and I know it's a small difference, but we felt that a grade of 800 was where it needed to be to fit in within our internal structure. If you really look at the market, the market would have been much higher than even the 820. JF I guess I would support the 820. (Inaudible) PD The position doesn't change. JMB I would agree with Jim. I think somebody's that been a faithful and good employee as he has (inaudible) RAS Any other people that report to you have their nose out of joint because of this? 46 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY PD We hope not. RSK Buford? CLO You're approving it at 820? RSK 820, yes. CLO That's fine. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Next is (inaudible) mostly when we do the white papers, that pretty much determines what happens here with the big book. How do you want to approach this? BAC I thought...in the last couple of years, you start by saying page 42, 33, anybody with questions, and just roll through that. PSG The other choice is to go to the pages that any of the Council have any questions concerning. RSK I marked mine when I went through it where I had any questions, and we've dealt with most of them that I marked. The only one that...I was thinking on page 29 designates the increases and decreases...if there are any questions on that. Maybe we could take sections...how about sections? "Budget Summary Information"... any comments on the Budget Summary? RAS I think we've talked about them. RSK We talked about that quite a bit earlier. RAS On page 8...let's go to page 8 because that's part of the budget summary. This indicates, as I look at it and look at the golf course, we have $874,000 in total revenues....I'm sorry, the Parkview Office Complex? PSG Right RAS And that would give us a project of $308,000. PSG Correct RAS But then you indicate that you wanted to put money in there to redo the roof. 47 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG That would be for the current year, meaning 2001/2002. This money will be freed up, then, to be used for... RAS So this could be used for the tree outside. PSG We already have that budgeted. (Inaudible) increased costs, yes. RAS Okay, and it looks like we're going to make a profit on the golf course...this year it's $238,000 CLO That's the cash profit, that's correct. RAS Okay, that answers that question. RSK Any other questions on that section? General Fund section... JF Just let me correct the wording on page 29 where it says management denied over $3 million in expenditures. PSG We will correct that. RSK Thank you. CLO Maybe it doesn't even need to be said. (Inaudible) RSK Any other questions on... RAS On page 30, about halfway down the page, there is a sentence that says "Traffic Safety is down due to prior year funding of Battery Backup for Traffic Signals that did not work during power outages." What happens when there's a power outage? Do they just blink? MG The signals just go dark when there's no power, and this is a device that was to keep them on flash. We had four or five demonstration locations throughout the City. Two of them got hit with power failures, and both of them failed. They were two different manufacturers... RSK Did we get our money back? Did we apply for our money back? 48 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY MG They worked the week before the failure. JUNE 5, 2002 RAS That leads me to a question. When lights do go out, how are the police notified so they can take care of traffic at our major intersections? MG Generally, they're the first to know because they have officers out there finding it. If we get a call, we do call them. ST We do have a procedure in effect based on the rolling blackouts we're having, a rolling blackout procedure that designated officers at the moment we have a power failure go to the nearest major intersection, check the intersection, maintain traffic flow if they can and any priority one calls...they have to clear for priority one calls (inaudible) and monitor the intersection. If it's going to be a prolonged outage more than a couple of hours, then we'll get ahold of the City and work with the City as far as putting up signs. RSK How much is a system that would notify us at some central location somewhere if the lights go out? MG We have that system now. RSK You have it now? MG Yes RSK So where does it go? MG Into Public Works in the Traffic... RSK Where does it go after hours? MG It only goes to that computer. We can set that computer to call the pager of the Signal Technician. The problem is that with a power outage, there is nothing for the Technician to do...he has no power to work with. RSK Well, I'm talking about other times. I'm talking about if the signal goes out for other reasons. MG Oh yes, we can page the Technician. We're not doing that now because we're not getting...we're only getting about one after hours failure per month now, which is a vast improvement (inaudible). In the long term in the system, we would like to be able to take advantage of that capability. 49 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS And one other thing in the General category is...Cal PERS rate is going up 25% in health care. PSG Correct. RAS Have we looked at any other company? PSG We are in the process of getting quotes on that. MP We're getting quotes from two companies, and we're meeting actually tomorrow on that. PSG And it would have to change in January if we do (inaudible) RAS Could we go back to Principal? PSG Not with the program we had previously, no. It's not offered (inaudible) RSK How about Public Works Street Maintenance decrease...what's that? JF What page are you on? RSK I'm on 29 still. RJF It was either dropping the recycling from a million and a quarter down to a million one hundred thousand or something like that. PSG But we're covering that with the carryovers from previous years. RSK I thought we didn't have any. PSG Any what, carryovers? Oh yes, when it comes to certain programs, we do. Streets is one area. RSK That's what I had in mind. Well, hopefully we never decrease the street maintenance because one of the things I get the most compliments about our city is our streets are clean, well -striped, well -maintained, and hopefully we keep doing it as well as we've been doing. Of all the places, I don't think we want to... RJF We're not going to affect street maintenance; we're not going to affect that. 50 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Your slurry seal was Tess than last year's...is there a reason for that? And restriping. I don't think we ever restripe enough. RSK You can't stripe too much, I don't think. MG Striping won't be here now, which is... RSK Of all the things that we talk about with public safety, having stripes to guide you where you need to go is probably the most number one most important things. Go to cities where they don't have any decent striping, and it's really terrible, so we need to be sure we... RAS If you want to put more money in there, I'd vote for it. RSK Yes, I'd be for doing more striping. It's almost impossible to do too much striping. MG If you want to do it more often, then we'll need more money, so we'd be happy to do it. JF Can you come back with a recommendation? RSK Take a real look at it so that we make sure we have a real emphasis on good striping. Maybe look at some streets that don't have a middle stripe at all, like Shadow Mountain and Ironwood...they have no middle stripe...and boy, people take a cut out in the middle there, and you're lucky that...you have to head for the curb. RAS And we've got a real problem out here on San Pablo and Fred Waring if you're going north. The right-hand lane is normally a right -turn lane unless somebody gets in there and wants to go straight, and then the traffic backs up because it's not identified as such. RSK When we're doing Fred Waring right now, the new project goes from Deep Canyon to San Pablo, but it doesn't do anything to take care of what Bob just brought up. That project doesn't do anything there. Why wouldn't that be part of the project? MG I wish it was. RSK Didn't we approve both sides of the road when we go from Deep Canyon to San Pablo? 51 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY MG RJF RSK RJF RSK MG RSK RAS RSK No, the improvements...for example, from San Pascual north side only. We did not include the south side. We have plans to do the work on the southeast corner; procure right-of-way, and to get it in this package of possible. So what's the status of it, then? JUNE 5, 2002 to San Pablo are the however, we've got to improvements wasn't I think we're looking as far as picking up right-of-way right now, but as far as... You need to make sure that we're doing that because all of the things we're doing with Magnesia Falls and all the traffic around here, that's really a problem. Actually, we have been...RDA has been working with the property owner on the southeast corner of Fred Waring and San Pablo to try and acquire the property so then we could do the widening. That hasn't panned out, so now we need to talk about just acquiring the right-of-way needed. think we need to move on that one. As Magnesia Falls gets finished, this road's going to be a busy, busy road. It seems like about 20% of the traffic goes straight ahead, and 40% of it goes left, and 40% goes right, so that seems to me right now if we just had a right -turn only on that right side, it would be beneficial. I see people come up that are going to go straight ahead in the right lane, and then it backs up ten cars. RJF We did have it at one time, and because of the traffic volumes, we had to modify it to what we have right now. So we'll check (inaudible) and find out if we should switch back. RSK BAC RSK BAC RSK Okay, anything more on the General Fund section? Special Revenue Funds... Why don't we take it by ten -page increments. Okay. Let's say the 40's... Okay, let's take up to 40, then. 52 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY BAC Yes JF BAC RSK BAC JF BAC JF CLO JF RSK PSG BAC Up to page 40? Yes I'll give you a little time....up to page 50. I've got page 50. I've got page 50. I've got 45. So let's go to 45. I guess my assumption had been that anything significantly different was in the White Pages or No, I think the White Papers are mostly for new or personnel requests. JUNE 5, 2002 that was in the budget that was White Papers. Is that... projects, that's been the history, Okay. Well, besides the 25% increase in Health Maintenance Organizations on Page 44 that Bob noted, there is a suggested $20,000 increase in meeting compensation for the City Council. I realize it's a relatively small amount in a $35 million budget, but it still represents about a 50% increase in our pay, which I think merits at least some discussion or at least notification. I guess I'm sensitive to the thought that somehow we are sneaking through a pay raise for ourselves, and if we've earned a pay raise, which reasonable people could argue we have, then we shouldn't be embarrassed about it, we ought to just say... What's the amount for (inaudible) From $680 to $1,000 a month $1,000 JMB About $650 a month more. JF The gross compensation is from $41,400 to $61,400 if I'm reading that correctly, Paul. PSG Right. 53 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS For all of us. JUNE 5, 2002 PSG We put a lump sum just saying this is what... CLO The way I look at it, there is a page in here; unfortunately I've lost it, that really talks about the total activity of the City. And I don't mean...we always like to concentrate on the General Fund. If you look at the General Fund, and you look at how much of the General Fund is for public safety, okay, it's really for salaries, for running a $134 million company. We're looking at salaries of $9 million plus benefits. If you look at page 16, okay... RAS 16? CLO Page 16...that $164 million company is run basically by about a $4 billion personnel costs. That's true when you include public safety and you include all the commissions and committees, so to me, the way I would justify it is when you look at the board of directors, if you will, and I know you're City Councilmen, to me I have no trouble justifying that total budget expense for the City Council to run a $164 million company. Personally, I just don't have a problem with it. RSK The percentage increase is pretty big, but I had a boss once who told me that ten percent of nothing is nothing. JF Well, we went through this a couple of years ago, and I think you could make great arguments on both sides, and reasonable minds can differ. I'm not in favor of it, but that doesn't mean I don't think it's wrong, I just personally am not going to vote in favor of it. RSK Let's make sure we have a majority here. Buford? BAC Yes, sir. RSK Are you for or against it? (Inaudible) RSK Bob? And you're opposed? Jean? JMB I'm for it. RSK And I'm for it. 4-1. So that can be recorded. 54 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY (Inaudible) JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Mine was the Other Services. We're cutting our Other Services — Legal Services down from $900,000 to $345,000, and everything we've got on the plate tells me it's going to be more than $345,000. I may be wrong. PSG This was based on discussion with Dave Erwin, realizing that of that $900,000, $450,000 was dealing with the Monterey/Highway 111, and then we had another... RAS And that's all satisfied now? PSG Yes. (Inaudible) CLO So unless we expect to have two big settlements, do you think (inaudible) out of the equation? (Inaudible) RAS I'll defer to Jim, to see what he thinks. JF Well, I don't know how much of this is appropriate for Closed Session versus open session, but there may be some restructuring in that entire department. Have you taken that into some consideration when it comes to budgeting? CLO That is not part of this budget. JF It may very well be, though. CLO Well, I think like you said, maybe we need to discuss it in (inaudible) JF So can we maybe see... RAS See what the fiscal effect will be. JF Table it until we... CLO Sure 55 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JF I think this is scheduled for Closed Session at our next meeting, so... RSK You reminded me of one back on page 14... BAC Well, let me finish 50. It would be nice to have a breakdown of what was in that $900,000 this year as versus the year before and so on and then...I mean, I don't need it now. I understand this is a summary sheet and all the rest of that, but here's one where I'd like to be able to look at what and why and... PSG We were trying to be sensitive to the fact of not highlighting litigation cases... BAC I understand that. PSG How do you....do you want it in here? BAC No, a separate (Inaudible — several people talking at once) RSK Page 14 on charges and services for...Paul, this is a question for you. I noticed under Reimbursement Other we budgeted $11 million and then we only spent $1 million, and then we're going to budget $6 million. What is that? PSG We get reimbursements from the Federal Government and CVAG, from various agencies for capital projects. So it's going to vary year to year. For example, your Highway 111...depending on the timing when we actually do approve this will determine when we receive those reimbursement funds. RSK Thank you. Okay, what's up to page 60, then? BAC 55, real quick. Just to note that I asked staff to look at, and I noted we've been doing, and appropriately, a lot more this last year with Sister Cities, and I just asked staff to take a look at that budget from the $35,000 down to $25,000 and what is included. We'll come back to that. RAS Mr. Mayor. I think....normally those monies are passed to the Council with trips out of town and so on. BAC That part is okay to leave, but I think there were some other things (inaudible) SRG You and I discussed this, and I met again with Donna yesterday. We're okay with $25,000. 56 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS Okay, what is it going to do? Why $25,000? JUNE 5, 2002 SRG Well, they've got the (inaudible) going on, they (inaudible) any travel expense, we've got the Key Pal program going. Membership dues are $1,000. The golf tournament that we hold for Gisborne is $4,500. The annual conference, sending two members which have never traveled to these before is $3,000. Event hosting is at $5,000, and that's when we have visitors from other cities. We're having the teachers come from Gisborne, and they'll be here, I think, within the next couple of weeks. Educational projects, including the Key Pal program with Gisborne, the photo exchange program between Palm Desert and Gisborne schools, cameras, film developing, shipping of (inaudible) student recognitions, etc. Printing and duplicating were taken off because that's going under the Marketing program. Supplies, books, banners, videos and other miscellaneous supplies. RSK Is that golf tournament worth $4,500? SRG I don't think (inaudible) Last year we had that and included our committee/commission members, it was a transatlantic, so they compared scores during the tournament, and we had great feedback from the people who participated. Plus (inaudible) people who were coming into town, so they participated in it, and I think as far as promotional effort and as far as (inaudible) RSK That's right in the heart of our business where we get $170 a round, and I suspect it costs us a lot more than $4,500. SRG They said it's Christmas, it's around Christmas time, and... CLO And if you look at it, it's basically we took money from one pot and put it into another, and it helps Desert Willow. RSK But we expect them to make a profit. CLO I think if you look at the specific dates, those are not high revenue dates for Desert Willow. Those are down times, especially just before Christmas or right after Christmas, after New Year's. I don't know that that really gets in the way... RSK So you're okay with it? CLO We're fine with it. 57 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY BAC And page 60... RAS No, I've got something before that. BAC Oops, sorry. JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Page 57...this is going to be a tough one for you, Carlos, because of what we've done in moving everything around. Last year we spent $173,000, this year we're planning on spending $852,000. A lot of those were someplace else last year. Is there anything that puts all those together and shows us where we're at? CLO I did that calculation. If you go back to page 56, the difference is $679,000 there, and then it's added...if you look all the way from page 54 and 55 and 56 and 57, I guess, basically you're transferring from one to the other. SRG Community Programs on page 54, that's special events, what we've done though, Bob, is the News Bureau, the Calendar, brochures, BrightSide...all of those were budgeted separately last year, and they're all in one budget now. For example, $75,600 for printing of the BrightSide every year. The calendar, though we're saving about $10,000, it's about $40,000 to produce that. And we put it now under one lump sum. It seems like a lot more, and it's about $60,000 more. RAS $60,000 more...that was my question. If you put them all together with the minuses and plusses, it's about $60,000 more. SRG And we've gone through the Visitor Center, and we've done an analysis of everything that was happening out there, and we're actually giving things like this away. We're going to be printing new brochures. We're going to (inaudible) golf courses, and we'll have a map with a small brochure. They won't all be brightly colored and four-color, but they will be cost-effective. We are going...the one year we are out of vacation planners, so we will be upgrading it, putting the hotels in it, making it a little more user-friendly. The relocation guide we still have, so we won't update those. I want to show you what we're doing for Desert Willow, though. This is the old brochure for Desert Willow. In working with Kemper and Desert Willow, this is what we've come up with. And Kemper has approved it. You have a pocket here, and information about Desert Willow will be inserted here in the pocket here, and we will make sure it has a CD in it, we'll make sure that any information specific to the request will go in it. But this is a tremendous upgrade from what we've had, and it's not that this one wasn't good, it's just that it was old. So we are refreshing it, and we are coming up with 58 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 a hiking guide, a biking guide, seeing that we have a need for it. And that's included in the budget. In prior years, they had a special project for (inaudible) so we are experiencing a tremendous (inaudible) RAS I just wondered what the difference was, and I understand now. RSK Looks like some pretty good stuff. (inaudible) BAC Right, when we get to the 60's... RSK Okay, that takes us up to 60? How about up to 70? RAS No...61...is that our lobbyist? BAC Yes RAS Okay, that's it. That's my question. RSK Do you have something in the 60's? BAC 64 real quick. I noticed we have funds for updating the voting equipment in the Council Chamber...is there something wrong with it? RSK Probably the people voting wrong. BAC Oh, okay, well if you can fix that for how little that is, help yourself. RDK The amount of technology that exists, I was told that it's akin to an F-16 (inaudible) Planning Commission, Council meetings, outside groups. So (inaudible) fine-tuned, there are things that we have to do to it on occasion to keep it in top working order. SRG We pay a lot of money to get it fixed (inaudible) RDK Monitors (inaudible), cords being pinched, things like that. And (inaudible) BAC So people...outside groups don't use the voting equipment. RDK Correct. Planning Commission doesn't even use the voting equipment. JF Neither does Cove Commission. 59 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Going back to page 62, Visitor Information Center, on the bottom of the page it says the Visitors Information Center is budgeting revenue of $50,000. How much this year...do we have any idea? PSG About $35,000 RAS $35,000 BAC And is that revenue after we pay back our costs, or is that gross? PSG That's gross BAC I think it's $35,000 over here for what (inaudible)...15 grand, is that fair? PSG Current year I think we're probably breaking even. RAS The objective, though, is to have Palm Desert merchandise... BAC I understand that. (Inaudible...several people talking at once) SRG ...and the merchandise program, so that's something that we'll be doing... RAS And we're talking about doing a Christmas brochure for our residents (inaudible) RSK Anything more on the 60's? 70's BAC 70's? RAS 77 BAC 72 RSK 72, okay. And it has nothing to do with this, but just a comment....maybe we already automatically do it, but given all the stuff of Arthur Anderson and everything else and so on and so forth, just as one Councilmember, I think we ought to at least look at having, in essence, an automatic change in auditing firms every "x" number of years. JMB We did change it in (inaudible) 60 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY BAC But I'm just saying as an automatic... JUNE 5, 2002 PSG (inaudible) go through the Investment Committee and come up with a policy that deals with that and also who's on the Committee, etc. RAS Page 74 has nothing to do with the budget, but we bought furniture for the Brothers building for the conference room, and it's not being used, and it's sitting over there in some big office. We could use that furniture, like in the northwest conference chamber, and maybe other places. It's good furniture, it's just going to waste over there. RSK Do you know what he's talking about? There are chairs with arms purchased for the... JF Like these RSK ...conference room over there, and they went somewhere. PSG I'll have to look into that. I'm not sure where they are now. RAS According to Corky, they're sitting in some empty office over there. PSG I'll check with her. JF (inaudible) the fact that she couldn't put enough people at the table, and Dick Kelly didn't like the chairs. RSK They're not that great...the arms fell off of them... RAS Well, those we'll repair. So if we can get them over here, we could use them. JF They were chucked because she didn't want them, not because the arms fell off. RSK No, that was because she could fill more people in... JF Right. RAS Page 77...does this include updating our website? PSG 77...what was your question? RAS Does this include updating our website? 61 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG The website portion is coming out of the current year... RAS So that's all taken care of? PSG Hopefully...unless there are change orders which we have not been made aware of at this point. RSK Does that take care of the 70's? 80's RAS Page 82...82 is also something that we've got on our Agenda for later on, and that's the Library. Next year, COD is going to shut down for the month of January, and that's going to be their...in between semesters. That means their Library is going to close for the month of January. BAC (inaudible) RAS That's what I was told... BAC No, when they shift semesters, they will end...they are shortening the length of the semester and adding to the length of classes per day, so they're lengthening the calendar. So they start in September, end before Christmas, don't start until about February, but they will be running an Intercession, I believe, in between. That's the plan to run short courses in that one month. RAS Okay, well...one of the things we're looking at is the parking at the Library, which is totally inadequate, and we talk about it, but we don't anything accomplished because they're not talking to us about it. They were just given a grant by the mother of Char Whitaker for a million dollars, and she's going to decide how the money is going to be spent, which really doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense from my standpoint, but be that as it may, there are a lot of things that they could be doing with the City that they're not doing with the City, and I'm recommending because we're at that point that someplace there be a committee put together to work with the College to get this thing straightened out. JF Don't we have a Library Committee? RDK Yes JMB The Library Committee brought forward the parking issue, but they're not really... RSK (inaudible) the Library. 62 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB What? RSK They're in the Library. JMB Yes, inside functions and special projects, but I don't think they... RSK (inaudible) SRG The money for the parking lot is included in the Library budget for next year. BAC $80,000 SRG $80,000 because that's where it came from, and Buford and I have been talking because what's holding it up is the Michael Watling... BAC What's holding it up is the fact that the last time staff was going...I asked staff...staff was going to go out there and actually measure out what was needed and actually mark and so on and so forth, and that was three months ago, and that's...the ball is in our court. SRG You were going to talk to Michael Watling. BAC The issue was, then, after that we were going to look at what we were actually talking about. Nobody has ever... SRG And I did talk to Pat Conlon... RAS Well, there is also another serious problem, and that is that students over there that don't want to pay the money to get a parking pass park at our Library. It's the fact of life. We give them more space, they'll park more students there. SRG But you know what...we did a survey with Planning and Public Works (inaudible) that doesn't bear out (inaudible) it was much lower than (inaudible) for the students and then we also (inaudible) for the Street Fair...our problem really is with the vendors who pull into the parking lot so they don't have far to walk on the weekend. The statistics show that we pretty much are using the parking figures for our side of the Library. RSK Well, it sure was (inaudible) if you went over there, like I went over there, to (inaudible) and there was nobody in the Library, so everybody in the room I went to for the meeting and the parking lot was full, I got the last parking space. 63 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 Where were the people? I don't know where the people were that parked there...they weren't in the Library. JMB I've been in many times when it's full, too, and there isn't anything going on. BAC But the odds...that was at four o'clock if I remember right. And the odds of those being filled by students at four o'clock in the afternoon are pretty low. That's not where students park... JF Probably the Sun Life Medical Building... RSK Wonder who it was. BAC I'm just saying... RSK (inaudible) your students...I didn't say... BAC If it was 9 a.m., I wouldn't be... RSK It's probably professors in there... (Inaudible) BAC They don't walk that far. Anyhow, we need to set that back on our list and actually get the various folks who have things to do to do something about it. RAS We ought to have a "howdy" with the people at the College. BAC How about Jean and the Mayor doing that? RAS That's good. (Inaudible) BAC The Mayor's the Mayor. RAS That's right. JF And the Mayor Pro Tem. BAC And the Mayor Pro Tem. 64 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK I don't know anything about libraries. (Inaudible) RSK I used to get kicked out of libraries. BAC That's because you were unfamiliar with them. RAS You don't know the Dewey Decimal System. BAC I have another question on page 82. RAS I've got a couple on it, too. BAC Is the difference between $48 and $60 one and a half million dollars? PSG It's probably between $400,000 to $500,000 a year. BAC It just came up in my mind again because I saw our good friends at Palm Desert Greens, and so and so forth, who assume that we're going to tax them to death and all the rest of this. At some point, I'm willing to take a deep breath about whether or not we ought to fund the Fire Tax at $60. If I did it, I guess I'd do it before all those good folks decide to join our City, and if that was too steep a price for them to pay to get into our City, probably so much the better. RAS Based on our conversation that we had, the people coming into the City can pay the higher level....that's not true, Carlos. JF That's not true. CLO I think...let me answer a different question. This came up when the Council was asking specifically about Palm Desert Country Club, whether we could form special districts to fund particular activities. I don't know that there's a specific issue with regard to these that you're talking about, that we would charge a different... RSK I don't think we can do that. BAC Oh, I think we can. CLO Palm Desert Country has specific capital improvement issues, so I think you could apply an assessment district for something to...for things that are provided 65 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 to the general public...I think there was just a recent case, I read in the Western Cities, that you can't...services that are generally available to the general public you can't charge one section of the community more than you do others. BAC But this is a parcel tax, right? CLO It's a parcel tax. RSK And mobile home parks pay less... MG And apartments RSK ...than $48... (Inaudible) BAC They go up to something like $42 were we to push this at its... PSG Currently it's $36... (Inaudible — several people talking at once) RSK (inaudible) we can go up to $60 with the residents. What is it for mobile homes? MG It would be forty -something, I don't know exactly... CLO But the charge for a mobile home is... PSG $48 (Inaudible) RAS Well, I do, too, but I don't know that we ought to (inaudible) RSK I'm not going to do it as long as we have a $26 million surplus. BAC I figured I'd be the one person to look at that, so that takes care of that one for me. RSK Does that take care of the... RAS No 66 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK Okay, what page are you on? JUNE 5, 2002 RAS I'm still on page 82. We talked about the million four, we talked about the $85,000, then it says $48,000 will be transferred to cover the shortages in various landscaping and lighting districts. PSG That is strictly dealing with the Haystack landscaping district...went through the court order and (inaudible) RAS That's the only one... PSG That's the only one currently....we're proposing, actually in the process of balloting everybody that they pay 100% of what their cost was...if it gets passed, then we'll have to revisit that issue with all the other districts. Right now we haven't got the ballots in yet. RSK Okay, anything else in the 80's? 90's... RAS 95...Civic Center Park Maintenance...we're going from Tri-Cities Sports Facility from $290,000 to zero... PSG What's happened here is the Civic Center Park Maintenance...this department number used to be called Parks Maintenance, and the one on the next page was called Civic Center Park Maintenance. In the process, we didn't want to move the salaries, so Spencer and Tom Bassler reoriented these two budgets, so that's why you see all these differences. RAS Oh, okay. PSG There really isn't any cut, they're going to shift it around as far as what account numbers to use. RAS Because on 97 you go from $1,000 to $550,000, and from zero to $275,000. (Inaudible) RAS But altogether, does it look alright? (Inaudible) RAS And then on the slurry seal, we're going to spend $150,000 less on page 102. 67 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG Well, it's going to be covered by carryover. RSK Council, on the Agenda we have discussion under Item IV of several things, and if we're going to do that today, then Pat's going to have to order lunch, so what's your pleasure? RAS I'd like to get it all done today. RSK You'd like to get it all done? JF I've got to leave in an hour, so I'd like to get as much done as possible. RSK Jean? JMB I'd like to get it done, too. RSK Everybody wants to get it done. CLO Okay, we'll order some lunch, then....maybe about 12:30? JF That way, I'll miss it. CLO You could take advantage of the full hour. JF Okay. RAS You could take it with you, how's that? We'II give you a doggie bag. SRG Pizza okay? BAC What? SRG Is pizza okay? BAC Yes, pizza, and if you do that, it won't take very long, and Jim can actually have a piece. RSK (inaudible) as quick as they can. BAC Yes, send it over here. (Inaudible) 68 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK 85 everybody. BAC 85? JMB Is the $45,000 under Unallocated (inaudible) during the year (inaudible) PSG Yes...when I re -tallied all the numbers, the difference to come up with the total that we allocated I put in here. This would be the balance, so that's what that amounts to. JMB And there are changes that we recommended at the meeting... PSG They've all been incorporated in here. JMB Yes, that's coming to the Council (inaudible) PSG I have a handout if you wish to have that discussed right now. JMB I think some of the other Councilmembers might like to see what we decided, as some of the things we weren't going to fund anything that was a startup organization... RSK Doesn't this come to a Council meeting? PSG It will come to Council, yes. BAC What's the contribution to schools that went from $3,500 to $35,000? PSG What we did, Buford, is previously it was called something else, I don't remember what entity it was previously... RAS Contributions to various agencies went from $300,000 to $17,000. PSG I decided to lump the schools all in one and keep the miscellaneous that we (inaudible) in that other one so it's easier to track now. BAC And, I suspect I'm not alone in feeling that this year when we do our visits with the various schools, we really need to have a chat with them about how they hold some of that money so that students who have various... JMB And our recommendation's coming forward. 69 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 BAC Okay. (Inaudible) really reinforce the fact that this is their money, and this, that, and the other thing needs to go through with that with a match from parents rather than on our doorstep. PSG And the other recommendation, also, has to deal with if anybody comes in during the middle of the year... BAC We send them back. PSG ...send it to the committee, let the committee review it, and then the (inaudible) instead of going to Council and then... RAS We set aside $25,000 CLO I think it's $45,000 (Inaudible) BAC And so this $4,800, there's a whole new divvying up that we'll see at the Council meeting? PSG Yes, you will. BAC Okay. RSK Okay, in the 90's... RAS We did the Street Resurfacing... RSK Okay on the 90's? The 101 to 110... BAC Fine RSK Okay there? Up to 120, then... BAC Aside from the tidy up on 118 and the Community Center and the landscaping and stuff...it's a good use of money. RAS 110...this goes back to what we were talking about earlier...we've got $75,000 in striping, which is the same as last year, projected for this year, and if that were increased, it wouldn't break my heart. 70 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK Mine, either. JUNE 5, 2002 MG It came in this year right at $75,000 for what we did, so if you want to do more, you will need to budget it. BAC I still don't see the need to do that. MG From what I heard is the suggestion that you all felt that we did...need to refresh the striping maybe twice a year. (Inaudible) RSK (inaudible) like that intersection that we've got all fixed up now at Monterey and 111, we really ought to watch that closely because it gets a lot of use, and the way it cuts around there, we need to....there's a line that ought to be repainted at least twice a year. MG That's CalTrans, we don't (inaudible) RJF CalTrans is responsible for restriping on 111 and on 74, so if the Council feels additional striping is needed, then we'll talk with CalTrans. PSG And if you're going to allocate any additional money, we have the remaining balance between revenues and expenditures is $32,000 in the General Fund, so that's what we have left to reallocate and stay within a balanced budget. RSK Okay, up to 120. BAC By the way, given all the issues that...as a matter of fact, I heard this morning that insurance the State (inaudible) pay outs since last year is double from insurance companies on claims having to do with mold, so I suggest on 124, Item E, that we probably don't "remold" the Building & Safety Department. PSG Uh oh BAC Let's not put mold back in it. PSG Fair enough. RAS It really shows on page 125 what insurance is costing us because just in Building & Safety, our insurance premium went from $144,000 to $264,000. 71 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG And to notate there, what happens is because we don't get an increase until January, we only have six months in the current year, so now we'll have a full year next year, and then January's new year amounts, we basically have two hits...in the prior year for six months and the next year for another six months. And then if there are any new positions added, that changes. RSK Okay, any more up to 130, or actually to 136? RAS 133...we're cutting back on our Code Enforcement from seven to six people? HC We're restructuring the administrative staff and putting the clerical in a pool so that we can have better coverage for (inaudible) PSG (inaudible) reflected in Building & Safety's budget. RAS Okay RSK Anything else in the General Fund? That takes care of General Fund. Special Revenue Funds...I've got one, I guess, for the first page. This Air Quality Management Fund...they keep threatening to shut everything down if we don't meet the air quality standards. As I drive around during storms, it's all coming off of land where they're not developing, that hasn't been developed, and if they want to shut down development, they will never attain it because you don't really attain it until something is developed. So what do we do, just... ?? Pray for rain. RSK ...what do we do, just keep...all I hear is (inaudible) contractors and developers creating all the dust, the PM10, but that's not true, so do we just...we can just go on with that statement. CLO Well, they claim there are certain events that as soon as the wind gets up to a certain amount, they don't register. In other words, that's not part of the... RSK But what they're measuring is...and if it is registering...that PM10 mostly comes off of land that nothing is being done on. RJF We have a situation where we've tried to work with the City of Rancho Mirage, who has a lot of vacant land on the West side of Monterey, and they basically said that they're not interested because it is undeveloped land. And the Marriott Corporation, who has been sand blasted quite badly out there (inaudible) 72 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 development has talked to them, and they still don't want to cooperate, even though Marriott was willing to pay for all the costs. The last thing was, while we're not worried about costs, now it's the aesthetics of sand fence, so I think maybe this is something that needs to go up to the Council. RSK I want to add one more thing...so they measure, so they don't measure when the wind is biowing...they call it...well, I don't care whether they measure or not, that's what bothers me. And the only way it's going to quit bothering me when it blows like that is if it gets developed, so why would we want to stop development? CLO Let me answer it this way, which is similar to the way that Washington addressed the whole (inaudible)...there's reality, and then there are rules that are set up. RSK So do we just sit back and take it? CLO No, but what we're being asked is to come up with a plan on how we're going to take care of that, and that plan needs to include how we're going to deal with construction sites. When you look at it, disturbed sites... RSK And how are we going to deal with the... BAC Richard, there is also a significant difference between sand blow, which is what you primarily get off a lot of undisturbed sites, and PM10, which is the very, very fine... RSK But I want to say one thing... BAC But let me finish what I'm saying. RSK But I don't agree with what you're saying. BAC You don't have to, at least I'II finish it. RSK Okay, finish it, and then I'll tell you what I think. BAC. And most of what we have on undeveloped sites is not PM10. I'm not arguing that's good for you, or we're happy, or whatever else. But most of the stuff that (inaudible) is the ultra fine stuff that happens when stuff comes off the sites and ends up on the roadways and so on and so forth and gets ground up into very fine particles or, when you disturb the sand, as we had a horrible example of with the building of that Marriott timeshare project, and they got lots of very small particle sand up out of the subsurface, and it (inaudible) and they are pretty darned clear 73 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 about when most of that happens, and it happens when you disturb the existing soil. Now we also have to be in real dry times, and (inaudible) Rancho Mirage needs to do something, but to assume that most of it is caused by "natural conditions" I think probably is not supportable by data, whether we agree or not personally. RSK When it's blowing (inaudible) no sign out there now it's only PM10, but when it's blowing, there is sand, and there's a lot more PM10 than there is right now when it's not blowing. There is a lot of PM10 within that sand when that sand's blowing. There's no way that it can't have all that PM10 in that sand when it's blowing hard. It's got to be in there...where does it go when it's blowing? It disappears? No, it doesn't disappear, there's more of it in there when it's blowing, and my lungs tell me so. I think they're not realistic. (Inaudible — several people talking at once) RSK Okay, in that section, let's take through 150. RAS 148...Community Block Grants. Are we going to go on our own and not go through the County, and shouldn't we get more money? JF I think we were bringing that to... PSG We've applied, but until we get it, I didn't want to change this dollar amount until we knew for certain what the amount was. RAS But we'll just spend it anyway... CLO We've qualified as "an urbanized area" and we've got a letter to that effect. JF I thought we had to have 50,000... CLO No, you can qualify as an entitlement city with 50,000...you can qualify as a small city if you're less than that. You could also qualify as an urbanized area as defined as more than 50,000. JF But we're not more than 50,000. CLO Well, but when HUD looks at the map, there are more than 50,000... JF Oh, in this area. 74 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO ...in this area. RSK Okay. RAS And 152, that's just...fire protection services are going up a million one. PSG Not technically. Our budget...the three million two represents our 52%. I budget on the total amount; however, they budget on the high salary, meaning if it's A to B step, they budget at B step for everybody. They also budget for all overtime, so typically it's going to be less, as you see the current year we're estimating $2.1 million. RAS Against the budget of $3.1 million. I see. Are we going to pick up the booking fees? PSG We'll deal with it when the State budget is finalized. RAS And our recycling fees went from $372,000 to $100,000 on page 155. PSG This is for expenditures, Bob (inaudible) fees. We have over $2.5 million in the pot. The $372,000 I can't recall what expenditure we have in there. I know we have the museum for one, and we have some recycling programs in there. Other than that, I couldn't tell you off the top of my head. We budget $100,000, and if there are special programs, we'll increase it during the year. RAS Okay. RSK Any more up to 160? JF 157 RAS 162 BAC 160 RAS 160, 162, and 167 JF 157...what is the capital outlay of $58,000 for the... PSG That's strictly the portion that we pay to CVAG. JF For what? 75 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG The fees that we get for air quality. A portion was agreed by the City (inaudible) give to CVAG, and they allocate it to PM10 type of programs. JF So the position that we rejected earlier would have been in addition to the $58,000 that we already give for that purpose...our "dust czar"? PSG The "dust czar" is General Fund. This is strictly the (inaudible) RSK What does CVAG do with that money? PSG They allocate it to regional programs and I believe Mark and them go in and put in programs for the City when we receive funding from them. BAC Does this go to street sweepers? RJF (inaudible) CVAG pilot program is for street sweepers, and we could be included in that pot. PSG I think Mag Falls...didn't we use some of those funds... RJF Yes, for the paving of Mag Falls and some of the other... PSG We have used them. RJF ...for certain areas that are eligible. As an example, sand fences (inaudible) are not. RSK That road, that special road up there on the other side of the wash... JF The name of which is (inaudible) (Inaudible — several people talking at once) JMB I need to go back... RSK You have...what page? JMB Yes, I forgot...126. RSK 126 76 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB And I had asked Carlos to put it on a special list, but then I remembered it might be in here, and the reason it wasn't on the special list was because it wouldn't apply until after we get the facility built. I just wondered if we should talk about the animal control because we will be asking shortly to increase our contribution in order for Roy to build the building, and do we need to discuss that now or... CLO We can. The amount that you have here is for the status quo. JMB Oh. After the June 14th meeting, we will be asking for more. CLO The CVAG committee that is working on it is looking at formula where we increase that...my sense is that when that formula is agreed to, we will come back to the Council, and there is a formula that has us paying as much as $170,000, so that will represent a $50,000 increase, although we are working to lower our amount based on a combination formula. So it will be less than $170,000. JMB I just thought they'll be asking...we'll be asking to approve that in order for Roy to go ahead... PSG But we won't be paying it until... JMB No, we won't be paying it, I know... CLO My sense is that when there is an agreement of all cities as to what the formula is, we'll come back to the City Council and say, did we want to go, and this is how much we'll have to pay. But we've already budgeted $120,000. BAC 160... RSK 160 to 170 BAC I just had a quick....160....we're awaiting an ordinance...we've sort of awaited that for a long spell. PD The problem is, we heard back from the consultant that we cannot use the fees for anything other than construction of the zoning. We can't use it under the AB whatever it is. ?? AB1600 PD AB1600 77 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK Get me on board here. What are we discussing? PD This is the child care mitigation fee. JUNE 5, 2002 BAC I guess my issue was if we're not going to do it, then we ought not to do it, and if we're going to do it, we ought to find something out here to do. PSG The only issue would be, then, to use the existing... PD Yes, the existing funds that have been collected. JMB Did we get Marriott? PD Yes...the existing fees that were collected we can collect since we imposed them, and there is a statute of limitations where someone can challenge them, and they didn't. But the determination we got was that you can't...unless we have a program to build facilities, which we don't, you can't...were (inaudible) in terms of collecting them. PSG So maybe at least in the middle we go and use the current funds that we have received for programs we have... JMB Some of the...some of the things that the Y asked for for the Jean Benson Center are capital improvements sometimes, so why couldn't that money be used for that? PD If they're building...building facilities... JMB Or enlarging or fixing up or... PD Not fixing up. JMB Enlarging? PD Enlarging... JMB Well, they've done that, too. PD Building facilities...and we do have how much money in the pot... TL (inaudible) need things such as carpet replacement or cabinetry replacement... 78 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PD I don't know if maintenance...I don't think maintenance (inaudible) JF But back to your question, why don't we have a program to build child care facilities for all our low and moderate income housing projects? We were going to do one at One Quail Place about four years ago, we talked about that... (Inaudible) TL They are funds that certainly we have a program that we could use. JMB We could use a center at the Hovley Gardens... TL Because we can't use (inaudible) (Inaudible — several people talking at once) PD If we create a program where we are actually...again, this last iteration, there is no child care center. TL Because we can't use housing funds or redevelopment funds to do that now. JF So if we have developer fees... (Inaudible) TL That was one of the challenges... JM We can use...we should be able to use the 80%. We can't use the 20. CLO We could use 80%, but the challenge was to using housing funds for child care...remember, we have to (inaudible) we could use regular redevelopment monies for that, and if we need to put child care centers in our projects, our housing projects, then we'll need to make certain findings and we do it. JMB Well, certainly the Hovley Gardens one is in the same thing as probably Desert Rose was, and it's going to have as many children, if not more. So if we need to have... TL An additional pot of money could be used to add facilities to (inaudible) such as One Quail Place or any other; i.e., Country Club Estates, in the future. And that money could certainly be utilized to a very good benefit for the community. 79 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JF Well, back to Buford's point, we ought...if we're going to have a program, we ought to put one together and get the ordinance in place. If we're not, we ought to just abandon it. I know this is the budget, but I really would like to look at putting together child care programs. JM Just to add one thing for Council's consideration. The State has put forward a number of programs that might make sense to explore, but there are some significant operating costs that can be accessed and even some capital. The funding sources can be broadened, I think, than to just the City. JMB Well, in the 150 we had, we collected, we didn't collect that at a time to build. That wasn't the intent in doing it was to help people that were living in there that needed child care for working in there. If that was collected before the new law, don't see why we can't use it for repairs or... PD I think we can use...well... PSG These were development agreements, so I think Dave Erwin...we'll have to ask Dave Erwin's interpretation, but I suspect we can use them for whatever we intended them to be used for. JMB Well, it says the purpose is providing child care programs, but that was an existing facility because when we collected it, that was the... PD I think there's a difference, then, between specific conditions of approval, which we apply on a project by project basis as opposed to we were talking about a general fee that would apply, and so I think we can spend the money we collected for the purposes that we identified when we collected them, and they agreed to it. RSK Did we get that thrashed out? CLO What I hear is that staff come back with a report on how we might implement it... JMB And how we can use that 150 to help do the improvements at the center. RSK Anything else up to 177? RAS 163 JF 163 80 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK Okay JUNE 5, 2002 RAS 163 is Art in Public Places. The Capital budget last year we spent $100,000, now we plan on $300,000? Is it for specific projects? SRG Yes, and it's actually about $350,000 a year. Maybe we didn't (inaudible) PSG Well, there's the $50,000 underneath for the El Paseo Exhibit. SRG Right. But there are specific projects on line, and the ones that are carryover items are the Park signage, Washington School fence, the Rose Garden, City gateway signage, Haystack Park, 1-10 interchange, and Monterey overpass. JF And of those project carryovers, we're not doing the Monterey over change, park signage has been on a slow boat to Gisborne...I guess my question, because I had the same one, is the $300,000 justified or is the $100,000 a more realistic number? SRG $350,000 (inaudible) we've got the signage at Washington Street we're working on (inaudible) so we've got a lot of projects coming down (inaudible) RSK Okay, anything else up to 177? RAS 167...why is our Library fund going from $213,000 to $295,000? RDK Because of the $80,000 for the public parking. RAS Oh, okay, that's good. BAC That's it...that'II do it. RSK That takes us up to... RAS 169, golf course improvements, $1,365,000 for this year from $867,000. PSG Basically that amounts to...in the Presidents meeting that Carlos has on the Golf Course, we had proposed over a million...that's the Golf Course Committee that deals with the operations, the day to day... CLO The Palm Desert Recreational Facilities Corporation. 81 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG There was proposed over a million dollars worth of capital improvements. The big one that I recall, and Dave you can maybe elaborate (inaudible) the sand they're going to replace it, it's been damaged by sand being blown in and, therefore, it's hard, it's hard for golfers to hit the balls out of the sand traps, so they're going to replace that. (Inaudible — several people talking at once) CLO The money that is used for this is money that comes from the project itself, basically from the IntraWest payments, so this doesn't impact the General Fund revenue (inaudible) RSK And the restrooms need to be upgraded badly. JMB What do you do with the old golf carts if you're getting 80 new ones? RSK Trade them in? (Inaudible) RSK Any more up to... RAS Well, I had one on 173...that's the Parkview Office Complex. You indicated, Paul, that you've already put the $500,000 in for the roof? PSG It's taken out of the current year. RAS So we don't have to worry about that. PSG Correct. RAS We can do it next year, but that's a carry over? PSG I have to talk to Tom because we're going to use the same person that Tom used on the roof here because the roof that the brothers put in there...we've repaired and repaired them, and they're still having problems so we figure we'll probably just (inaudible) RAS Thank you. RSK Anything else? Special Assessments...first ten pages. 82 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 PSG Special Assessments are really ones that you're going to be dealing with at the Council level. I included them here just for (inaudible) purposes, but you really...they're all landscaping and lighting districts. The El Paseo merchants adopt their own budget, so really, they're... RAS So does this include the new costs, or what does this include? PSG This includes...it's budgeted at the higher cost. RAS And they're paying for it. PSG Well, if they (inaudible), yes. (Inaudible) RSK Okay, anything in that section that you can think...to do something about? Debt Service Assessment District... PSG Those are controlled based on the bond (inaudible) RAS Explain to me 269 if you will. "Called Principal" from BigHorn...what exactly is that $2,385,000? PSG Basically, on BigHorn, when the property owner buys a lot from BigHorn, they pay off the assessment. We call it principal once we receive those funds in each year (inaudible). So we had two million three, so it's based on whenever they sell homes. CLO Redeeming outstanding bonds. RAS And this goes to the Redevelopment Agency? CLO No, this is the City. It's a City special assessment district... PSG We have a separate fund, so it's based on each district... RSK Remember, they came to us and asked us to do that. RAS So where does that money go? PSG (inaudible) from the escrow closings and that, and then we go to bondholders through our Bank of New York and call the bonds that are outstanding. 83 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS They're not Redevelopment bonds. PSG No, they're not. They're assessment district bonds. RAS Okay, so we put nothing down for this year, but obviously they're going to hopefully (inaudible) PSG (inaudible) there's no way of anticipating how much... RAS So whatever goes in goes out to the bondholders. PSG Exactly. RAS Okay. RSK Okay, Capital Improvement Projects, which probably mainly starts on page 296, 279. JF 276 really. RSK Okay. JF We show no expenditure with respect to Cahuilla Park unless it's folded in with the Cahuilla Trails System. PD Right. JF That's affirmative? PD Yes. JF The tennis courts are maintained under the Cahuilla Trails System? PD Oh no...they're under Park Maintenance. PSG This is strictly capital improvements, anything we're (inaudible) PD If you're interested, I have a preliminary plan for the regional park. We had a hearing at Planning Commission two weeks ago. JF Can we move to 279? 84 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK 279 JUNE 5, 2002 JF Where are we at on implementation of the Magnesia Falls Bridge? ME It's currently under design now. We're about 75% complete with design, then we start property acquisitions along Magnesia Falls between the Channel and Portola. RJF The intention is to go to construction after Fred Waring is completed, so it would be January, February, December...whatever. JF Of what year? RJF This year. December of this year... JF We're (inaudible) Fred Waring to be done by January of this year? RAS No, (inaudible) RJF We expect Fred Waring, the part out here, will be complete before Thanksgiving. RAS And then you can do Magnesia Falls anytime because it doesn't affect anybody. RJF Well, we said we were going to make sure that that one's done before we start the other. JF Sure, but if we don't have the property acquisition done, how can we start construction? RJF We have about five months to acquire the right-of-way. JF Hmmm, I thought there was an eminent domain issue in there. RJF Not that I'm aware of. CLO Even if there is, because there's a street, we can get immediate possession...it takes you 90 days to get immediate possession, so...I mean, I agree we've got to start getting the appraisals done, but we have immediate possession rights there. JF So assuming we can get through those hurdles, we can begin by January? 85 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 ME We'd probably start with the bridge first and move to the east on (inaudible) Deep Canyon. RSK I see one on here...the COD driveway on Magnesia Falls...are we responsible to do that? RAS What page are you on? RSK Still 179, that's the whole list of projects there...179 CLO 279 RAS 279 RSK 279 JF San Pablo Avenue — COD driveway...$400,000 RSK That doesn't seem... (Inaudible) RSK A driveway on Magnesia Falls... RJF That's the work on San Pablo going from the YMCA/COD driveway up to Mag Falls. RSK Oh, that's just (inaudible) RJF Where the tamarisk trees are... RSK Where the tamarisk trees are...oh, I see, okay...COD "to" Magnesia Falis...l've got you, okay. I misread it. RAS Are we taking out the tamarisk trees? RJF Yes, sir. JF Over on the west, is that our new road? RAS Police won't have any place to hide. 86 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JF And Kansas Street, do we have a solution? JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Well, our solution, if the Council approves it, won't cost more than a couple thousand dollars? RJF It's not a real high costly expense. RSK If you all approve what the Committee recommended, the Project Area 4 Committee, which I hope you do... JF Right in, right out? RSK Right in and right out... RJF (inaudible) median on Hovley. RSK So it's not going to cost practically anything. (Inaudible) JF (inaudible) drought tolerant landscaping. RAS Are we going to do a temporary thing with the cement and then see if it works? RJF Quite frankly, it will work. (Inaudible) RSK (inaudible) temporary thing to do...get it done with. RJF Whatever the Council's action is, we'll do it. RAS Portola Avenue/Dinah Shore Extension. BAC What page? RAS 291 BAC And while we're there, 290 as well. RAS 290 as well? Okay, that's Palm Desert High School...you go first. 87 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 BAC I'm just curious...we were concerned when this came to us the last time about whether or not the School District was going to do its part. RAS They have agreed to do 50% as I understand it...last time I talked to them. RSK Who was it? RAS John Benoit and Charlene...used to be (Inaudible), but now it's Whitlinger. BAC Okay. RAS Now, I don't have it in blood or anything like that. I'm just telling you what I was told, that they were willing to pay 50%, and Sheila did her job by going and, I guess with Dick Folkers, to talk to the people, and they got the approval of the residents, and so everything's copacetic as far as I know. (Inaudible) RAS It may not have, but I don't really think there will be a problem. SRG (Inaudible) RAS Okay, Portola to...on page 291...a million six to extend Portola to Dinah Shore. We're not going to go all the way to the 10 Interstate at that point, or we are, or? BAC (Inaudible) RAS Well, it's coming up on page 293, if you'd take a look at 293. (Inaudible) RAS Yeah, okay, but while we're talking about that, the Mayor and I were out last week driving around, and we drove down Gerald Ford, and we saw that part of it is being widened on the north side to two lanes, and then it stopped, and then we went up to Gerald Ford, we came back around, and Gerald Ford on the south side is still one lane. And so, the real question is when are we going to extend...when are we going to make Gerald Ford (Inaudible) RSK And would we use the Ordinance 416 when we do it? 88 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 ME For the Gerald Ford widening, we were waiting for some agreements to come in by the developers to see if they were going to reimburse us if we were to go forth and do the widening. RAS Can't we add that to the cost of whenever they do their thing and do it? ME I'm sure we can do some of the assessment work now. RJF Well, this is kind of the same situation we ran into on Dinah Shore where we're trying to work with the developers to either have them pay us or put in the widened roadway wherever possible, so Public Works is working on this, and we're going to try and do the same thing. RAS Because as soon as that school starts going, you're going to get a lot of traffic there. RSK So we're going to use our reimbursement ordinance when we do that so that when people come in and develop, they have to (inaudible) RJF We have some carryover on that, too, for that widening, so the intent is to try and get it widened from Portola....with four lanes from Portola over to Cook Street. RSK And my question...will we use the 416 ordinance? RJF That's one possibility, yes, sir. RSK That's a possibility, but wouldn't we do that...why wouldn't we do that? RJF If we can get the developer to sign an agreement, then we don't have to...one way or another, we'll... RSK He'II either pay now or later, is that the way we do it? RJF Yes, sir. RSK Okay, that's what I wanted to know. JMB Okay, on the proposed projects, and I don't see it here because this just came to my mind driving up 74 the other day, but I thought one of our goals was to connect sidewalks where they disconnect if there is something going in. And if you go up 74 and look, there are sidewalks...St. Margaret's just put some sidewalk up, so then it stops at that one lot there...the other goes up to 89 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 Sommerset and their sidewalk, and then it goes up to the next one and a sidewalk, and then it stops at my mobile home park. But I noticed an awful lot of people walking up from the mobile home park, and they've got wheelchairs. Coming down, a lot of people walk, and then they have to go in the street. RSK (Inaudible) RJF Yes, sir...one of the things that we were hanging back on was the undergrounding along that west side...that's something that's supposed to be done, and after that we were going to move on the program. So we have...the sidewalk program has been funded for the next four years, or it's recommended (inaudible) JMB Is that piece in it? RJF That will be in there. RSK Where is that, how much... BAC Well, one person's opinion...that piece that is missing there just above the churches...we ought to do that...whether it's the same stuff we used on the often -named road on the other side of the channel or something like that...we ought not to put a permanent sidewalk in there because if somebody's going to develop the Crest, then all that's going to be fiddled around with, and they're going to do an entrance there and everything else, and they're going to be tearing it out within a year. JMB Well, I saw the Crest was on somebody's agenda the other day. BAC I'm just....) don't doubt that, I'm just saying we shouldn't be paying to permanently sidewalk that... (Inaudible — several speaking at once) RSK Okay. BAC On 293... RSK 293? BAC Have we made the decision to go do an 1-10 interchange there? 90 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JMB It's supposed to be an entrance there. RAS I don't know that... JUNE 5, 2002 RJF In the past, there was a grade separation; however, I think there has been some discussion with Roy Wilson where the development the way it's taking place would certainly...everybody would benefit by having an interchange, and the distance to there is further between that location and the Ramon is west of Monterey. One of the arguments that CalTrans had in the past was the distance from Monterey to Cook wasn't long enough, but yet they could go ahead and put a new interchange at Ramon west of Monterey, which is a lot closer than the distance we're talking about. So I think there's some discussion about looking into that for an interchange rather than an overcrossing. Whatever, it'll take several years to get it all sorted out anyhow because of (inaudible) RAS By that time, it will be a real problem. The WalMart development is expected to generate, when it's built out, $200 million worth of sales a year. You've got Costco on the other side that's expanding. You've got Rancho Mirage putting in their whoop-de-doo, which will include a drive-thru McDonald's, and you're not going to want to be on Monterey. Monterey is going to be one of the worst streets in the City, even if it's eight lanes at that point. So we need a...yeah, flyover...I don't know, it's a tough place for a flyover. We were going to have a meeting on that, Dick, that you asked me to go to for you, but they didn't have the meeting, they canceled it. So... RSK But when we do have it, I think it would be good if you would come along because you have met with all the proposed development people. RAS I'd be glad to. But anyway, by the time that starts to get built out, you're going to be praying for another way to get out of the City. RSK The bad news is, the way interchanges go today or anything we're going to cross the freeway, it's six years. JF Yeah, we've got to be at the bottom of the barrel (inaudible) Cook and Monterey... RSK You're looking at four or five years yet for Ramon Road that they've been...Bob Hope....that they've been working on for a few years. JMB And they need that one. 91 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK They need it bad, but we have to...we need to start right now because... BAC That's why I asked if we've made a decision or not... RSK ....six years...we make a decision do we want to...we ought to make a decision. Do we want to move ahead or not move ahead, which I think we've got to move ahead and then start doing the preliminary stuff with CVAG to get it on the list to move forward because we're looking at six years. From the time CVAG says okay, you're probably looking at six years. RAS (inaudible) CalState and UCR that are going to be built out, and they're going to get... RSK Absolutely, and everything else that goes there that we don't know about. RAS It's going to go along the freeway, yeah. RSK This is a Council decision, and we have it on the Agenda here, so we can make a decision that we want to go to CVAG and say put it on a list there, we want to move forward. RAS Well, that's what page 293 is. You okay with that? BAC Well, what I asked was....it's alignment of a crossing, and I didn't know whether we're talking about crossing or intersection or interchange or what it is. RSK I don't see how we would fool around with just a crossing... JF It says an interchange at the top of the page. BAC Okay, well...in the description, it's different. RSK So does everybody concur with moving ahead with working on an interchange at Portola? (all answered affirmatively) RSK Unanimous, so Mr. Public Works... BAC Something to do next year. RSK Get it in the mill. 92 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Now when we do Dinah Shore, which is on page 295, are we going to make that four lanes...are we going to start with two and then go to four? RJF It's four lanes. RAS Thank you. RSK Are we going to look into dedicating a strip along the railroad there so we can actually have bicycle trails? RJF We're working on the Mid -Valley Storm Channel program, which has, I think, 60 feet of right-of-way along the south side of the railroad fence. So we need to work with the Water District to make sure the bike lanes can be included in this. JF I have a question, Mr. Mayor. RSK Okay. JF We had talked at one point about putting a right hand turn pocket on northbound San Pablo at Fred Waring...has that been anywhere addressed as a (inaudible) project? RSK It must have been when you were out of the room. JF So we're going to do it? RAS They've got to do eminent domain to... RJF Yes, we will begin the process. CLO We will look again at that issue. We tried it once before, and the owner was willing, but his attorneys got involved and everything went to hell, but we'll try again. RAS Page 321... RSK Okay. RAS That's out JF Yes 93 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS X that one out. JUNE 5, 2002 BAC Let me...actually, just a comment for staff to look at...we've got a bunch of other things here that are being done in the Civic Center Park....312 and 316 and 319 and so on and so forth...1'II ask my once a year hope question that we might actually get around to doing the other little pieces of signage that we've always thought about. JF I thought Sheila just said it was in her (inaudible) AIPP budget. BAC It's the...AIPP will be back to those unless somebody has used those obelisks now for a personal purpose. (Inaudible) BAC I was all in favor...I was outvoted. SRG (Inaudible) is moving forward with that, and we'll be looking to Public Works, too... RSK I'II help you if you'll help me with handball courts. BAC I don't have a...do you want them or not? RSK I want them. (Inaudible) BAC By golly, if you'll... RSK Well, I know it, but nobody's going to build them. MG Handball courts will be designed as part of the teen center. RAS Even as we speak. BAC They're in here somewhere. RAS They're being designed as part of the... BAC Yeah, 313, Richard...there are your handball courts. 94 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK 313? BAC I'm just saying...there are your handball courts. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK (inaudible) cheap, we'll never get it, though Everybody comfortable with all the projects? BAC Yes RAS Yes RSK So we're through with the projects? JF 329, real quick... RSK 329 JF ...is $2,030,000 just for acquisition of various parcels in Project Area 2...is that the (inaudible) open space? (Inaudible) JF With no particular land in mind at the moment. RSK You missed the last meeting. JF No, I was there. RSK Were you? JF Seems to me all three of them went down. RSK Well, we can buy the lot across the street... JF There you go. RSK ...where the right turn lane is. Might put our Sheriff's Department there, too. JF Have we put any money aside in next year's budget to begin the site acquisition for either the expansion or the relocation of the Palm Desert Sheriff's Substation? Any planned money, any site acquisition money? 95 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO No JF This is a problem that's just going to keep getting worse and worse... RAS Are you talking about the one on Washington or...? JF No, right here. RAS Right here. CLO No because what I'm working on is...Roy, basically through our pass -through, has the ability to....if we look at how much money we're passing through there...to bond about $60 million, so he's already agreed to bond about (Inaudible) million for a dog shelter, and he's indicated to me that he wants to bond other things in the district, so I'm going to say by the way let's look at a new Sheriff's Station because in essence, when you look at the Sheriffs Station, it was the County pass -through money that is being used to pay for it. Any my proposal is that's the way we fund a new Sheriff's Station again. RAS You'd move everything to another location? CLO To another location...(inaudible) if we vacate the existing station, we're going to have to negotiate...if we want it, we're going to have to negotiate a purchase price with the County minus what's still owed on it. JF And won't you reopen that big war between Indian Wells/Rancho Mirage/Palm Desert as to where the Substation should go as opposed to...one of the options we looked at, besides just lifting up the whole thing and moving it somewhere, is taking (inaudible) I don't know what the correct word is, Steve, but taking certain components out of that building and putting them in places that are nonessential and leaving the essential personnel where they are now to be more of either an expansion or...not a duplication, but...there were several options that an ad hoc committee looked at, but unless they have any money or funding or charter, I'm afraid that we're just not going to do anything, and they're already tripping all over each other over there. RAS How many square feet do you need? ST Well, that's why we wanted to do a feasibility assessment. Right now, we have... 96 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RJF We guesstimated about 50,000 square feet. RAS That's what you have right now. ST That's what we have right now. RAS And that includes the parking and all that kind of stuff? JUNE 5, 2002 ST We're in the same parking problem that you have in the City here outside of our gates. Our interior parking or secured parking is at a premium right now. As far as space goes, we're getting as creative as we can about relocating people...(inaudible) potential way of fixing problems is substationing out different components. That's not the optimal plan. I mean, it would be nice to keep it under one roof. RSK Moving it all under one roof would solve our problem with our vehicles here because then when they move, we would have a (inaudible). CLO What we will do is we will set up a meeting with (inaudible) and Roy Wilson and whoever you feel needs to be there and just go ahead and address this issue. RSK We should look to move it to all one complex. JMB (inaudible) be big enough for them. JF Yeah, whatever we do...we looked at ten acres on Country Club, and we looked at the land across the street, but whatever we do, it's going to take a little bit of money and planning and assessment and resources, and I don't see that addressed anywhere in the budget. And you talk about six years, that's probably what it will take until we... RSK Seems to me that if you moved out a little bit to where we have more vacant property, you could take a better piece. RAS Problem is that this is very convenient to our city. RSK What? RAS This is very convenient to our city. 97 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 SRG If you go across the street and buy the lot and the one next to it...we'd have to relocate the child care center, but that would go all the way down to that block (inaudible)... ST There's one duplex or triplex sitting there and a little nursery school there, but that lot without those two parcels would actually be big enough if you put a two-story facility in there which is consistent with the other two-story places along (Inaudible) JF It would be from San Pablo to Dr. Shah's building, which would give you guys... ST Well, there are actually complexes in between that... JF There's the Jewish day care center... PD Dr. Watson's is the other direction....but no, there's the one-story apartments... JF No, Dr. Watson's is the little single dwelling... PD There are some relatively new apartments... BAC Well, whatever, we ought to look at it... JF Anyway, it needs to be addressed because you guys, at least on the tour I took, you know, desperately need new space, and I can't see it happening at least in the next four to five years, and if we don't do anything this year, at least get something in the budget and get it headed in that direction, it's just going to get worse with no solution. ST (inaudible) I would think to get a better idea of exactly what it is that we need, so basically do a feasibility assessment (inaudible) at least say, in my opinion it would probably give us a better (inaudible) Indian Wells and Rancho Mirage, we have already (inaudible) where it needs to go based on a professional assessment (inaudible) SRG What was the cost of that? ST It was about $40,000 to do...that was a rough estimate based on (inaudible) SRG (inaudible) Councilman Ferguson and Carlos and me (inaudible) 98 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JF Can we add $45,000 to the Sheriff's budget for that purpose...$40,000 for the contract plus $5,000 contingency for any change. PSG If we're going to do it, let's put it into a capital project. JF Okay BAC Would that be a Cove thing with everybody split? JF Once you open it up to the Cove, then you start opening up removing the Sheriff's Station and putting it somewhere else, and... BAC Well, we're going to open it up when we... JF I know, but I'd rather....one Cove Commission member's opinion...I'd rather take a look at it in-house before we start involving the other two cities. BAC If I was one of those other two cities and I found out you were doing it in-house, that would confirm my suspicions... ST There's a way to go about doing it, though, because you'd be looking at it from the standpoint of in the future someday you wanted to have your own police department, that needs feasibility assessment could stand for that as well. BAC But I don't want to have my own damned police department. JF But from my point of view, Buford, if they do go somewhere else, we're also going to be studying how City Hall can use that space, and so... BAC I just personally don't want us to do a study that looks like we're doing something about what we want to do without including our neighbors, who are a part of this. JMB Take it to a vote. RSK (inaudible) the formula. BAC Yes JF Can we put it in our budget under the formula, then? I'd like to put it in our budget... 99 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Put it in our budget...put the whole thing in our budget, and then we can go to them and tell them what we're doing (inaudible) formula, but we'll have the money in the budget. CLO Second question...do you want me to set up a meeting with Roy Wilson because, you know, everybody is talking about the needs. I think we need to talk to the people that (inaudible — end of tape) RSK ...need to talk to you about something else, too, that's on the list here. CLO I'm willing to put a whole group of people together with Roy and say okay, we're looking into this, Roy we need $45,000 to do a feasibility study, can we take it out of the County's pass -through. Why use our money when we can use his? That's my point, even if it's only $45,000. JF I just want to get something done this year, and if you can get it done through Roy this year, great, but if that's going to add another hurdle... CLO I don't think so. I've already talked to him about it. I talked to his right-hand man, so we'll set up that meeting unless Council says no. RAS Dick, I agree with Buford that when we started this process, we (inaudible) JF Carlos, we can put that on the Cove agenda for our next meeting? CLO Will do. JF I apologize that... BAC I suggest that we take a five-minute break to honor the departure of Councilman Ferguson, plus we can stand up for a minute. (recess) CLO Justin, the $40 to $48 million, is there that much development out there...I'm talking about gross increment. When I looked at the number, I was surprised. RAS What page are you on? CLO It's back at the beginning, but it's related to redevelopment, and you will recall that initially when I was talking to the Council, the issue was whether the State would take some of the redevelopment money. Now State-wide the proposal is 100 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 to take $74 million, I believe, from all redevelopment agencies, and basically they take it as a proportion of your increment after pass-throughs and based on that, I think they want to take a little over a million dollars from us, and my comment was that even though a million dollars is a lot of money, given the $48 million we'll be okay, that the biggest damage is that when we go for bond ratings, the bond rating people remember that and consequently, they lower their expectations, and we don't get such good ratings. But on the other hand, because of the growth that's happening out there, on a gross basis, our Agency is doing really well. So there's no problem. The question I had is...is the $40 million for real? JM I'm going to have to defer to Dave, I think, on that. DY It is. We're doing very well with regards to the development that occurred even prior to September 11 t (inaudible) PSG If you look at page 340 for Project Area #1, you'll see that what we adopted for budget for tax increment for Project Area #1 Annex, we went from $17.158 million to $21.893 million, so over $4.7 million on that particular project area. RAS Do we show anywhere what our pass -through is to Desert Sands and Park & Rec and so on? PSG They are reflected in your debt service for the project areas. We have it as a lump total. It doesn't break it out by each project... RAS What page is that on? PSG Page 357 is Project Area #1 debt service. RAS 357? PSG Correct, under Debt Service tab. RAS Okay PSG Project Area #1, you'll see a total of all the pass-throughs... RAS So the projection is $9.7 million. PSG That's the County...the totals... DY We have it broken out, and we can provide you with that. 101 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS I would like to know that, just for my own information for Park & Rec and the schools...the others I don't care about, the housing and set —aside...and that's just for one project area...that's just for one project area? PSG That's just Project Area #1, yes. RAS So if you add all those together... RSK It's just going to make you feel bad. RAS Well, I know that. BAC It'll just aggravate you...why do you want to know that? RAS Project Area #2, the pass -through is going to be $3.3 million, so now... PSG Between $17million and $18 million altogether. RAS $17-$18 million? PSG The pass-throughs to all agencies. CLO Meaning we'll keep about thirty, that's a pretty good deal. RSK Yeah, but it's just the idea (inaudible) should be spending that...some of that money at least in our project areas...that's really the whole point of doing it. RAS That's why it would be helpful information. So you'll get that for me, Paul? PSG Yes, we can do that. Are there any specific pages on the Redevelopment... RSK Well, we ought to go through here a page at a time, I suppose (inaudible) a lot involved. PSG Okay RSK On the Project Areas, those are revenues...are there any questions or comments on the revenues? 102 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Well, this is just a general question about all of them...under Debt Service, page 356 where you were, each one of these Project Areas terminates at a certain date, correct? PSG Correct RAS So means Project Area 1 January 1st, 2004, is the last time we can issue any bonds or anything? DY That's the last time we can issue debt, but of course we're looking at SB211 and having the ability to extend that limitation for another ten years. We're doing an analysis of how that would impact us because there is a mandatory pass -through provision based on the new (inaudible) we would have, and so those studies are going on right now. RAS So if that (inaudible) gets passed, then the last time that we could issue debt would be January the 1st, 2004. DY For Project Area #1. ?? For #1 only RAS Yeah, but that's our biggest one. So at that point, what do you do? Do you go to the Council and ask that whatever is left you issue debt? CLO The idea is to be up to your neck in debt so that we have funded everything, and then all we do is collect money for debt service. DY And we also issue escrow bonds, too. RAS And that's what Indian Wells did when they pulled dollars out? BAC They're actually going to undo that. RAS Are they? RSK Yes. BAC Yes. PSG Well, they've actually paid on a cash basis...they didn't (inaudible) 103 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS Why are they going to do that? BAC I think the new City Manager figured out it was a dumb idea. (laughter) JUNE 5, 2002 CLO The new City Manager wants to talk to me about that whole issue because their idea was that they would close their Redevelopment Agency by using their General Fund to pay off a lot of the existing debt, which is a bad idea...you don't do that. And I think because the new City Manager with their former Finance Director has figured it out. So I think Buford is right, they're not going to proceed to do that. RSK As far as revenue, then...any more questions on the revenue in that debt service part? Probably the most important is the bond -funded projects... RAS Where is the $10 million for Westfield? PSG Under the City, we have a fund set up for separately for that payment. RDA, when they issue new bonds, will reimburse the City. RAS So all that money is set aside... PSG 100% of it is there. And if we pay on a cash basis as it goes, then we'll have a little extra in that fund because we accrue (inaudible) JMB That Desert Willow Parking in Project Area #2...does that include lighting out in that parking lot? DY That could...what it was, the money was set aside when we went to do the approvals for the hotel site and planning, and the Planning people subsequently required...placed an additional obligation on it to do additional parking at a future date when we came back with a resort hotel, so we set aside some money to take care of the parking obligations that we have. JMB But do we have any to put some lights out in that parking lot because it's awfully dark. DY We could use some of that for that. RSK To be more specific, we would like to see some lights in the parking lot. 104 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JMB It's very unsecure when walking out there in the dark. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK I had somebody call me and say that they really appreciated the lights when they go out to their car, and I agree with you (inaudible) some kind of lights so you can see where to walk in the parking lot at Desert Willow. JMB You're walking on uneven... RSK There are Tight standards but no lights (inaudible) so you can see where to walk. JMB It's very uneven...you walk out and... RSK Nothing like a commercial area but something just so that people can see to get to their cars. (Inaudible) low level, unobtrusive lighting. DY We'll take care of it. RSK Anything else on the projects? RAS Looks like you're doing a lot of work on all of our apartments. RSK Homeless Shelter — is that money we give to the shelter...on page 71... RAS 371? RSK 371 TL If you look at that, it's at zero — there's nothing there for 2002-2003, but that was money that was being at one time given to Indio and Catholic Charities, but we've stopped doing that. Legal Counsel said we could not do that out of Redevelopment funds. CLO (inaudible) we put in our Housing Element (inaudible) TL I don't recall (inaudible) I don't think we did, but I talked with (inaudible) about that. We have advised the shelters that they could go to RAP for that type of funding and encouraged them to do that. BAC (inaudible) RSK Looks like Bob is done, and you're done...Jean, you done in the big book here? 105 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB Yes, except.. Jet me find it...on page 432...isn't our telephone company Verizon? PSG You're right, we should change that. PD General Telephone has been gone for three or four years. JMB I thought that. RSK You're pretty sharp there, aren't you? JMB And also, could we not add CalState to the (inaudible) PSG Oh, to the public education part? Sure. JMB And also Southern Cal Gas is now The Gas Company, it's not Southern Cal Gas. RAS Who's Robert Driver? PSG They are our (inaudible) broker for...with the JPIA, and they assist us on insurance issues. RSK Okay...Items on the Agenda for discussion....Library parking...City staff (inaudible) wouldn't this work better with Buford, Jean? BAC I just volunteered (Inaudible) Mayor and Mayor Pro Tem. RSK Thank you for volunteering. I thought I was in charge here. BAC You were in charge, and you said this is (inaudible) RSK (Inaudible) not going right. RAS Well, that's not going right. RSK Okay, (inaudible) meeting room. RAS I don't know anything about it. RSK Well, they want to expand and enlarge the room, so there's some, I think, some supporting walls there that have to be taken care of, and they're...see, I got a letter, and I gave it to the City Manager where they were requesting $15,000... 106 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JMB No, they were going to use $15,000 from their Trust Fund. JUNE 5, 2002 RSK Yes, but I'm thinking they're just keeping us informed, and they want to do it, but why can't we help them do it? JMB (inaudible) they didn't ask anything... RSK They didn't ask for it. JMB ...they just told us, and we said... RSK We give so much money to people that ask for it, a million dollars here and a million dollars there, and somebody's going to do $15,000 worth of work, and it's a big part of our building, and it's our building, and I just think we ought to... RAS Can be make that decision here? CLO You can tell us to put it in the budget. RSK Put it in the budget. Does everybody agree with putting that in the budget? BAC Yes. RSK Okay, it's in the budget. Living Desert — request for funding of parking lot. CLO You have probably all been contacted by The Living Desert. I asked Steve to go through all that paperwork and summarize basically what they want to do. Essentially, what they want to do, I'II let you read it...under Capital Improvement Summaries...if you look on the back, there are the actual numbers. RSK Why can't this be from the pass -through monies? Why can't we talk to Roy about that when we meet with him about the Sheriffs Station? CLO We can. The problem that you're going to find if you give them Redevelopment money, basically you're looking at a $3 million plus because according to that bill that passed, anytime we use Redevelopment money, even if we give it to somebody else, it (inaudible) the whole project. So, if anybody needed Redevelopment money, whether Palm Desert or Indian Wells, and I don't that Indian Wells, yeah, they can because it's partly in their city... RAS Yeah, most of it is. We own the parking lot, that's about it. 107 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO I think staff is looking maybe to give them other kinds of money, some CVAG money, although I don't know that it would be enough. RSK What kind of money? CLO CVAG because you know... RSK Oh, I was going to bring that up when we were into that CVAG (inaudible) but I forgot to. JMB Are there any PM10 grants for things like this? CLO That's CVAG money. It's for cleaning up streets and roads... RSK (inaudible) PD (inaudible) PM 10 issues. CLO Right, and unpaved parking lots is one the big creators of PM-10, so staff has been looking at that. I had asked the City of Indian Wells whether they were going to respond to this proposal, and their answer is no, that's part of the moratorium, so they will not, at least for now, be participating. They will not participate at The Living Desert. RSK Well, they might change their mind, though. RAS According to Karen, she said if they committed to doing it three years out, that would be fine with her, and she'd go ahead with it. JMB She's also contemplating putting their main lots (inaudible) RSK Yeah, I'm sure there are lots of Board members that live in Indian Wells that we probably ought to put a little heat on. BAC Well, after Indian Wells (inaudible) benefactors pulled out of there, we just can't expect them to (inaudible) RAS That's right. JF Without having their names (inaudible) (Inaudible) 108 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS Well, from my standpoint, I cannot remember the last time we gave money to The Living Desert. RSK I don't think we ever did. BAC Well, the only thing we ever gave money for is we'd take a booth at Howl-o-ween. RAS Howl-o-ween...a couple of years ago I went to one of their whoop -de -dos over there (inaudible) (Inaudible) JMB We have never given anything (inaudible) RAS And as far as I am concerned, we've got two great cultural things in our city, one being the McCallum Theatre, and the second thing is The Living Desert. And I'm in support of doing something... (Inaudible) JMB The parking lot is the worst thing out there. RAS And what they want to do is terrific. RSK Yes, it is a really innovative idea. Are we all agreeable that we need to find some money somewhere? JF Well, it depends on what you mean. If we can get some of that pass -through money from the County, then I'm all for it, but if it's going to be our General Fund money, absolutely not. I don't question her desire to want to pave the parking lot, but maybe this is a bad year to do it, and if Indian Wells isn't a party and said they're not going to go along, it's just ironic to me that you pave a parking lot and then you get out and you go kick around dust walking around dirt trails at The Living Desert. I just don't...the hypocrisy there just strikes me as a little bit off, but I agree we've never done anything for them, and I'd like to help them out, but if we could use some of the County's pass -through or we could use some Redevelopment money to do that, CVAG, whatever, but I don't want to use any of our General Fund money. BAC It seems like a good opportunity to chat with the State and AQMD and all the folks who want us to do PM-10 kinds of things, and here's the perfect project and a 109 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 new technology, if indeed...I don't know if this paver technology is great or not, but if it is great, then in the long run maybe it's some neat things for us in terms of how we do some parking lot construction around tree wells and stuff that would allow air to move in and out and ya da da da da da da. RSK And I understand we got a report on that...that was the biggest problem, they didn't get water out for the... BAC Yep, and they don't get air in the soil and this and that, apparently this is designed to do all of those things, and so there may be some spinoff benefit to us if it works, and so we ought to go looking for some innovative...and I agree with you, not our General Fund but go look and, not necessarily this year, but you know, over time we can do something with it. JMB I'm sure she mentioned (inaudible) everybody, but when I mentioned to her that it was a bad year to do it, it was something to do with the undergrounding and then changing the water lines and all that that they had to do now for drainage, and then if they went back and did the lot later, they would have to tear up all they had done, and that's what we've always said (inaudible) don't do things like that. That's why she's...she knew it was a bad year, but it had to be done without costing twice as much. RAS We talk about 300,000 people going through The Living Desert. A lot of the 300,000 are visitors to our city. Not the next item, but the following item is an increase in bed tax. If we raise the bed tax one percent, that would pay for this. RSK It would definitely be another source. BAC So we ought to be looking at...l think that parking lot and all of that is on land that is leased... RSK From the Coachella Valley Water District? It is...l asked that question. BAC CVWD is going to be square under the cross -sights in terms of....if you want to look at unpaved roads and all that issue, they probably have more of that than all the rest of us put together, and I can't think of a thing they own that probably has more traffic on it than that parking lot. What a great place for them to put some money into. JF Well, and if they have 300,000 people a year, raising their ticket a buck would give them a revenue stream sufficient to pay off the parking lot, and let the people who are the beneficiaries of the parking lot pay for it. 110 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RAS They raised their entrance fee (inaudible) JMB Well, I'm not in favor of raising the bed tax because... JF I'm not either. JUNE 5, 2002 JMB ...because I think we have a distinct advantage of having ours the lowest in the Valley. It doesn't seem like much when somebody else is paying it, but the hotel (inaudible) and every time we go to look at something, and well let's raise the bed tax... RSK You think they really look at that? JMB Yes...ask Tim Sullivan, they do, they really look at it. RAS Well, yes, Tim Sullivan will say they do, but look what happened to Palm Springs. They raised theirs, and their revenue is up on hotels. BAC Well, I don't think we ought to tie a bed tax to... (Inaudible — several talking at once) RSK No, I don't think we should (inaudible) BAC But when we get to that, I don't think that has squat to do with where people go, personally, for one percent. JMB It does on conventions. JF It does on conventions. JMB It certainly does. It might not on the individual, but it does on conventions (inaudible) eleven, eleven and a half, and twelve...a big difference. JF Well, and the other thing that, you know, Bob, you made the comparison of the McCallum Theatre, which is valid, I mean, they're both definite attractions. The McCallum Theatre was going to go under, and I don't think The Living Desert is, but the McCallum Theatre Board raised $15 million (Inaudible) the five that we gave them. The Living Desert is only coming up with $250,000 of the $3 million that they're asking for, and it seems to me, having just completed our pet hospital 111 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 and some other major capital improvements, they could do a little bit more to pony up their share on this. RAS I don't disagree with that, but I think you're talking apples and oranges because the McCallum Theater is a one-time thing, where they want to build up an endowment. JF Right RAS People have been putting money into The Living Desert, I mean, you're probably a member... JF I am RAS ...so you get their magazine every couple of months which shows all the money that everybody gives. You've got a heck of a lot more people donating to The Living Desert than you do to the McCallum Theatre. JF In numbers, probably. RSK There's a lot of money we put into it so far. RAS Well, if you take a look at what The Living Desert was when I moved here 20 years ago and where it is today, that will tell you...it's pretty damned dramatic. BAC Well, we've asked staff to go look at it and come back to us... RSK You've got the message, there, Mr. City Manager? CLO Look at pass -through, look at CMAQ money, look at County pass -through, basically over a period of time. BAC And Water District. RAS Yeah, because she's willing to do it over a period of time. CLO Right. JMB She could probably get a construction loan. RSK Okay...next item is Eisenhower request. 112 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO Your action that you took when this item came before you was that you wanted to have a Study Session. What staff did, if you still want to have the Study Session, is try to get more information so that at least when we do a Study Session, you could have a better picture or the total picture of what Eisenhower is doing and basically out of that total picture what they're asking of public agencies. So I'm going to let Justin define for you what they want to do. JM Well, Eisenhower has a very, very significant capital expansion or plan expansion plan. One of their basic problems is one of their main bed facilities just cannot accommodate a seismic rehabilitation and then be utilized for beds. So what they propose to do, basically, is build a new facility in which they would have regular hospital beds, and then they would go back and retrofit the old facility to be able to accommodate administrative and other medical services that can be utilized in that building. Their current budget is about $90 million, retrofit and expansion, for this new facility. They've got, I guess, about a $25 million commitment from the Annenberg Foundation, and they would anticipate coming up with another $25 million from the trustees at the Hospital. They would probably do a, you know, their own bond financing, and they're looking for about $15 million from the various cities, and I think...they were complimentary...they said that Palm Desert was the leader and, therefore, about $7 million would be appropriate from the City of Palm Desert. RAS That's complimentary? JM Well, you know, they were selling. They are very interested in participation by the City of Palm Desert because then they see that as an ability to lever participation by the other cities. And I don't have the percentage here, but I believe they indicated it was a 42% utilization by Palm Desert... ?? 52% JM ...52% utilization of the facilities by Palm Desert residents, so there was a very strong benefit that accrued to the community of Palm Desert. I think...we discussed with them whether or not payments over time...and they indicated that some sort of commitment over time would satisfy their needs. I don't think we're in a position yet to make a recommendation to the City Council, but these are some of the issues that did come out in our meeting. RSK I didn't remember when Michael Landes talked to me that he asked for that much money. RAS He didn't. 113 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JF He was timid about it. RAS But he asked for seven. JUNE 5, 2002 CLO It was between seven and seven and a half was the number that I heard (inaudible) meeting with him. JMB What we might suggest to them if we can (inaudible) that we would like our name on it. (Inaudible) JM One of the things that we did discuss internally was some of the mechanisms, and in looking at RAP, looking at some of the other things that are out there that we could possibly influence the funds going in that direction. The RAP tends to grow over time, there might be a vehicle there that could be looked at. So there are some options if it's in the Council's desire to explore those. BAC How much has Rancho Mirage put into the McCallum? JMB Nothing yet. BAC And how much did Indian Wells put into the McCallum? JF Nothing. BAC You might go back and tell Eisenhower that's how well our leadership appears to work with other cities. JF Yeah, 52% of Indian Wells residents use the McCallum Theatre, too. And, by my math, you said they need $90 million -- $25 million is coming from the Annenbergs, $25 million from the trustees, I gather about $10 million or $25 million is coming from bond financing? JM I'd have to look into it. JF It sounds like the overall need that was left over was $15 million, and they were asking us for $7 million of that. CLO We've got some numbers that you might be interested in... 114 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JF I guess my question is how much is Rancho Mirage putting in? JM Rancho Mirage has not made a commitment. They came to a leadership city first. JF Be sure and mention that to Harvey Gerber. CLO In fact, the former City Councilman of Indian Wells was very complimentary of your folks and how you take leadership (inaudible). If you put aside all the politics and all the stuff, you have to agree that we all...when we are selling the area, one of the first things that we sell is the (inaudible) that we have with Eisenhower. Everybody, I bet you, in their brochure takes credit for Eisenhower. It is a big benefit to the Valley. It would be a shame if we did not keep that place up, simply because of the services that it provides. I think what Justin and Dave were looking at is...if we look at it as an asset to the City of Palm Desert, and if they can raise this much private money and thereby insuring that we will have that facility available to our residents, maybe it is worth looking into. I'm not saying that we've identified the money that we legally could give it to them, but it's something that we can look into because it is a big asset, and we use it, our residents use it, the whole Valley uses it. RSK I've used it a couple of times. JM I understated their total capital program. They did present something about $290 million, and they've identified about $140 million in funding sources, and they're out looking for $150 million. So there are other facilities that they want to build, and it's a very, very extensive program that they're entertaining. Ultimately, this is purely a policy issue, and we just need direction as to how to move to see if it makes sense if you want to explore further. JF Well, it seems to me Rancho Mirage ought to take a lead in this, since it's in their city, the same way everybody told us we had to take the lead with the McCallum Theatre. RAS And we did. JF And we did, and not one city has put in one nickel. And I recognize that we use the hospital, but we paid for that hospital, too, through health insurance premiums and through other types of things, and you know, I'm willing to do our fair share, but it's kind of like the Edison deal — unless everybody's willing to step forward to the table, I don't feel like Palm Desert has to take the lead on a Rancho Mirage hospital. 115 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 JMB I feel the same way. I can see why we did it on the McCallum, but I think it's Rancho Mirage's time to do it, the same as the Indian Wells complex belongs to Indian Wells. Tell them to go to Rancho Mirage and get them to take it on, but (inaudible) BAC I'd be curious to see while you're doing a little looking around to find out what the percentage of Palm Desert addresses happen to be also on the other two hospitals (inaudible). JMB And tell them not to count the Annenberg's $25 million as their contribution. BAC I bet we might be surprised at how high some of those percentages are, not probably for Kennedy. (Inaudible — several talking at once) JM I guess it's reasonable to say that we decline the honor of leadership? JF Yes, I think that's a true statement. RAS And tell them about our disappointments that we've had with our sister cities. BAC Sister cities with our neighbors...I like that. RSK I agree that it's a real asset to our community, even though it's not in our city boundaries, and when I think about people...they really have two industries... agriculture and tourism, I think you can almost say we have three...agriculture, tourism, and healthcare...because we have a high percentage of older folks, and I have a friend right now who lives in Santa Rose who's calling me to find out where he can stay...he's going to come from Santa Rosa down here to be operated on at Eisenhower Hospital because he had a condo here once years ago and remembers Eisenhower, and he wants to go somewhere where he's going to feel comfortable. So I think we actually have quite a few people coming in from other areas and staying here for the healthcare. If you look around, we have more hospitals and healthcare and senior facilities, so I think it's kind of like a third industry in the Coachella Valley, and we ought to do the best we can. agree, put some other folks' feet to the fire, too, while we're doing it, not just do it. But we need to look for ways to accomplish that. JF Well, I can't recall us ever shirking our fair responsibility of any burden that has been a Valley -wide concern, but I think they have either six or eight years to go 116 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 through this retrofit. It's a long-term capital campaign, and to start with us as the leadership, I just don't agree with that. I agree with everything you said... RSK We are the...you know, the Animal Shelter...we are the leadership on the Animal Shelter, the Valley -wide thing...they know we're the ones who step up to the plate, so that's why they came here first. But I guess there comes a time when you say hey, this is not one that should appropriately start here. JMB Well, but we found the funding for the Animal Shelter, we went after it to find it. RSK That's what I say...we were offered the leadership. So did you get your direction on that one, too? JM Yes, I think so. RSK Let's see what else we have here. Next one is the bed tax rate increase. CLO That should be a slam dunk. PSG I do have a (inaudible) asked me to see what the other Valley cities are charging... JMB They're all losing money, and we charge less and are making money. RAS What do you mean they're all losing money, Jean? JMB Well, on their TOT, they're all down, so in Indian Wells that's why they have a moratorium because they've got two hotels. RAS That's because they're remodeling the two hotels, and Palm Springs is up, based on the last Wheeler's Desert Letter I saw. JMB Well, yes, it's up because they raised (inaudible)...I think that's an ace in the hole we have when we really, really need to do something. RAS Well, from my standpoint (inaudible) ten percent, which is what every other city has on here except for Indian Wells...at least ten percent. If we went to ten percent, I don't think it would hurt our hotel occupancy. I think our residents would vote for it, and it would give us an additional $800,000 a year. JMB At this point, we don't need an additional $800,000...we've still got a healthy reserve, and I think it needs to wait until you really need something to take your 117 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 last ace in the hole that people would probably vote for. Any other taxes...the only reason they would vote for that increase is because it isn't affecting them. And I do know, if you talk to our hoteliers, when they're booking conventions, it is a factor. JF Well, I just think at a time when we're trying to lure a resort hotel and a conference center hotel, to raise the bed tax sends the wrong message. Like Jean says, unless there is a need to raise the money... RAS The hotel you saw the other day is at 15 percent. JF I know, and when they heard that we were at 9, they were thrilled. The hotel that we looked at....or the bank that we looked at that wanted to finance the conference center and wanted us to pledge 50% of our TOT assumed that we charged 13 percent. So I think it's a big incentive for hotels that we're lower. RSK Mr. Crites, what are your thoughts? BAC I guess I'm swayed by the argument of while we're out trying to fish for big hotels, maybe we ought not...this might not be the year to do it, and I like the idea of it being "an ace in the hole" and so on and so forth. I also find, and it may very well be true, but I also find it hard to believe that it would cost us any business. RSK That it would what? BAC That it would cost us very much business. That may very well be true, but I'm doubtful that that's true. RSK Bob, do you want to add... RAS I don't have anything to add. I've said what I'm going to say. RSK Where I'd be coming from is I know it doesn't make any difference for the rest of the hotels, but it may make some difference (inaudible) I have my doubts...I think people go where they want to go and where they can accommodate them, and the last thing they look at...they look at the price of the meals...I just don't feel like it (inaudible) like Buford, and I may be wrong. But the one thing that does sway me is raising it when we're out there trying to attract a couple of hotels. It's not very good timing. RAS When does the City have (inaudible) to go on the ballot? 118 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RDK (inaudible) second meeting in June, and I think there's a time after that, I believe August, probably the first part of August is about the time the nomination period closes, so we'd have to have that to the County so they can put it on the ballot. RSK Maybe you should verify that. RDK Okay. RAS As far as bringing a hotel here, I don't think it makes any difference at all whether it's 9% or 10%. It hasn't helped anybody come so far. JF You had a chance to come with me to the Tuesday meeting with the Four Seasons, and you would have heard them tell you what a difference it makes. BAC Well, see...now, I don't know anything about this. I also know that anything they tell me is...tainted would be a mild word... JF Let me put it this way, Buford... BAC ...let me finish my comment. JF (inaudible) BAC But they're not a source of anything that...that's like developers telling us that by golly, if we charge them and make them do this and that and make them do parking and all that, they won't come here. RSK (Inaudible) JF Agreed. BAC I mean...I start by assuming they're liars, and then we go from there. JF Okay, so if you go to the liars and go to the convention planners and the tourist people, and when you do City-wide conventions, which we're hoping to do with Indian Wells, the difference between $240 a night and $250 a night when you have 2000-person conventions, do make a difference to the folks from Chicago and from the mid -west and from back east, and if you look at the percentage of convention business that a hotel does versus the mom-and-pop that comes out from Carlsbad, it's a huge chunk of their revenue, and those percentages do make a difference. 119 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 BAC Then I would like to see some independent, not the people who are out here touting that issue, but I guess a charge to those who are of that persuasion, I'd like to see some good... JF Convince us why we shouldn't raise your taxes? BAC No, some honest data that says that that really does make a difference, and that's just not people who... JMB I don't see that we even have a need to have that at this time, and we don't need the money. We have a hard enough time getting people into this Valley with the air service we have, and the prices they have to pay for that, that it makes a big difference when they're looking at Palm Desert. RAS You should have been in Palm Springs when they just raised theirs, then, Jean. I mean, they just raised theirs. JMB But I don't know if they have any more people there. They're getting the money because they raised it, but that doesn't mean they're bringing any more people in. RAS They've got the Convention Center there. JF They've got a $2 million shortfall this year. RAS They've got a convention center. JF They can't balance their budget. RAS I understand that. JMB And they're about $2 million behind in the airport, which they would very much like to have itself pay for. RAS We're all talking about perception, and I don't know that that's really...I'm certainly not qualified. I don't know that anybody in this room is qualified to say what effect it would have. We need somebody that knows. RSK The only thing I'm qualified to say is that we have been lied to a few times. RAS You're right, and I want to continue to have a surplus because I think it's great for the City. If something comes along, if Eisenhower comes along and they want 120 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 $7 million, The Living Desert comes along and they want a million and a quarter... RSK The airport wants something to bring the airport... RAS ...and the airport wants something, and we try to give to everybody, and rightly so. If we've got the money, what the hell. They go to Annenberg, they don't go to Bob Spiegel to get the grants. RSK Well, let's see, maybe...do you think we need some more facts before we... RAS Well, I think we need somebody from staff to take a look at it and to make a recommendation and give us a reason why because all I can speak from is emotions. RSK City Manager, do you have direction on that to put some facts together? CLO Yes, sir. RSK Next one is Jazz Festival. RAS Do you want to do that, or do you want me to do that? SRG It's on here because the Council, some of the Council, discussed the possibility or feasibility of having a jazz festival. It's a huge undertaking...to have an entire production crew to do it or producer to do it, so staff recommended...it has a potential price tag of about $400,000. So we sat down and talked about it, Jean and Bob and Kristy and Pat Scully and me, and out of that came a recommendation from the committee that we go with a Saturday evening jazz festival in conjunction with the Golf Cart Parade, which we guesstimate would be a cost of about $25,000... RSK When is this? SRG That would be the night before the Golf Cart Parade, and we would try and rent the vacant lot right up on El Paseo at Larkspur... (Inaudible) ?? Joe Stein SRG What is it? 121 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY ?? The guy's name is Joe Stein. RAS Yes. JUNE 5, 2002 SRG Right. Put a tent on it, have maybe an afternoon performance at 4 or 6 and then another one at 8 and involve the Chamber of Commerce, involve Soroptimist, let them do the ticket selling, let them provide some volunteer assistance...obviously a one-night event would be far much less work than the four -day event we were talking about before. RAS And then tie it in with the Golf Cart Parade and have (inaudible) folks spread out in the Parade with a Dixieland group on each one going down the thing...the Golf Cart Parade is getting kind of long in the tooth, and it's hard to come up with something new every year. RSK Bob Hope can't ride in it any more. RAS That's right, he's not doing that any more. RSK $25,000 this would be? SRG Yes. RSK Advertising & Promotion — did they already look at it? SRG Yes. Kristy was in there, and she looked at it, and we would tag on to allow the advertising for the Golf Cart Parade, but we would also do separate advertising, but we would take that from within what's already proposed for special events from the marketing budget. RSK And they recommended it? SRG Yes...actually, we haven't had a Promotion Committee meeting where they've even considered it. JMB The Committee that has been looking at it recommended that it go forward. RAS And if we do go forward with it, then the next plan is to meet with the Chamber, etc. because we want them to take the responsibility for it, not the City, and tell them that we will help support them. 122 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JMB And with the Soroptimists. JUNE 5, 2002 RAS And with the Soroptimists, and have them get the vendors and sell hot dogs and hamburgers in the back of the place and so on and use the...we'd have Tammy Perezchica there so we could use The Gardens as a parking facility for the event. RSK Yes, that's public parking, isn't it? RAS Yes, it is, but I mean, just give them a heads up and make them part of it. SRG The Chamber had a...Parade Charities had an event the night before the Golf Cart Parade, which they, I guess, decided not to do this year. They didn't have a focus for it, either, so they would then be allowed to do some of the things, like a silent auction, that they wanted to do the night before if we had this event. JMB And the one they had last year coincided with the Relay for Life, so they didn't have... RAS Everything was going on at the same time. JMB Everything was going on that same weekend. This weekend, as Sheila said, rather than have a full jazz festival, find out if anybody in town (inaudible) for a lot less money. RAS And we've got local talent, too, available. RSK What do you say there, Mr. Buford? BAC If everybody's comfortable with that, I'II be comfortable. RSK We've got two people that are promoting it here, so they're going to vote yes. RAS How are you voting? RSK I'm going to vote yes. RAS Okay. RSK And then I have a question. BigHorn came to us wanting to help promote something going on on El Paseo the weekend of BigHorn, and we worked with the Chamber...whatever came of that? 123 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 CLO There are two issues. One, if you look in the budget, they were requesting $300,000. I think the recommendation from the committee from staff was to provide $125,000, so that's already included in there. The other one is they wanted us to have an event like the night before and to have somebody like a name band, I think they said, that they could fund that. RAS Didn't they do that at the McCallum last year? RSK Yes, but I guess it didn't work out too good at all. CLO This would be to have somebody like on El Paseo, get the merchants involved. They were not asking for any specific amount of money. I think they were just saying would you like the idea, and if we could get a big name band and help in coordinating it, that they would come up with the money to hire that, you know, somebody for maybe $50,000 or $60,000. RSK See, the perfect thing would have been that putting contest they're going to have, but it's a couple of weeks off. If they would have gone in ahead of time and talked to the Chamber and put it on the same weekend, it would have been perfect. But something like that is what they were looking for. SRG We tried that last year on a major scale, and we weren't able to pull anything together for that (inaudible) they wanted a band, but it was like a hard rock band. can't remember the guy's name (inaudible) RSK That putting contest they're going to have...if they would have done it that same weekend, that would have been great. SRG We couldn't get the businesses to buy in, we couldn't get...and then the residents (inaudible) about what kind of band it was going to be, and we sort of just let it go and didn't have it. JMB Plus it was July, too. CLO I stand corrected with regards to it's in the budget....it's an Agenda item in front of you. I read it, and I thought I read it here, but it's not...it's an Agenda item. RAS So it's not in the budget? PSG It's coming up as being part of this fiscal year. CLO For this fiscal year...allocation of $125,000. 124 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 SRG And the Promotion Committee did recommend $125,000. RAS That's why we still don't know where we stand this year on whether we're going to lose a million or we're going to break even, so it makes it hard to vote yes on something when you don't know where you are. RSK Okay, what else do we have that we haven't done? Anything? PSG That covers everything... RSK Covers the budget? PSG Covers the budget. RSK Staff doesn't have any questions? CLO When I initially made the summary, I mentioned that we had provided no funding in there to cover all of the new positions and the reclassifications that you discussed today. I also mentioned that there was enough money to cover the advanced retirement package. I didn't hear any comments on that. RAS We didn't discuss that. RSK He's not sure you all heard what he said. RAS Where was that? CLO It's in the... PSG Attached to your Agenda there was an extra sheet with the revised expenditures, and one of them was adjustment for 2.7% for PERS. CLO If the Council wants, I can bring you back...it's a Meet and Confer item...I can bring you back the specifics of how that will be accomplished. RAS I didn't know what that was. CLO When we were negotiating the latest MOU, one of the things that we agreed to, and subsequently the Council told us to investigate and to discuss it with the PDEO, is whether we would be able to implement the new PERS options that are available. We costed it out, and this is the additional amount that the City would 125 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 pay, assuming that the employees agreed with some tradeoffs. By the way (inaudible) would be the additional amount. BAC The employees would pick up the remainder? CLO My proposal to the employees is that they would pick up about 60% of the additional cost, and then if they agreed to that, I would recommend that the City pick up approximately 40%. RAS Which is the $207,000. CLO Right. The cost is over $500,000. RSK Buford? RAS Explain that to me again, how it works and how you retire early. CLO The 2.7% at 55 essentially means that if somebody is 55, you take 2.7% times their years of service, meaning if they worked 30 years, multiply that by 2.7, and it gives you a percentage, and then you multiply that percentage times their compensation, and that's their retirement. RAS That's their annual income. CLO That's their annual income. If they're not yet 55, it's less than that. If they're over 55, it's a little less than that...or more than that, excuse me. RJF It stops...after 55, you don't get any more...all you can get is on years of service. CLO I stand corrected...basically, once you're over 55, you don't get credit for being older, but you get credit for your years of service. RAS So if you wait until you're 65, and you've been here 35 years, you do 35 years times 2.7%. CLO Right. RAS So that's 80%. CLO One of the reasons why I recommended was because in the MOU, one of the things that we got the PDEO (inaudible) also is that we needed to address the escalating cost of the cafeteria plan, and my proposal to them that in exchange 126 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 for this they would agree to cap it at this year's level, which is a great benefit...that they would pay the 1 %, which is an increase to the employees' share, and that as opposed to a cost of living at 2.8, they would...we would only give them 2% increase. As an example, if you say a .8% increase, actual cost to the City is worth 1.2 because of the additional burden, so the reason I (inaudible) recommend it is because eventually the City would recoup their $202,000 because you're capping salaries at this as opposed to 2.8 (inaudible) and you're capping the cafeteria plan. That's how we could make it balance. RSK Question. CLO Yes, sir. RSK Our city is involved with PERS and retirement, so our employees get 2.7, somebody has 15 years of service when they come to our city with another city that gives 2, and then they work here 5 years, and we're at 2.7, do they get the advantage of the 2.7 for the whole or just when they worked here? CLO Only for their time with the City. RSK I knew the answer to that, but I wanted to make it clear to everybody. CLO Only what their time was here. What they're (inaudible) frankly is that all cities are keeping up with each other, so if people that worked for a city that doesn't have 2.8, most of the time by the time they retire, that city will have implemented it, and so then you can get that also. RSK But we don't pay a penalty because somebody came here and worked a couple of years and retired. CLO No RAS So when they retire, say they spent 20 years in one city and 5 years here, the 20 years is charged to that city? RJF Only in the PERS system. RAS No one is charged, nothing is charged because it's all part of PERS. RJF Yes. PSG Paid on an annual basis. 127 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RAS So it doesn't cost us anything for anybody that retires. PSG They are looking...currently we wouldn't, but they are looking at changing that, the language, to spell that out...the State (inaudible) requested that to be changed, and the State is considering it. CLO The question is...it only costs us for the years that they spent in Palm Desert. I think the question that Paul was answering is do previous retirees also get that benefit under current law? No, they don't. But somebody is looking to change that. RSK So what do you say? RAS I don't know enough about it, but I'll say okay. RSK Buford said okay already. Jean? JMB Okay, but I did wonder under... RSK Unanimous. JMB With the cafeteria plan that we have now and the increase in the PERS cost, does that come out of the cafeteria plan by raising the rates of how much we get on the cafeteria plan, or is that amount (inaudible)? CLO The formula that is in the MOU basically states that the City would agree to put enough money in the cafeteria plan (inaudible) to 7% of the highest cost. If we were to apply that, it would be about a 20-some percent increase in the cafeteria plan, which is already high. However, when I looked at the actual usage, only 10 employees, or 10 families (inaudible) are really using it all for medical. A lot of them are using it as additional take-home pay. So what I told the employees is that we would increase it only enough so that those 8 employees could still cover their medical costs, so as opposed to a 20-some percent increase, we only need to increase it by 4.3%, and it still covers everybody for medical costs, and they don't have to come out of pocket. It just doesn't give a lot of money for people to take home, but of course then the tradeoff is that they get (inaudible) retirement, and the City saves money there, saves money on the .8%. The compounding effect...in future years the City will recoup its $200,000, so to me....l would recommend it, and I know you haven't acted on it as part of the budget, but if the Council gives me the thumbs up, I'II go and tell the employees. 128 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY RSK We just did that. JUNE 5, 2002 BAC I think we did. CLO Thank you. RSK So don't go file any retirements until we have the Council meeting. PSG We have to adopt a resolution to approve it, also. RSK I know...1 told him I didn't want any filed before then. BAC Richard, it doesn't take effect until people are 55... RSK Oh, that's right, that's right...there's nobody here that... BAC No, they're all pups. CLO As a matter of fact, just for information, for those of us that are over 55, we don't get as much of a benefit as the younger guys, but we're willing to sacrifice (inaudible) RSK Why don't you? CLO Because you don't get credit for age any more after 55. RJF The current system, the maximum you can get is 2.418, so it's the difference between 2.418 and 2.7 times community service. RSK I thought it was 2. RJF 2 at 55 (Inaudible — several talking at once) BAC What else do we have on the Agenda — Jean, I have a two o'clock meeting. CLO Staff doesn't have anything else. Once again, on behalf of the City Manager's Office and on behalf of all the Assistant City Managers, Directors, and everybody, we thank you for your time. RSK Staff put together a good budget, so thank you. 129 APPROVED MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT MEETING OF THE PALM DESERT CITY COUNCIL, PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY, AND PALM DESERT HOUSING AUTHORITY JUNE 5, 2002 RDK We're adjourning to a Study Session on June 13th at 1:30. RSK 1:30 SRG We've got the transfer station (inaudible) BAC Oh, that's right, trash (inaudible) RSK Will you send a reminder out to everybody, too? RDK Yes, it will be on the front of the Agenda. RSK But send a reminder with it anyway, even though it's on the Agenda because sometimes we don't look at all that. RDK Okay. RSK We just take it for granted (inaudible) V. ADJOURNMENT With City Council concurrence, the meeting was adjourned at 1:50 p.m. to a Study Session at 1:30 p.m. on Thursday, June 13, 2002, for the purpose of discussing solid waste issues and the transfer station. ATTEST: S ILA''GILC ?CLERK �'5'-1 CITY OF PALM DESERT, CALIFORNIA RD S. KELLY, MAYOR 130