HomeMy WebLinkAbout1997-10-09MINUTES
REGULAR PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 9, 1997
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I. CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Kelly convened the meeting at 5:08 p.m.
H. ROLL CALL
Present
Vice Chairman Jean M. Benson
Member Buford A. Crites
Member Walter H. Snyder
Member Robert A. Spiegel
Chairman Richard S. Kelly
Also Present
Ramon A. Diaz, City Manager
David J. Erwin, City Attorney
Sheila R. Gilligan, Director of Community Affairs/City Clerk
Richard J. Folkers, ACM/Director of Public Works
John Wohlmuth, ACM/Director of Administrative Services
Carlos L. Ortega, RDA Executive Director
David Yrigoyen, RDA Manager
Pat Conlon, Director of Building and Safety
Phil Drell, Director of Community Development
Paul Gibson, Director of Finance/City Treasurer
Gregg Holtz, Engineering Manager
Gloria Darling, Human Resources Manager
Ruth Ann Moore, Business Support Manager
Paul Shillcock, Economic Development Manager
Rudy Acosta, RDA Project Manager
Lisa V. Constande, Environmental Conservation Manager
Agnes G. Flor, Financial Operations Manager
Rachelle D. Klassen, Records Technician
III. CONSENT CALENDAR
A. MINUTES of the Regular Meeting of the Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency of
September 25, 1997.
Rec: Approve as presented.
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B. CLAIMS AND DEMANDS AGAINST THE AGENCY TREASURY - Warrant Nos. 17RDA,
18RDA, 17DR, and 18DR.
Rec: Approve as presented.
C. REQUEST FOR AUTHORIZATION of Grant of Easement to General Telephone Along
Certain Parcels of Desert Willow South Course Development.
Rec: By Minute Motion, authorize the Chairman, on behalf of the Palm Desert
Redevelopment Agency Board, to execute a Grant of Easement for GTE along
certain parcels within the Desert Willow South Course Development
D. REQUEST FOR AUTHORIZATION of Grant of Easement to General Telephone (GTE)
Along Certain Parcels of Desert Willow North Course Development.
Rec: By Minute Motion, authorize the Chairman, on behalf of the Palm Desert
Redevelopment Agency Board, to execute a Grant of Easement for GTE along
certain parcels within the Desert Willow Development.
E. REQUEST FOR APPROVAL of Change Order No. 1 to Contract No. R10370 (Southland
Geotechnical) for Additional Geotechnical Services at The Desert Willow Golf Resort Project.
Rec: By Minute Motion, approve Change Order No. 1 to Contract No. R10370 for
additional geotechnical services (at the Desert Willow project) in the amount of
$3,385.57 and authorize the transfer of funds to Account No. 851-4663-454-4001
from the Agency's unobligated funds.
F. REQUEST FOR AWARD OF CONTRACT for Rosenow Spevacek Group, Inc. For Fiscal
Consultant Services for Project Area No. 4.
Rec: By Minute Motion, approve a contract with Rosenow Spevacek Group, Inc. (RSG)
not to exceed $15,000, for fiscal consultant services for Project Area No. 4, and
authorizes the Chairman to execute the contract.
G. PRESENTATION OF Portfolio Master Summary for the Month of August, 1997.
Rec: Receive and file.
Upon a motion by Member Spiegel, second by Snyder, the Consent Calendar was approved as
presented by unanimous vote of the Agency Board.
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IV. CONSENT ITEMS HELD OVER
None
V. RESOLUTIONS
None
VI. NEW BUSINESS
A. REQUEST FOR AUTHORIZATION TO RELEASE THE DESIGN -BUILD RFP
ON THE DESERT WILLOW GOLF CLUBHOUSE AND APPROVE THE
PROGRAM BUDGET. (Continued from the meeting of September 25. 1997.)
The following is a verbatim transcript of this portion of the meeting:
Ku:
RSK Richard S. Kelly, Chairman
CLO Carlos L. Ortega, RDA Executive Director
RA Rudy Acosta, RDA Project Manager
RAS Robert A. Spiegel, Agency Board Member
JMB Jean M. Benson, Vice Chairman
BAC Buford A. Crites, Agency Board Member
WHS Walter H. Snyder, Agency Board Member
JW John M. Wohlmuth, ACM/Director of Administrative Services
SRG Sheila R. Gilligan, Agency Secretary
DJE David J. Erwin, City Attorney
RSK Request for Authorization to Release the Design -Build RFP on the Desert Willow
Golf Clubhouse and Approve the Program Budget.
CLO Mr. Chairman, um...this item had been continued from the last meeting. In
addition, in between we've had a study session. Rudy will make the presentation,
you...you have asked him to break down the cost um...of the clubhouse and
(unclear). He does have that. If you have any questions, he can answer them.
RA Good evening, Mr. Chairman, Members of the Agency Board. As you know, we've
had ah-two rather lengthy discussions on, ah...the clubhouse subject, on...both on
ah, special study session and the meeting of the 25th. Um...there was a couple of
additional questions that were asked at Tuesday morning's session. What I've done
is, what, what you've just been handed out, you already have in your original staff
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RAS
report, although it was in a much smaller version and might have been difficult to
find. So what I've done, is, I've had it reprinted in larger print and made it into a
single sheet. But, basically it does, is it breaks down the major fragments of the
clubhouse project in an easier -to -read fashion, and all totaling the six million dollar
budget for the project. Additionally, there was a question with regards to if we had
any background information on both the Monterey Country Club Clubhouse and the
Palm Valley. We were unable to get response on Monterey; however, I did get this
afternoon some response on Palm Valley. However, I'm not completely sure if
they, if the breakdown is correct. But in keeping with the consistency of the
comparison chart that we handed to you on Tuesday morning, that clubhouse is a
private clubhouse, it serves 36 championship holes, 18 executive course. It is a
62,000 square foot facility. It was built for 17.7 million, which translates into a cost
of about $285 a square foot, for the sake of comparison. Um...however, there was
an asterisk that the overall facility is a total of almost 100,000 square feet, which
would significantly reduce the square footage cost to somewhere in the neighborhood
of about a hundred and eighty-five. However, ah...the information we got did not
account for where that additional 38,000 might go to. Without expanding, ah...over
what we've already discussed in the last two meetings, I guess I would, ah...answer
your questions.
I've got a question for the Director. Will the approval, or could the approval of this
clubhouse have any impact on the City's ability to participate in the remodel of the
Town Center?
CLO Financially?
RAS Yes.
CLO No.
RAS No? Nothing?
CLO When we looked at the budget, um...in...um...late May, you will recall that we said
that we had a couple of things that we needed to do; that we needed to restructure
our financing, which we did in August. This morning, I have, in fact, looked at all
those numbers, and based on the number that's in the budget for the Town Center,
the answer is no.
RAS Okay. Thank you.
JMB Ah...also, I notice in this green draft copy that you're sending out to people, it said
the cost estimate portion for labor shall be based on prevailing wage. If the charter
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city passes in November, then ever who is bidding on this will deduct what not
prevailing wage would be?
RA No, ma'am, I think that we established at a previous meeting on discussion of
prevailing wage rate that it would not affect Redevelopment Agency funded projects.
RAS But if you contracted with the City it would.
RA Yes, sir.
RAS If you contracted with the City, the City then would build the golf course clubhouse.
RA That's correct.
RAS And it would affect it. Is that correct?
RA Should the charter pass.
RAS Would it make sense, Mr. Director?
CLO Um...n-not from the perspective that we are contracted to deliver...um...a clubhouse
by a certain date. Um...I..I think we would fall behind schedule. I think it's the
same issue that we had before, and it delays certain payments. I have had our
um...analyst look at what the significance of the delay in payments would be, and
in present value, he's come back and...um...said that the present value of the
delayed payments, as a result of us not completing the project in time, would be
about five million dollars.
JMB
I guess I get more disturbed with all these things that we're approving all of
them...there's always a reason why prevailing wage, or going charter city is not
going to affect it, and that's what we're going charter city for, all these big things
don't, and say, "Well, yeah, but it's not going to make any difference.
No...(unclear) we're gonna' save, we're not gonna' save this much, we're not
gonna' do this." My other comment is that in the brochures that we did have a study
session, and certainly Rudy did a good job of preparing all that, but there were no
pictures of any of the public golf courses in there in the 3.5 million range. I...I
think we're losing sight that this is taxpayers' money. I don't see any reason to go
for six million dollars. I can see the Design -Build and see what it comes in at, but
to tell 'em they got six million, ah...you know they're gonna' use it. I think there's
still a lot of things unanswered on it.
RSK Any other comments?
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RAS
Well, yeah, I was the one that asked for this sheet of paper, um...it was given to us,
and what it says, basically, is that we're gonna' build a four million dollar
clubhouse, and then we're committed to an additional $300,000 for Intrawest, and,
uh...the processing fees already $5,000, the C-ah-VWD processing fees are
$180,000, the FF&E is $450,000, and um...ah...then you've got the exterior site,
the outdoor terrace, et cetera, et cetera. Um...which will run almost a million
dollars, so you're really talking, what, you're really talkin' about a clubhouse that's
a four million dollar clubhouse. Is that correct?
RA That's correct, sir.
RAS Um...'cause I know when you buy a house, generally speaking, you don't think
about what you're gonna' have to do on the outside, you got the guy build the house,
and then when the house is built, you decide what kind of trees you want, et cetera,
et cetera. Ah...and there's certain fees that go into this, like Art in Public Places,
that, ah...ah...add up to quite a bit of money on a project like this that you wouldn't
pay if you're buildin' a house. So, it's not really a six million dollar clubhouse, it's
really a four million dollar clubhouse, in my opinion.
RA
RAS
That's correct, as I said at the last Agency Board Meeting that, um...the intention
of this budget breakdown and the staff report was to not come back at a later date
with subsequent surprises to you, we wanted you to be well aware of all related costs
as well as the hard costs.
That's, ah...I don't disagree with Mayor Pro Tem Benson, I think if you tell
somebody, ah...here's "x" number of dollars, they're gonna' spend the "x" number
of dollars, they're not gonna' say, "Boy, we were able to save $500,000 for ya'."
Um...and, also, ah, as she suggested, this is taxpayers' money. Um...so
I'm...I'm...I'm still not totally decided when I look at some of the figures like the
Heritage Palms, uh...in Bermuda Dunes is 31,000 square feet, and they've opened
in 1997 this year, and it was 4.7 million dollars for their project, but it doesn't
include the FF&E cos -charges, which are $180,000 for us. Um...but it's 31,000
even though it doesn't have any cart storage, and we're talkin' about 30,000.
Um...then I take a look at, ah...ah...Troon North, which I've never seen or been to,
um...which is...ah...33,500 square feet and cost, ah...four million dollars in total.
Ah...and that includes a...ah...3,000 square foot banquet room for 150 seats,
ah...doesn't include site work, um...but, it's...it's...it's...it's a big, big difference
in dollars. Ah, then you take a look at, um...um...where am I...uuum...there was
one other one...
JMB (unclear)
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RAS
RA
...I had, um...I mean I'm not lookin' at Indian Wells, because it's a different
animal, they don't have any dining room for tournaments kind of thing, and they're
26,000 square feet compared to our 30,000 square feet.
The intention of the comparison chart was to kinda' give you an idea of where we're
at in the ballpark in terms of comparable square footage costs. The Troon North,
ah...anytime you put an Arizona project, compare it to a California project, it's not
a fair comparison because you don't have the regulations in Arizona that you have
in California, and typically, it translates into you get 20% more in Arizona...
RAS You do.
RA ...you know, before you even discuss...
RAS Maybe we oughta' build it over in Arizona, and drive it over.
RA ...Design -Build. Yeah, so it's not really a fair comparison. I...I think Troon North
stood out because it was ah...um...inspirational in both the application of the golf
course architecture and some of the site amenities that they included. Also, it was
a very nice facility, a nicely done facility in the level of service, but because we had
included its photographs in the golf clubhouse comparison picture book, uh...we felt
that if you asked, it would be here for you. Um...the only thing I can answer with
respect to, you know, setting a budget, you...you...you do have to go in, you do
have to set, along with your program, an appropriate budget so that the architectural
firm and all his consultants that join up as a design team, have a target to work with.
However, again, the beauty of Design -Build is that the contractor works hand -in -
hand with the architect. It's not an after...uh...
RSK See, I think there is an opportunity for savings, I mean...
RA Absolutely.
RSK ...just because we...
RA Absolutely.
RSK ...just because we were, ah, put a budget in at six million dollars...
RA Mmm hmm.
RSK I think for the Plan and Build is the best possible opportunity we have to go, to come
in below that. I don't think...
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RA That's right.
RSK ...that they, ah...contractor has opportunity to just spend six million dollars. I think
that we have um...a...ah...ah...contract administrator, or whatever the title is, who
is, a...a...I'm impressed bein' as knowledgeable as anybody I know in this process,
and I think that he's demonstrated, ah...with the ah...Park and Rec Building that he
can do that and bring it in below, and I would expect that he's going to be able to do
that here, but we do have to budget for that, and this is the best opportunity we're
gonna' have to bring it in at the, where we get the most for our money. And, we
have ah...ah...80-some million dollar um...ah...project out there, and we're in the
midst of attracting upscale hotels, and one of the very, one of the things that is the
best bait there is in the world, you can't catch any fish without the right bait.
And... isn't that right?
BAC Yes, sir!
RSK I showed Mr. Crites that. Demonstrated that. But...the...the...the thing is, this is
gonna' be the center of the whole project. It's gonna' serve all of the hotels plus our
citizens, and I for one, as a citizen, when I have a guest, and I'd like to take 'ern out
to Desert Willow for lunch, I don't want to take 'ern out to someplace like they have
in other cities I know around, that I would never take a guest to. I would like to be
proud, and take them out to something like Troon North. And, so, y'know, I just
think it's extremely important that we move ahead with the clubhouse, and I think
it's extremely important that we have something that we can brag about, and I think
that we have the best opportunity to do something extremely economical, where
we're gonna' get more for our money than any other clubhouse, other clubhouses
that we looked at.
RA
JMB
That's correct. Just...one more point of reference, um...you know in the industry,
typically, a rule of thumb is that you spend a minimum 50% on your clubhouse
facilities of the golf course cost. Well, by the time we build both golf courses and
have 36 holes there, we'll be sittin' at, y'know, in excess of 20 million dollars,
um...and a clubhouse of six million dollars is not an extravagant expenditure in the
industry, ah...you know, as far as comparisons go. And, ah...the Mayor's correct,
we, ah...we have enjoyed great success with both our Design -Build projects to date,
um...and, and the maintenance facility is certainly no exception, um...to that, it's
ah...it's ah...it's...it's the envy of the golf course industry at this point, and we
received 2,500 square foot more than the program required.
Well, I think, ah...I would be happy with Troon North, too, but it only cost 3.8
million, so, ah...I think there's a big difference there between the six and the 3.8.
I think if ours looked like that for 3.8, I'd be happy, too.
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RAS Maybe there's a compromise between Burger King and Cuistot.
WHS Mr. Mayor, ah...I agree with the comments that you just made relative to the
clubhouse, and I feel that the excellent program that the staff has put together and
the presentations they made to us Tuesday and a complete breakdown of all the
analysis of why they're at where they're at, and...ah...I believe that I would like to
make a motion to authorize the Agency Board staff to Release the Design -Build RFP
on the Desert Willow Clubhouse.
RSK Anybody like to second that?
RAS We11...no...I'd like to hear from Councilman Crites because he's been on the
committee from the get -go...
RSK I'm gonna' second it, so...
RAS Okay well that's fine. Like to hear comments from a member of the committee.
BAC All right. I'll start with a couple questions. Ah...one, when you look at cost per
square foot that's in our little Pearson & Associates booklet...
RA Mmm hmm.
BAC ...are those costs per square foot calculated, in essence, identically to the way we
calculated the 3.888 million that I find on the sheet you handed today?
RA Those costs comparisons were simply a breakdown of the square footage divided into
the ah...
BAC The bill.
RA ...final construction costs, and as you notice, we put dates of when they were
constructed. Um...
BAC Well the reason I ask it is because I notice some of them include site work and some
don't...
RA That's right.
BAC ...and some this, and some don't...
RA That's right.
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BAC ...so that in reality, that cost per square foot in this...
RA Does go up.
BAC Well, goes up, goes down, it doesn't mean anything to me.
RA Well...
BAC `Cause there's, it doesn't compare, it doesn't compare, you know, we've got a
hundred and thirty-five dollars a square foot.
RA Mmm hmm.
BAC But...and I...I can adjust for the fact this was built in 1988, and obviously that's not
the same money and so on so forth, but when I see somebody else doing one for a
hundred and fifty a square foot, or three hundred, or a hundred and seventeen, I'd
like to know that, that's a comparable to our 135 in terms of what it's calculated on,
and I, I don't think that's true...necessarily. Is that right?
RA Well...um...based on um...my experience and based on the consultants' experience
and based on the design team's experience, um...they are comparable from the
standpoint of level of appointment, ah...building systems, whathaveyou, but each
and every one of these, ah, clubhouses are different. They all, ah, are responses to
different programs, different markets, whathaveyou. Plus, plus the other thing is
that, um...ah...in a lot of these, you have the operator functioning in them, so they
don't have a lot of the most accurate information on there. But, I think it gives you
a good idea of the spread. The question was asked, "How much did these
clubhouses cost?" We give you that, and then we give you the comments as to what
we were unable to get the information on to give you an idea. I think that when you
compare that and you see that we're including everything in here, I think you can see
that we, ah, you know, I've said before, it's not an extravagant program for us.
BAC Is your hundred and thirty-five dollars a square foot including everything on the
page?
RA No. That, that is...
BAC It's a hundred and thirty-five dollars a square foot before we add all this.
RA That's...that's for the building systems, mechanical, floors, walls, ceilings.
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BAC Okay. Right. Whereas, let's say The Citrus one, is a hundred and eighty dollars a
square foot.
RA Mmm hmm.
BAC That includes everything on...what would be on our page that we were handed this
afternoon, right? All the fees...'n the furnishings, `n the this `n the that, right?
RA Yes.
BAC So...that hundred and eighty a square foot's not really comparable to this a hundred
and thirty-five a square foot.
RA I don't know what they paid for FF&E; I don't know what that portion is. Um...but
my guess would be when we spoke to the general manager over there, my guess
would be that they spent, um, in the higher end. I mean, it's not uncommon to
spend forty dollars a square foot for FF&E, ah, and, um, my guess would be that
they would probably be in the fifty to fifty-five dollar range.
_ BAC In response to Jean's comment about Troon North, if, indeed, Arizona gets you 20%
more on the dollar, and Troon North, in essence, cost four million, and you add
eight hundred thousand for Arizona versus California, and then you note that they
don't include site work, which in ours is a million dollars, then Troon North, by
comparison, would be right at six million dollars...built in California with site work,
right?
RA I...I would say that that's pretty accurate.
BAC But I still see ours coming in at about...is that what you?
RAS Two hundred...two hundred dollars a square foot. Six million -dollar clubhouse,
30,000 square feet, two hundred dollars a square foot, right?
RA All cost. All cost.
BAC All cost.
RAS All cost.
BAC Yeah. Um...
JMB And their banquet room was a hundred and fifty.
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RA
This...ah...one of the things this doesn't in -include in here, too, is that this is all
design and engineering cost, as well, for that hundred and thirty-five dollars a square
foot. The Design -Build includes turnkey package, so that includes all your soft
costs, as well.
BAC Yeah. One question that's...
RSK Is there architect fee in there?
RA It's not broken out, but it's in, it's in the, ah, ah, guaranteed turnkey price. They
have to include it in there.
BAC The last time we talked about this, I was asking about how we were going to go
about rewarding people for energy innovations and so on...
RA That's correct.
BAC ...when I looked through the package, I didn't see anything that wasn't there before.
RA It's, it's still a draft. It's still a draft. Um...the final markup includes the language
that you have requested.
BAC It does?
RA Yes, sir. And, and also will include some specif, excuse me, specific language on
the Art In Public Places process, as well. John was in the process of finishing the
RFP portions of that.
RSK
Yeah, we talked about that. You weren't able to attend the meeting, but that this
was going to be an opportunity to maybe, the first time really integrate art into the
building...
BAC Yup.
RSK ...which I don't think we've successfully done so far.
BAC No, we've gotten it on our freeways, but not in our buildings.
RSK We got it in the fence around Desert Willow.
BAC Yup.
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RSK That's probably the first time that we really actually had art in the building process.
That that's the challenge that they're gonna' take on.
BAC How much are we paying various each firm?
RA I'm sorry?
BAC How much are we going to pay each of the invited firms for doing their packet?
RA A stipend you're talking about?
BAC Yeah.
RA Um...I think the Committee discussed that would be «rr,...i..:ate is to narrow it down
to five teams, five -six teams...
BAC Right.
RA ...at a cost of about five thousand dollars apiece. We award...
BAC So about $25,000?
RA Yes, sir. We, ah, I think the stipend on the maintenance facility was two thousand
dollars. Um...typically, my, ah, breakdowns on the Rec Center and on the
maintenance facility, we were getting, um...um...expenditures on their end from
anywhere from as low as seventy-five hundred on up to twenty thousand dollars for
their effort. Um...this is a quite extensive design -development competition, so,
they, ah, ah, my guess is, is things are real busy now, it's going to be kinda'
interesting to see how much response we get this year on this project, although there
is a lot of interest in it. When they see what we're asking for, um, I'm curious to
see how many will actually step up to the...plate.
BAC And, again, your assumption is that by doing it this way that the bids that we get
back will come back significantly lower than six million dollars.
RA I'm not saying that they will significantly come back lower, I'm saying that you will
get the maximum amount of product for that, and not to be surprised that you won't
get more square footage, or you might get lower, lower cost. That has happened on
the last couple of processes.
JMB And they know we have an eighty-one million dollar project, they're not going to
come in to save us any money.
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RA Well, they also know that they're competing; that's the key.
RSK They want the work, they're gonna' have to sharpen their pencils.
WHS Especially if you have four, or five or six people trying to get the job.
BAC And when will it be back to us?
RA Um...given approval tonight, it'll probably take us three weeks to four weeks
to...um go out for request for qualifications. We will break down the, ah, numbers,
and then at that time, we'll, ah, ah, ask for appropriation of the stipend and release
of the final draft. Ah...so that they can go into the eight -week process of generating
the ah...graphic documents and the proposal cost, the final proposal cost.
JMB Well, if it's three weeks before the draft goes out, then that prevailing wage can
come out of it, because if the charter city passes, it doesn't have to be in there.
RA Well, I think we discussed...
BAC It has to be in there unless...
RA ...we still...
BAC ...unless we have th-, unless we shift the whole thing over and...
RA That's right.
BAC ...change it, as long as Redevelopment Agency pays for it, they have to pay
prevailing wage.
RA I think we also said that...
JMB (Unclear)
BAC By law.
WHS (Unclear)
RA ...we also said that the process probably wouldn't make a final decision on
prevailing wage until January or February, which would make it nearly impossible
for us to deliver a clubhouse by the deadline date.
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RSK Any other comments or questions?
RAS I...I...would really like us to look at the prevailing wage thing again. Um...as I
understand it, the City could build the clubhouse.
RSK We do, even if we approve this, have the opportunity to, to continue to work on
that?
RA Um, yes, of course.
RAS I mean, you're saying that it's gonna' be three months after the election, and I don't
know that it's gonna' be three months...(unclear)...I mean, no one has told me that
if it, the charter city passes, it's gonna' take that long for it to go into effect.
Nobody's told me that.
RSK We can still, as we go through the process, it would seem to me, explore that.
RA The only, the only thing I need to know when I release the RFP is that I need to give
them the direction on whether they will be bidding it prevailing wage or not, `cause
it will significantly affect their design.
BAC You can tell, tell them to give us both options. I mean, hell, if they can't figure that
out, they ought not be pourin' concrete.
RA Well...um...except for the fact that, ah, when you're going through a design
process, it does make a difference.
RAS Well how long would it, well how long do we have to wait? Somebody on staff find
out when the charter goes into effect if it's passed.
JW The... Honorable Mayor, Members of the Council, the, ah, election in November
will determine if we're a charter city or not.
RAS Correct.
JW The election is verified or certified...
SRG Certified by the County, and they have 30 days from the election to do that. I
anticipate it will be no more than 21 days.
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JW
So the Council, in the first meeting in December 1997, could make a decision
whether to have staff prepare an ordinance to opt out of prevailing wage, have the
first reading, first meeting in December; the first reading of the ordinance.
DJE Correct.
BAC And I think...
RA
Can I go back to your question, though? I don't know if I answered your...um...in
the design press, process, I'm an architect, you come to me with a particular budget,
and you want me to give you two prices, it's going to effect the way I appoint details
and systems and whathaveyou, I mean if there's a $500,000.00 difference, it's pretty
significant...
BAC No, all you to...
RA ...or three hundred.
BAC
No, all you have to do at the end is say, if this is constructed under prevailing wage,
it'll, your, our labor will be approximately this, if it's not, our labor will be
approximately that. That's all they have to do. I know that's not all they have to
do, I know that's a gross simplification. I'm not, but that's, that's what they're in
business for.
RA Yeah.
BAC I would note...
RA Well...
BAC ...that one of...
RA ...then, then what you're asking for is that, assume it is prevailing wage rate, design
it to that budget, and then, should we pass the ordinance...
BAC How much less would it be?
RA ...then we, then we get a discount off of it.
BAC Right, right. And I need to...
RA For labor only.
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BAC Right, right. I'm...
RA It will not affect the level of appointment of the design elements, whathaveyou.
BAC ...no, no, no, no, right. I think we also need to note that becoming a charter city
does not automatically mean we do or do not pay prevailing wage. That's a...that's
a decision that...
RSK And there's a lot of other reasons.
BAC ...and there, I was gonna' say, but that is a decision that we have to make at that
point, and there are arguments that I suspect people will wish to come and make to
this body about why prevailing wage should not be used, and there are people who
are gonna' wanna' come in here and tell us about why prevailing wage should be
used. And, I don't have to be particularly...knowledgeable of the future to hear
someone coming in and telling us that not paying prevailing wage is the civic
equivalent of taking our jobs to Mexico and manufacturing them there. It's just an
attempt to pay lower wages and not do the right thing by American workers. And
we can argue the right of that or the wrong of that, but, but, but people are gonna'
come and make argument to us that, that we owe American workers prevailing
wages; not an attempt to lower it to the least common denominator, and we can sit
in here and argue about that issue, but...
RSK Yeah...we could fire people and hire cheaper people.
BAC That's mine...but, you know, we can't just automatically assume that passage of one
thing equals the other, and that it's the policy decision we'll have made and so on
and so forth.
RAS I understand that, but we're not talking Mexico wages versus wages in the United
States here.
BAC I understand that, but...
RSK We're talking of principle.
BAC We're talking about a principle about, and there are some philosophical issues `n
that, that, that I think will deserve...
RAS To be heard.
BAC ...to be heard and given careful consideration by the people who sit at this table.
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RAS (Unclear)..that's over (unclear) million dollars.
RA One of the things that Council should keep in mind on when you
use...um...prevailing wage rates, it does require certain level of qualifications and
certifications and apprenticeships and whathaveyou levels, so that you have the
confidence that the person who is on the job, whether they're hammering nails or
running conduit or setting concrete, has passed a certain level of qualifications to be
able to perform that job. Taking that away leaves you wide open, and for myself,
I would ask the question, "Do I want to take that risk on a project of this exposure?"
RSK Any other questions or comments? Please vote.
BAC I had a comment, and I'll do it. I'll make the comment after I've voted.
SRG Has everyone voted? Councilmember Benson you voted, "No"?
JMB No.
SRG Well the motion carries by a 3-2 vote with Councilman Spiegel and Councilmember
Benson voting NO, am I right? Okay.
RSK Now your comment.
BAC My comment is...(clears throat).
RA Oh, I'm sorry.
BAC That's all right. You own me now, you can go away and not pay any attention, all
that.
RSK Why don't you...(unclear)
BAC You have worked for Carlos too long.
WHS You got your vote, tell 'ern to go to hell.
RSK Do like Phil Drell does, just do a plop-er-oo.
BAC My comment is, that "Yes" vote indicates that I understand that we have contractual
issues that we have to look at in terms of, of, of timing of building this. If your bid
package doesn't indicate strongly to people that what they have is a Council that is
very concerned about what the bottom line of this is, we are very likely to get back
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one, two, three, four, five, six bid packages, and have a "No" on the entirety of
'ern.
RSK Yeah, we just set a budget.
BAC I have no interest in spending the six million dollars to do this. And I understand the
value of this program. I understand how we're trying to compare different kinds of
things and so on and so forth, but anyone who wants to be successful, at least from
this point of view, needs to have an innovative approach, they need to have some
architecture that doesn't look somewhat reminiscent of...fill in the blank, um, they
need to have some bold energy efficient approaches, and they need to be significantly
built below that six million dollar figure.
RSK We just set a budget.
BAC Yeah.
RSK We didn't approve all those other things.
BAC I understand, I'm just making the comment that's in that bid package...folks need to
understand that at least as one member of this Council.
RA Understood.
RSK I understood all that stuff before.
BAC I know it, but that's because you're a Councilmember, and I have to speak to staff,
and make these comments, and so.
RA Thank you.
RSK We appreciate the enlightenment.
For purposes of clarification, Member Snyder moved to, by Minute Motion, authorize the Agency
Board Staff to release the Design -Build RFP on the Desert Willow Golf Clubhouse and approve the
Program Budget in the amount of $6 million. Motion was seconded by Chairman Kelly and carried by
a 3-2 vote with Vice Chairman Benson and Member Spiegel voting NO.
VII. CONTINUED BUSINESS
None
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VIII. OLD BUSINESS
Mr. Ortega noted that Items A and B of Old Business have been before the Board previously,
the Board last time requesting they be taken back to a committee consisting of two Board
members and staff. He stated that this had been accomplished with the recommendations now
back before the Board. He added that Mr. Shillcock was available to answer questions from
the Board.
With Agency Board concurrence, Chairman Kelly suspended the agenda at this point to consider Item
B. Please see that item for discussion and action.
A. REQUEST FOR CONSIDERATION OF EXTENSION OF CONTRACT FOR SERVICES
WITH THE DESERT COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT AUXILIARY.
Member Spiegel stated that the "Services" stated in this contract have not been well defined.
He noted that the request asks for $50,000.00 to spend on an as -needed basis, and that he is
sure that there will be projects which come to the Economic Development Manager that need
to be done by the College. He suggested that these projects come before the Agency Board for
review as they come up rather than extending the contract as is.
Member Crites suggested that the the $50,000.00 be set aside to be expended when approved
by the Redevelopment Agency Board.
Member Spiegel moved to, by Minute Motion, deny extension of the existing contract but approve
$50,000.00 to be set aside so that cases might come before the Redevelopment Agency Board on an as -
needed basis for approval. Motion was seconded by Snyder and carried by unanimous vote.
B. REQUEST FOR APPROVAL OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT WORK PROGRAM
FISCAL YEAR 1997-98.
Member Spiegel stated that he and Member Snyder met with the City Manager, Economic
Development Manager, Director of Community Development and Business Support Manager.
He noted that he is in total agreement with the request as it stands. Member Snyder concurred.
Member Spiegel moved to, by Minute Motion, approve the Program as submitted. Motion was
seconded by Member Snyder and carried by unanimous vote of the Council.
IX. REPORTS, REMARKS, AND AGENCY BOARD ITEMS REQUIRING ACTION
A. EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR
Mr. Ortega noted the items listed on the Agenda for Closed Session.
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B. AGENCY COUNSEL
Request for Closed Session:
Mr. Erwin noted the items on the Agenda for Closed Session.
Conference with Legal Counsel - Anticipated Litigation pursuant to Section
54956.9
Number of potential cases 2
Conference with Legal Counsel - Existing Litigation pursuant to Section
54656.9
Stull v. Bank of America NT & SA, et al, Superior Court of State of
California City and County of San Francisco, Case No. 968-484
Conference with Real Property Negotiator pursuant to Section 54956.8
1. Property: Land located in Section 4
Negotiating parties: United Properties Limited
Agency: Carlos L. Ortega/Dave Yrigoyen
Property owner: Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency
Under negotiation: X Price X Terms of payment
C. CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS OF THE AGENCY
None
Upon a motion by Member Crites, second by Spiegel and unanimous vote of the Agency Board,
Chairman Kelly recessed the meeting at 5:40 p.m. for dinner and Closed Session. He reconvened the
meeting at 7:02 p.m.
X. AWARDS, PRESENTATIONS, AND APPOINTMENTS
None
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XI. PUBLIC HEARINGS
A.
REQUEST FOR CONSIDERATION OF ADOPTION OF A RESOLUTION OF NECESSITY
FOR THE ACQUISITION OF EMINENT DOMAIN OF A PORTION OF A LARGER
PARCEL LOCATED AT 73075 HIGHWAY 111 FOR PURPOSES OF REDEVELOPMENT
IN CONNECTION WITH THE AGENCY'S REDEVELOPMENT PLAN FOR PURPOSES
OF REDEVELOPMENT IN CONNECTION WITH THE AGENCY'S REDEVELOPMENT
PLAN FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 1.
The following is a verbatim transcript of this public hearing item.
Ku
RSK Richard S. Kelly, Chairman
CLO Carlos L. Ortega, RDA Executive Director
DY David Yrigoyen, RDA Manager
RAS Robert A. Spiegel, Agency Board Member
BAC Buford A. Crites, Agency Board Member
JMB Jean M. Benson, Agency Board Member
JC Joyce Cohn, Trustee, Shell Cohn Family Trust
SD Steven DeLateur (sp?), Attorney for Stanley B. Rose Company
AU Audience
RR Richard Roiko (sp?), General Manager, Palomino Restaurant
DF David Fletcher, Property Manager, El Paseo Collection North
RC Richard Cohn
PD Phil Drell, Director of Community Development
RAD Ramon A. Diaz, City Manager
SW Sayre Weaver, Redevelopment Agency Counsel, Richards, Watson & Gershon
SRG Sheila R. Gilligan, Agency Secretary
RSK There we have a Request for Consideration of Adoption of a Resolution of Necessity for
the Acquisition of Eminent Domain of a portion of a larger parcel located at 73-075
Highway 111 for purposes of redevelopment in connection with the Agency's
Redevelopment Plan for purposes of redevelopment in connection with the Agency's
Redevelopment Plan for Project Area No. 1.
CLO Mr. Chairman, um, this is an item that we have readvertised, uh, for tonight again, and
once again, would like Mr. Yrigoyen to give you the staff report.
DY Mr. Chairman, members of the Agency Board, um, as our Executive Director indicated,
we have readvertised this resolution. Ah, essentially what is before you today is a
resolution of necessity considering the use of the property in question for the, ah,
property located east of ah, Highway 74, ah, north of El Paseo and south of
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Highway 111. Um, you have a map attached to the report. Ah, essentially, what it is
before you is a consideration of that resolution of necessity which the Agency must
determine our four different findings: a) The finding of the public interest and necessity
that require the project; b) That the project is planned, or located in a manner that will
be compatible with the greatest public good and the least private injury; c) That the
subject property described in the resolution is necessary for the project; and, d) That the
offer required pursuant to Government Code has been made to the owner of record of
the property sought to be acquired.
Essentially items "a", "b" and "c", ah, had been outlined in the report and are also an
aspect of the Redevelopment Plan which identifies that particular property as an aspect
of need for parking improvements to provide for, ah, proper traffic circulation, ah,
drainage factors. Um, such improvements that would provide for parking in the overall
parking plan in that area, um, and, ah, again, I refer to the staff report which identifies
other factors in that.
Item "d" which requires the offer to be made to the owner of, ah, ah, the regular owner
is, has been made. We have, ah, resubmitted the offer to the owner, ah, with regards
to that, we have received an off-, ah, we have received a, ah, response to that offer from
the owner's attorney, and, ah, we need to make that response a matter of record.
RAS Did we just get this in?
DY (Unclear)
RAS (Unclear)
RSK (Unclear)
BAC (Unclear)
DY Essentially, ah, ah, that response does not respond to our offer of purchasing the
property. Ah, in fact, it responds with, ah, a, an objection to the taking, and that
requests an alternative which would be to lease the property to the Agency. Um, the, ah,
there was no specific proposal with regards to said lease. Ah, they, it would be difficult
to determine what the parameters would be with regards to that lease. Ah, in order for
us to continue with the project, ah, it would be difficult to consider, ah, such proposal
and move on with the project at hand. Um, ah, we have today, our legal counsel, Sayre
Weaver, ah, who is here to address any legal issues that you might wish to ask her. Ah,
staff is here to try and answer any of your questions; ah, we also have ah, members of,
the a, other portions of the project, ah, in the audience, in case you wish to ask them any
questions. Other than that, that concludes our staff report.
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RSK Any questions?
RAS Yeah, I, I have in front of me a, a letter, ah, Onto-, dated October the 7th this year from
a Dr. Jerry Pikolycky.
DY That's correct.
RAS Um, and he's int-, int-, he's interested in whether or not the paved parking lot behind
Baker's Square is part of this, and obviously, it isn't part of what we're talking about.
DY We have responded to that letter and indicated to him that that's not the case.
RAS Okay, now, ah, ah, ah, how is he involved in this?
DY Ah, m-m-Mr., Mr. Pikolycky is the lessee of that portion of the property in question.
RAS Oh, he leases the Baker's Square property?
DY Well, h-he leases the property that is before you today. Um, from the owner.
RAS He leases the, the, the lo-, the sand lot.
DY The sand lot. That's correct.
RAS But he's not involved in the Baker's Square...
DY I, I have, I don't know about that.
RAS Okay.
RSK Any other questions?
BAC Ah, the letter from the attorney notes, um, that in '95 we offered her a hundred and
sixty-eight thousand for the property?
DY That's correct.
BAC And we're now offering a hundred and nine thousand for the property?
DY That's correct. We, we reappraised the property, and the reappraisal came back at that,
at that value.
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RSK We did, though, offer one hundred and sixty-eight at one time?
DY We did at one time offer her that amount.
BAC Less than two years ago.
DY That's correct.
RAS Getting back to the Dr. Pikolycky letter, he leases it for the Christmas tree lot at, at
Christmas time, is that the only thing that goes on on that lot?
DY He indicated by phone that that's what he used it for, ah, other than that, there's been no
other activity.
RAS No other activity (unclear).
DY That's correct.
RAS Thank you.
RSK Any other questions?
JMB And the one sixty-eight before was turned down?
DY That's correct.
RSK If there are no other questions, ah, I will men the public hearing and ask anybody that
would like to speak to this item, step to the lectern, and give your name and address for
the record.
JC Good evening.
RSK You...that'll...you can pull that down.
JC Good evening, ah, Council, my name is Joyce Cohn. I'm the trustee of the Shell Cohn
Family Trust. I reside at 398 Via Charisma, Palm Springs, California 92264. As trustee
of the Shell Cohn Family Trust, I represent the trust with regard to matters concerning
this property. I would like to make it clear that I will strongly oppose the condemnation
of this property. I would like to briefly explain the various points upon which I am
opposed to this condemnation as follows.
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This property was acquired by our family in 1976. And I am extremely reluctant to sell
or have condemned any portion of the property. I am particularly reluctant to see m-,
any portion of the property condemned because the parcel in question is part of a larshel,
larger piece, which is also owned by the Shell Cohn Family Trust.
I understand that the property is currently vacant, but it is quite possible that my family
will need to use the property in the future for the expansion of other businesses located
on adjoining properties owned by our family. By taking this parcel away from the
remaining property, our family may be imposed with an extreme hardship in the event
we require the future use of this property. I have strong reservations as to whether the
parking needs claimed by the City are really required in this case. I have spoken with
Fred Fern and also the owners of the Palomino Restaurant, and they indicated that they
really do not require the parking. I understand that the Palm Desert Redevelopment
Agency believes that it may have a need for parking in this area. However, I have strong
reservations as to the actual need. Therefore, it is my belief that the public necessity
required for a condemnation action has not been met in this case.
I am also concerned because I believe that the parking proposed for this area would really
only benefit several businessmen, business, businesses, excuse me. In fact, I believe that
there really is not a public use for this property, but rather an intention to allow the
property to be used by certain specific private businesses. Therefore, I believe that the
public purpose requirement for starting an eminent domain action has also not been met.
I'm also concerned about the way in which the proposed parking lot has been approached
by the City. Because of the fact that the City volunteered to condemn this property and
improve the property with a lot. This effectively denied me the opportunity to deal with
adjoining property owners and perhaps improve my own land with a parking lot. This
would have allowed me to go ahead and fill a need which could be satisfied by private
enterprise, as opposed to having the City expend funds to require this land. Naturally,
the adjoining property owners, once they learned that the City would provide substantial
assistance in approving, improving the property with a parking lot, are no longer
interested in talking to me about contributing toward a parking lot or paying rent for a
parking lot.
This has effectively prevented my family and our current tenant on the property from
pursuing a use which would benefit the adjoining property owners without being involved
in a condemnation action and ultimately losing the long term ownership of this property.
I am also concerned by the fact that the City has been discussing this matter with the
adjoining property owners and seems to have some understanding with the property
owners regarding contribution of funds toward the improvement of the parking lot and
the requirement that these property owners provide a perpetual easement over portions
of their Iand. Unfortunately the nature of this understanding seems to be quite loose.
In fact, I am informed that there are no formal agreements or written documents which
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reflect this understanding. If, in fact, there is an understanding between these other
property owners concerning contributions toward a parking lot, I believe that this
agreement should be spelled out and fully disclosed to all of the parties, particularly these
agreements should be explained to me as it appears that I now have the most to lose in
terms of the condemnation of our family property. I would submit that this
condemnation action is actually premature at a time when the City is still unsure as to
how this parking lot issue will be negotiated and what the burdens and benefits would be
to all of the involved parties. As I have indicated before, I would like to take all
reasonable steps to avoid losing the property to cond, condemna, condemnation. In this
regard, I would be glad to orchestrate an effort with my tenant and the adjoining property
owners to propose a lease to the City or the adjoining property owners in order to
provide for a parking lot without losing my property to a condemnation proceeding. As
you might imagine, my tenant would be very anxious to pursue this avenue, and I think
it is only fair that both he and I be granted an opportunity to do this with the full support
of the Redevelopment Agency staff.
I understand that this property may have to be involved in a long term lease in order to
accommodate this result; however, I would like to have the opportunity to, to retain this
property in order to maintain long term flexibility as it relates to my family's remaining
property. As you can see from my comments, I would like to take any reasonable and
prudent action to try and avoid a condemnation. I have not offered a price for the
property because I have now determined, after a great deal of research, that my family
would be greater served if we can retain the property. For this reason, I have not
proposed a purchase price in the condemnation action. Naturally, this has not been done
in order to be uncooperative, but rather to express my strong desire to work out a
feasible alternative. Thank you.
JMB Could, ah, what businesses do you own in that area that you said would expand?
JC Um, Shell, the Shell gas station would possibly expand.
RSK And what else do you own there?
JC Ah, the Baker's, um, our land, our u-, own the land under the gas station. I own the
land under Baker's Square, as well as the parcel.
RSK And the parking that goes back of Baker's Square.
JC Ah, yes. Mmm hmm.
RSK Any other questions? Thank you.
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JC You're welcome.
RSK Anyone else like to speak to this item?
SD Good evening, Council, ah, I'm Steven DeLateur (sp?). I'm the attorney for the Stanley
B. Rose Company that, ah, owns the building that's ah, ah, in, in which the Palomino
Restaurant sits, and, ah, I have with me Rich Roiko (sp?), the Palomino Manager. He
said that, ah, and Rich can come up here and speak directly to this, but, ah, just briefly
I wanted to make a comment here, that, ah, ah, she made the statement that, ah,
Palomino Restaurant didn't think that there was a parking shortage there.
Well, she called him one time to try to discuss this, and he properly referred her over to
the City, and didn't discuss this with any substance at all. So I don't know where she got
that information. There certainly is a parking problem here. We've been talking about
this now off and on for several years, and it seems to me that this ah, proposed parking
lot is a very useful way to complete the development of that part of the City. Ah, it's
very clear that that part of the City is turning into one of the ah, commercial hubs of the
City, and, ah, the designs, while they're not complete, ah, the, ah, preliminary designs
that I've seen, and they will be completed soon, ah, are going to provide for very nice
lighting there. It's going to allow a, ah, new restaurant to come in that's going to, ah,
complement the other restaurants in the area, and, ah, I, I think it's going to be a very
good plus for the City. Ah, there's going to be, ah, a, ah, coordinated parking effort
around there; it's gonna' serve all the tenants there. It will even serve the tenants of her
property, if they so desire to park there, and you know, it, I think that it fits in with the
public purpose, and, ah, you know, ah, if she has other plans for expansion, you know,
I think now's the time for her to say that. But, ah, I don't, I think this is just kind of an
eleventh hour, ah, ah, stand here to try to for, forestall it. Ah, I am sympathetic with
her to the extent that nobody likes to lose their property, but, ah, I think there's a very
clear public, ah, public purpose here that's being, ah, ah, met in the proper way by this
resolution.
RSK Questions?
BAC Do I correctly assume that the condemnation of this property would in no way have a
negative effect on any future building uses or plans for your property?
SD Ah, yes, that is, that is correct.
BAC So your ox, to use the old phrase, is not being gored by this, right?
SD Ah, correct. Ah, our ox is not being gored, ah, but, ah, I think it's, it's also ah, fair to
say that ah, ah, if, if this doesn't go through, I think the ah, City's ah, ox is going to be
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gored here, too. I think this is gonna' be a, a plus for the, for the City. You know, ah,
Palomino Restaurant ah, can, ah, go forward with or without the parking lot, and you
know, we, ah, you were, you were Mayor at the time we had this discussion before.
And, ah, ah, I think that, ah, there is a, a parking problem there because of the way that
particular cul-de-sac, which was the former Highway 74, was, was cut off. It's kind of
an odd -shaped lot, ah, 1 really don't know how you can build a standard a kind of a, kind
of building on that, on that lot. I mean maybe somebody could think of a way, but, ah,
you know, we've been dealing with this issue for a long time; that part of town is really,
as I say, in my opinion at least, one of the jewels of the City, and there's this, kind of
this, this a sore spot there, that when the wind blows, ah, it ah, you know, creates a, you
know, havoc. It ge-, it's not used for anything except just selling Christmas trees for a
few, few weeks a year, and, ah, you know we had, the City has an opportunity now for
a very nice restaurant to go in there, which is gonna' be good for the City. And, ah, it's
gonna' serve the, a, all of the merchants around there, so, ah, you know, I, I think that,
ah, this is a good, good resolution, and just wanted to ah, make those remarks known.
Thank you.
RSK Anyone else like to speak?
JC I wanted to answer his, ah, statement about ah, the Palomino. Ah, I did talk to the
Palomino, and, ah, I reiterate they said they did not need any more parking. Um, and,
the, ah, (unclear), they thought that the City was going to do something on that lot, and
that is all. And, so, they said they had no need for parking. Ah, as far as my tenants,
ah, wanting ah, possibly wanting that property behind ah, Shell gas station, they may use
it for a car wash, which would bring in ah, sales tax revenue to the City quite a bit.
RSK Who did you speak to at the Palomino?
JC Excuse me?
RSK Who did you speak to at the Palomino?
JC The manager.
RSK You don't remember his name?
AU (Unclear)
RSK That's okay. Let her finish, `n then we'll have you.
JC I'm sorry, I can't remember his name. It was, ah, about three weeks ago.
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RSK Thank you. Now you, now is your opportunity.
RR Good evening, Council. My name is Richard Roiko (sp?). I'm the general manager for
the Palomino Restaurant, and, ah, a young lady did call, ah, to discuss this, um, piece
of property that she has adjacent to our restaurant, um, asking about whether or not we'd
be interested in leasing that from her. And at that point in time, I directed her to Phil,
who's kind of been coordinating and spearheading this project. Um, as far as did I refer
to whether or not we needed more space? I would not mention that, because we've got
things going on that we can always use more parking space, but I did refer her to Phil.
So, on that note, that's all I've got to say on it right now. Any questions?
RSK Anyone else like to speak to this item?
DF Good evening. My name is David Fletcher. I reside at 74-095 Covered Wagon Trail in
Palm Desert. Ah, I am the ah, property manager for El Paseo Collection North, which
ah, it shares part of the existing parking lot that's behind California Pizza Kitchen, and
the, ah, proposed parking is to be adjoined with. Ah, when we purchased that building,
ah, we took on the management responsibility of the entire parking area that's shared by
Carl's Jr. and Tony Roma's and our buildings and Palomino, and, ah, I am aware that
Ms. Cohn did speak with my father in-law, Fred Fern. Ah, we talked about that. I
know that he referred ah, her over to the appropriate city officials. Ah, I cannot believe,
knowing how tight the parking is already back there, that he would indicate anything
otherwise. Ah, he may have indicated that we don't require any additional parking by
code for what we're currently doing; that does not mean that there's not additional
parking needed back there. And, so, although he couldn't be here tonight, I'm here to
at least let you know that there certainly is a need for additional parking back there.
RSK Any questions? Thank you. Anyone else would like to speak to this item?
RC Ah, good evening. My name is Richard Cohn, and ah, I just wanna' say that...
RSK Do you have an address?
RC Ah, I'm, ah, Palm Springs, P 0 Box, ah, 4736, Palm Springs. And, ah, as you can, as
you can tell, there's, there's ah, this is not, ah, not an easy thing, and, ah, it, it rather
seems very complex, and it seems like these people are coming forward at the last
moment just to, ah, ah, for their own, you know, purposes, and, you know, to serve
their business. But, ah, I, I don't, ah, think that, ah, it, ah, the parking is needed. Um,
and, ah, the, there's just quite a bit of parking there as it, as it stands, ah, I would just
encourage you to vote, vote this down. Ah, you don't have enough information, ah, I
don't understand why these people are coming forward right now. They don't even want
to talk when we try to talk to them, and I don't understand why would you listen to a,
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a manager of a restaurant when you know darn well that, you know, the only interest that
they would have is to increase their business. But, ah, we don't even know who, who
owns the property there. So they're coming forward kind of in a, you know, position
of supporting whomever owns that property, and, ah, I think we should, ah, you know,
find that out, too, because the, the businesses that, that are in that property are gonna'
benefit as well. There's quite a few, there's not only the Palomino Club, which that
place has been a restaurant for a man, number of years now. It's not only been the
Palomino Club, and, ah, there's some offices upstairs as well that are gonna' benefit
from that as well, too.
But, anyhow, ah, I would ju, would encourage you to vote no. Ah, you don't have
enough information. Ah, you're taking a valuable piece of property, and it's been in my
family for quite a long time, and ah, we would like to see that property developed the
way that we want it developed. We don't want just some parking lot to be goin' in there
just because it's a super idea so some restaurants can, ah, be supported by that. You
know, there's a lot of other businesses around there. There's a gas station on the corner,
it's been there for years serving the City. And there's, as well, a restaurant next door,
and, ah, I don't, I don't think the parking lot is the, the best use in real estate terms for
that, ah, `cause you, you can see that this is just kinda' like a situation where, where
either the City is trying to take this property or these business owners are trying to take
this property. They don't own it. They don't have any right to it. As a matter of fact,
we have trouble with this Palomino Club parkin' cars on that lot! They park their cars
on that lot illegally, ah, during the weekends, you know, where's the fairness? Where's
the equity in this? You know, where, where, where is the business morals, scruples,
whathaveyou.
So, again, once again, you know, until you have further information, which I think, you
know, before you take somebody's property, ah, by hearing from hotshot, you know,
quote/unquote business managers, whathaveyou, supporting, you know why can't these
people come forward themselves, you know? Are they so busy that they, you know if
this is such a great interest to them, why are they, you know, handling it this way? So,
you can see that, you know, it's, ah, something that they're just tryin' to take. So,
anyhow, thank you very much.
RSK Are, are you a member of the trust?
RC Pardon, me?
RSK Are you a member of the trust that, that owns the piece of property in question?
RC I'm, I'm, I'm a member of the family.
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RSK You're a member of the family?
RC Right. My mother is the trustee, and I'm her son, so I'm in fully support of my mother.
And, that's the way it is, ah, thank you very much.
RSK Thank you. Anyone else that would like to speak to this item? Seeing none, I'll close
the public hearing and ask for Council direction.
RAS I, I got a couple of...
RSK Ex-, excuse me.
RAS ...questions...
RSK Redevelopment Agency, isn't it?
RAS ...yeah, that I'd like to ask before we...
RSK So do your thing.
RAS Thank you very much. Um, the comment was made, and I'll ask, ah, Dave questions.
The comment was made that, ah, people are coming for-, forth at the last moment and
so on; that this is something that's relatively new. How long have we been discussing
the possible purchase of this property with the trust?
DY Uh, we have been discussing the purchase of the property for about three years.
RAS About three years?
DY That's correct.
RAS Okay. Um, one of the objectives, ah, that I see the City having is to fill up vacant
buildings, and when there was all of the bank consolidations that went on, we had a lot
of empty bank buildings in the City. And, most of them have been taken care of at this
point, but the one that's on the corner of El Paseo and 74, which is really the entrance
to El Paseo, has been vacant for a long time. And, as I understand it, a very successful
oriental restaurant, um, that already exists in the ah, north sphere of our City, ah, or
north section of our City I should say, ah, is interested in moving into that location. If
that did become a restaurant, and I'll ask Mr. Drell the same question, is there enough
existing parking for that to become a restaurant?
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PD Ah, the conditional use permit, which we approved for that restaurant by another
applicant, specifically required ah, the development of this lot to provide parking for that
restaurant.
RAS So without this lot, a restaurant cannot go into the old, ah, bank building.
PD Correct.
RAS Okay. A question?
BAC A question for you on this issue, um, the property owner says that...I don't think there's
probably a soul here who would deny the success of the restaurants in the area, the
desirability of filling the bank building with something that is attractive and adds revenue
and so on, and the fact that there are parking problems in that area right now. The
question I have is, the owner of the property says that by taking, in essence, that portion
of that land which is now vacant, we restrict the options that the owner has on the
remaining part of the land for her future, and I certainly am not in the business of
looking forward to hearing someone propose a car wash on that piece of land. But,
what's staff's perception on whether or not the taking of the vacant land restricts any
future modifications, changes, whathaveyou of the two existing buildings on the
remainder of the land? I think that, from this person at least, is an issue that I have
concern for.
DY That, that would be an answer for our planning staff to answer, a question for our
planning staff to answer, because of the needs for par-, additional parking based on
development.
RSK (Unclear)
PD The, um, if one of her other properties wanted to expand, um, we would do an analysis,
see if they would be a need for more parking. The result of that, if we determined there
was a need, we'd require them to build parking. So the ul-, end result would be
development of parking on this property. Remember this is a public lot that is being
constructed, and in the analysis not 100% of it is being ah, spoken for by the bank, or
by the new restaurant, or the Palomino. So there will be parking available in this new
public lot to serve, potentially, expansions of her businesses just as it is available to, ah,
serve the conversion of the bank to a restaurant.
BAC How much will be left available for that kind of expansion?
PD Um...
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 9, 1997
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BAC Or change in requirements or whathaveyou?
PD Um, technically, um, approximately half of it, maybe. I mean it, it all determs on, on,
you know... it, it...
BAC Right.
PD So...
BAC But approximately one half of it?
PD Yes, is, is...
BAC Not needed for new or existing...
PD Correct. Remember the formula we worked, worked out on the payment by the, by the
Palomino and the ah, ah, they're paying for about half based on their requirements. Um,
my understanding is, for example right now, they have adequate, ah, like I, in fact I
talked to the gas station owner yesterday. Um, that parking lot directly behind the gas
station which is technically required by Baker's Square, I don't think it's ever been
occupied. He says he's never seen a car parked on it from Baker's Square, and then we
would do the same sc-, and, and that conceivably, ah, you know, although, you know
there have been times when Palomino people tried to park on Baker's Square-- got mad
and they threw 'ern out. So, um, you know there, there's a, ah, there's a, pro-, for me
the perception, and, and it's very possible that ah, the expansion of that gas station
wouldn't require any parking at all, so, ah, we would do an analysis. But again, any
parking that's available, we are providing in this new parking lot. So, the, you know
there's "x" amount of space, we're maximizing the amount of parking that can be
developed, and that parking is available for her tenants as well as all the other tenants in
the area.
BAC Would that then potentially mean that if either the existing buildings wish to expand, they
could expand into their existing parking and make up that existing parking in the parking
that we're creating?
PD Potentially, yes.
BAC Can we in some way, while not assuring that, at least note that in some way?
PD Ah...
BAC If we so chose to?
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RAD I believe the Redevelopment Agency attorney can answer that with regards to ah, eminent
domain.
SW I, I'm not sure how it would work into the analysis with eminent domain. Um, the, wh-,
what you've asked about whether there would be any restrictions on the development of
her property, o-o-of, of the larger parcel that's at issue here, is something that would be
analyzed by the appraiser and determined in, in reference to just compensation.
PD Right.
SW So, the appraiser has already considered that issue in determining how much just
compensation to offer the property owner here. The, um, the, the, what the appraiser
has to do is look at what the highest and best use is of the property, and, if the highest
and best use is the kind of expansion and so forth, um, that's something that the appraiser
would have to consider, and if we're depriving her of some economic benefit as a result
of that, you would be compensating her for it. With respect to the City planning issues,
um, your question being, "Could we, um, ah, indicate that we would be willing to
consider allowable, ah, expansion into what's now used for parking?" , um, and allow her
to fill her parking requirements in part through the public lot, as I understood Mr.
Drell's comment, he was saying that, that's something that would need to be considered
on a case -by -case basis, but that's exactly what that parking lot is there for; it's available
for her commercial expansion as for all other individuals' commercials exp-, or
businesses commercial expansion in that area.
So, I don-, if you're asking, "Can you make a commitment now to do that?", I think
that's a planning question, not an eminent domain question. Ah, and I can't answer that.
I think Mr. Drell told you that it's not something that you would necessarily want to
commit yourself to now, in any case. You don't know what other plans other businesses
have in the neighborhood.
PD If I might add, um, we are making a commitment to, ah, to, to one of the banks, and
they're, and, and that commitment is based on their specific contribution and assessment
of what their expansion is generating and they're paying. Palomino is wishing to, ah,
in essence, get a commitment on parking for future expansion, and they're, as part of the
agreement, they are paying for it. Ah, th- they are also, the bank is also contributing
real estate, ah, into this parking lot, ah, so is the Palo-, um, so is, um, um El Paseo
Collection. Ah, they're not requiring any parking, technically, but they're contributing
real estate. So...ah...ther-, I guess there's ways, if, if, if they wanna'...
RAD Ex-, ex, ah, Mr. Mayor, members of the Council, exactly; there are ways, that in terms
of the price that would be paid for the land and assurance for future expansion and the
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 9, 1997
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buildings that the cu-, owner now has, the price that would be paid for the land would
reflect that.
PD Right. Price would go down, since we'd be guarantying the use of the lot.
RSK Does that answer your question?
BAC It does.
RSK Other questions or discussion?
JMB Can we close the public hearing?
RSK Ummmm...
RAS He already closed it before.
RSK Yeah, I closed it.
JMB Oh, well, I, I...
RSK You're testing my memory.
JMB Just checking to see. I know that we've worked at this for three years, and it is a, an
odd -shaped lot, and like Buford and I would, don't think that car wash would get very
far, in fact, it's not zoned for that anyway. And, it wouldn't be something that, that this
Council, I don't think, would entertain.
He, um, he, and it is a problem along there, and certainly the Christmas tree, though I
ah, am not Scrooge, I, I think that's an eyesore on that lot there every year. He, ah, I
would, I do think it's, um, a, ah needed for public parking with that, and we've helped
on other areas along El Paseo, and it's not just the restaurants, there's a lot of shops in
there. And, I would um, move, um, ah, the resolution.
RSK Is there a second to that?
RAS I'll second.
RSK Ah, any other discussion? (Pause) In that case, please vote.
SRG Has everyone voted?
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 9, 1997
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RSK Not (unclear), not yet.
SRG Now they have. Motion carries by unanimous vote.
For purposes of clarification, the Redevelopment Agency Board took the following action. Mayor
Pro Tempore Benson moved to waive further reading and adopt Resolution No. 347, a Resolution of
Necessity of the Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency Declaring Certain Real Property Necessary for
Public Purposes and Authorizing the Acquisition Thereof said property is a parcel of approximately 0.264
acres of vacant land that is part of a larger 0.96 gross acre parcel of land located on the east side of
Highway 74, south side of Highway 111, commonly known as 73075 Highway 111 in the City of Palm
Desert ("Subject Property"). The legal description of the subject property is attached hereto and
incorporated herein by reference as Exhibit 1. A map showing the location of the Subject Property is
attached hereto and incorporated herein by reference as Exhibit 2; and, 2) By Minute Motion, authorize
that an eminent domain proceeding be fled to acquire the subject property. Motion was seconded by
Member Spiegel and carried by unanimous vote.
XII. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
None
XIII. ADJOURNMENT
Upon a motion by Member Spiegel, second by Snyder, and unanimous vote of the Agency Board,
Chairman Kelly adjourned the meeting at 8:00 p.m. to Closed Session with no action announced from
Closed Session.
ATTEST:
SHEILA R. GIL IGAN, S
PALM DESERT REDE
ETARY TO THE
PMENT AGENCY
37
RI HARD S. KELLY, CHAIRM
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 9, 1997
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SE*T BY
Kw M
WAON .10,0.1 AAP
, October 8, 1997
u
10- 8-97 : 16:28 , sert—
KtPF IAN LYONM
/no IOI1NCv AT LPw
sou+re Ol11 vc
uu,Tc ■ coo••
1 &LM 97.11113tUK. CALIVOIl1U1i. owseur u 4
Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency
73-510 Fred Waring Drive
Palm Desert, CA 92260
Attention: Mr. Carlos L. Ortega
RECEIVED
OCT 0 81997
PALM DESERT
REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
714 990 6230;# 2/ 3
OM[ 17.01 11O-1113
♦*CSIN I►C 17001110-1+00
;'"
(ketS")
j /Y�
\O `%
MAND DELIVERED
Re: Proposed Condon of a Portion
of a Larger Parcel located et 73075 Highway 111
City of Palm Desert
Our Client Joyce Cohn, Tanta of the Shell Cohn Futally Trost
Dear Mr. Ortega:
As you know, this office .; .,r, .. ,.. Ms. Joyce Cohn, as Trustee of the Shell Cohn Family Trust,
with regard to the proposed . , , .. , ... w . of the above -referenced property by the Palm Desert
R .. ,,.,.,,, Agency (the "Agency"). The subject property consists of ,r r,: .264 acres
and is identified as A ssor's Parcel Number 627-191-004-6 (the "Property").
Our client strenuously objects to the condemnation of the Property by the Agency. This parcel is
part of a larger parcel owned by one client at the corner of Highway 74 and IJighway 111. Although
the Property is currently wart, it is conceivable that our client will need the Property in the future
for use and expansion of the businesses located on the remainder of our client's Property. The
severance of this parcel front our client's remaining property may impose an extreme hardship in
terms of the chore use of out client's remaining property.
As an alternative to taking the Property through eminent domain proceedings, our client would like
to explore other means for satisfying the apparent reed for parking in this area of the Agency. Our
client is informed that the Agency is seeking to condemn the Property in older to asseardrie a number
of small parcels in the area for purposes of constructing a public parkin lot. Accordingly. our
client would !clue to discuss cawing into a long term ground lease with the Agency for a patting lot.
Since our client is willing to cooperate in the tom nediato use of the property, our tem believes that
this suggestion should prove an acceptable alternative to the condemnation of the Property. If the
Agency would consider this alternative, our client would pursue Is the Agency with a
.I proposal, including the interests of the current lessee of the Property.
38
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 9, 1997
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SENT 3Y:
KIPP 1MC LYONS
ATTONN CY AT LAW
10- 8-97 : 16:29 ; City of Palm Desert 714 990 6230;* 3/ 3
Mr. Carlos L. Ortega
Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency
October 8, 1997
Page Two
with the aninent domain prod, our client will have no alternative
but a
the seek
Agency does proceed Our office is extremely V' r, �� .1 with the current
to a current appraisal of the Property
proposed offer of S109,250.00. You may recall that in December of 1995 the Agency bad offered
$168.500.00 for the Property. Our client believes that tlw fair marketsimply
of the Property .
subnormally higher and the Agency's suggested pry s has not been made in
good faith.
Naturally, our client wants to make every effort to restive this matoer through negotiatiOns with the
Agency.
If you should have any questions regarding this mr, please do not hesitate to contact Inc.
Very truly yours,
K. IAN IRONS
KIL:pdp
cc: Ms. Joyce Cohn
39