HomeMy WebLinkAbout1998-10-08MINUTES
REGULAR PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 8, 1998
CIVIC CENTER COUNCIL CHAMBER
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I. CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Benson convened the meeting at 4:06 p.m.
H. ROLL CALL
Present:
Member Buford A. Crites
Member Jim Ferguson
Member Richard S. Kelly
Vice Chairman Robert A. Spiegel
Chairman Jean M. Benson
Also Present:
Ramon A. Diaz, City Manager
David J. Erwin, City Attorney
Sheila R. Gilligan, Director of Community Affairs/City Clerk
John M. Wohlmuth, ACM/Director of Administrative Services
Richard J. Folkers, ACM/Director of Public Works
Patrick Conlon, Director of Building and Safety
Phil Drell, Director of Community Development
Paul S. Gibson, Director of Finance/City Treasurer
David Yrigoyen, Redevelopment Agency Manager
Teresa LaRocca, Housing Manager
Rachelle D. Klassen, Deputy City Clerk
HI. CONSENT CALENDAR
A. MINUTES of the Regular Meeting of the Redevelopment Agency of September 24, 1998, and
the Special Meeting of the Redevelopment Agency of September 25, 1998.
Rec: Approve as presented.
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 8, 1998
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B. CLAIMS AND DEMANDS AGAINST THEAGENCY TREASURY - Warrant Nos. 17RDA,
18RDA, 17DR, and 18DR.
Rec: Approve as presented.
Upon a motion by Spiegel, second by Crites, and unanimous vote of the Redevelopment Agency
Board, the Consent Calendar was approved as presented.
IV. CONSENT ITEMS HELD OVER
None
V. RESOLUTIONS
None
VI. NEW BUSINESS
None
VII. CONTINUED BUSINESS
None
VIII. OLD BUSINESS
A. CONSIDERATION OF APPROVAL OF A NEGATIVE DECLARATION OF
ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT AND AMENDMENT TO A DEVELOPMENT PLAN FOR
A 183,094 SQUARE FOOT EXPANSION TO THE PALM DESERT TOWN CENTER AND
956 SPACE SINGLE LEVEL PARKING DECK. Case No. DP 12-79 Amendment
(TrizecHahn/Palm Desert, Inc., Applicant) (JOINT CONSIDERATION WITH PALM
DESERT CITY COUNCIL).
The following is a verbatim transcript of this item.
Key:
JMB Jean M. Benson, Mayor/Chairman
BAC Buford A. Crites, Councilman/Member
DJE David J. Erwin, City Attorney
RAD Ramon A. Diaz, City Manager
PD Phil Drell, Director of Community Development
JF Jim Ferguson, Councilman/Member
RAS Robert A. Spiegel, Mayor Pro-Tempore/Vice Chairman
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 8, 1998
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SK Skip Kuehn, TrizecHahn Development Corporation
RSK Richard S. Kelly, Councilman/Member
JMW John M. Wohlmuth, ACM/Director of Administrative Services
RJF Richard J. Folkers, ACM/Director of Public Works
WD William Doyle, TrizecHahn Development Corporation
RDK Rachelle D. Klassen, Deputy City Clerk
JMB The next item is consideration of approval of a negative declaration of environmental impact
and amendment to a development plan for one hund-, eighty-three thousand ninety-four square
foot expansion to the Palm Desert Town Center and a 956 space single level parking deck.
Case number DP 1279 Amendment, TrizecHahn, Applicant. This is going with the
Redevelopment Agency so we need to hold it 'til then, or do it now?
BAC On this you opened both of them.
DJE You can do it now...
JMB Yeah.
DJE ...you've...you've called both to order previously.
JMB Okay. Go ahead.
RAD Ah...Mr. Drell.
PD Ah...at your...ah...at the last time this was before the Council, the regular session, um...a lot
of the architecture has, had not been...ah...precisely refined. There was some...ah...issues
concern of...ah...line of sight, impacts of the theaters...ah...and it was...ah...as a result, a
meeting was scheduled for discussion of these issues and tour of some shopping centers in San
Diego area. That meeting was held...um...some additional refinements of the architecture
were...were...ah...shown to four members of the Council that attended. Um...and
a...ah...expansive line of sight photo study was distributed...ah...superimposing the
projected...ah...mass and design of the theaters and parking structure. Ah...in that there were
no conclusions or...or...ah...ah...detailed response to discussion from that meeting...um...we
felt it was appropriate...um...to again...ah...reexamine and...and discuss the fundamental issues
that are still outstanding relative to design, principally the height...ah...design of the theater
building...um...and the treatment on the parking structure...and...ah...'cause up `til now the
Applicants got a conceptual...ah...approval, but...ah...again, those specific issues weren't
addressed, and given the time schedule of the project, the Applicant needs that...ah...feedback
and...and, conceivably, app-...approval of the resolution approving the project in...ah...and
establishing those parameters for the major elements of the expansion, and...ah...principally,
the theater. Um...he has, the...the Applicant has...ah...that, those exhibits on...ah...ah...on
slides, and we can show.them...um...if that's your pleasure...ah...or there's specific items to
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discuss...ah...if...if you so...if...if you see...ah...choose to adopt the resolution that was
presented back in August, staff would be suggesting an additional condition--
ah... Condition 14...ah...and it will become evident when you see the photo
study...ah...that...um...while most of the landscaping on Rancho Grande succeeded rather
admirably to mitigate all of the impacts of the parking lot and the shopping center, there are
some gaps. And...ah...therefore, one of the...Condition Number 14 of their proposed
resolution would read, "Final landscape plans shall include installation of additional appropriate
landscaping along Rancho Grande, as approved by the Architectural Commission, to mitigate
visual impact of theater and parking structure." Um...other than that, the...again, the Applicant
is here to make presentation at any extent you wish him to make. Ah...and...awaiting
your...ah...and...the...ah...refined theater architecture had been, has been presented to the
Architectural Commission, and they have...ah...granted it preliminary approval.
Um...ah...a...ah...a proposal was presented at the...ah...San Diego meeting relative to the
parking structure was the...ah...where...where the exposures...ah...allow it, they would be
planting...ah...creeping fig to cover the parking structure physically on the...be on the north
and west elevations, and, again, that's...um...so, again, we...ah...if there are any questions,
and the Applicant's here to make a presentation to the extent you feel is necessary.
JF I have two questions. I wasn't here at the meeting when this came up for conceptual approval --
was that a public hearing? Did the residents surrounding it get notice?
PD Correct.
JF And also I notice in our addendum, little footnote here, it said Mayor Benson asked staff to
work with residents to identify any issues and look at their proposed resolution. Has that
occurred, and are there any...is there any opposition from the residents?
PD Th-...there was a...a...ah...concern from one resident relative to the...ah...view of the theater
from her particular house, and...and that is illustrated, that particular house is illustrated in
the...in the view of it is illustrated in the...ah...photo study. Um...and true that her view is one
of those areas through where there is a gap in the landscaping. Ah...there will be places where
you will see that theater...um...ah...the solution is to get landscaping growing there that
screen the view from that location. Um...again, there's no magic in
terms of...of you know, how do you...how do you hide a...a...you know...a...you know a
10,000-ton elephant—it's...it's there, you can make it attractive, you can screen it from certain
locations. Again, the...the...a...as evidenced by the existing landscaping on Rancho Grande,
if you go back there, that, those 60-, 70-foot trees do succeed in screening everything. It will,
in fact, it will at the horizon, that theater at that point...ah...will...ah...impact her view
on...cert-...you know...at...at certain angles of the mountain. Um...again, the photo studies
are there, and if you want to see them in...
JF I...I have seen them. Are we doing anything to assist her get that landscaping?
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 8, 1998
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PD Oh...oh...we...
JF Or is the developer?
PD No...no...the landscaping would be installed by the developer, that...that...that's...that's
Condition Number 14. Ah...
JF Okay. And is the resident ah...comfortable with that as a solution? Or...
PD Um...I guess...she has not yet been contacted. This all, to a certain degree, depends on if we
accept the elevation of the theater as it's there. Obviously, it changes if...if we don't.
Ah...but...but...but that is the only, that is the only solution. Again,
there's...um...you...you...you put trees in front of it...ah... you try to hide it. Ah...the other
solution, of course, is to put the theater in the ground...ah...but those are the two solutions to
mitigate the height of an object is to make it lower, or do...or to make it attractive....(unclear)
JF
I...I understand that, but what you're saying is that of...of that entire adjoining residential
neighborhood, there's one resident who has identified the impacts that she doesn't care for that
can be mitigated through landscaping, and we don't know whether she does or doesn't?
PD She has not been recontacted.
RAS There...there were two people that came to the meeting that lived in the neighborhood, and all
of the neighbors were noticed, and balloons were floated so that they had a chance to see the
height of the...
JF Right.
RAS ...structure from various yards. One of the...one person came, gentleman, and he indicated his
...ah...great approval of the project, that, ah...he liked the idea of getting the entrance to the
theaters off of the back of the mall into the front, it would get kids out, and so on. The one
woman that spoke, and her house is shown in here, and I don't remember what page, indicated
that she wasn't totally happy with the fact that she was going to be able to see part of the mall
from her...ah...from her home, and that was the only negative...ah...that I heard at that
meeting.
JMB And she doesn't know they're going to plant trees to hide it.
JF And nobody's called to tell her?
PD No.
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 8, 1998
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BAC Let me ask a quick question, just to make sure that what I understand is right. Um...Condition
Number 9, which has to do with...with parking lot trees?
PD That will apply to the entire parking lot. In...in that part of the program will be the
ah...reconfiguration and restriping of the entire parking lot-- front, back, sides, everything.
BAC Okay. And so that's clear to the developer, and...
PD That...that our expectation, and we've communicated is that if...if...
BAC Yeah, I'm just making sure.
PD ...it complies, this...ah...with our current, actually our more than current, our...ah...as you
know we have a...a new plan, which yet to be absolutely adopted, but which we are enforcing
on all new projects, and we would expect this one to comply.
JMB Is the gentleman from Trizec going to make a...are they going to make a presentation?
PD Ah...again, they have the full...ah...slide show of, basically duplicating the...
JMB One we saw?
PD ...the...the exhibit you have...ah...you can...they can give as much, or as little of it...ah...as
you want.
RAS How 'bout showing a slide of the garage, proposed garage with the fig?
PD Okay. Again, he's...
JMB How the parking structure looks. It's different.
PD Ah...ah...I guess the other question is, is all the Council...ah...is...I guess, particular of
Mr. Crites, have you...you've seen the exhibits?
BAC Mmm hmm.
PD Did you see the package of exhibits?
BAC This stuff?
PD Yes. Okay.
BAC No. I mean I'm...it's sitting in front of me now, so yeah.
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PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY MEETING OCTOBER 8, 1998
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SK
Mayor Benson, Members of the Council, my name is Skip Kuehn, I represent Hahn -Palm
Desert, and I work for TrizecHahn Development Corporation. Um...in this
rendering...um...what you see is the parking structure. It extends from...ah...approximately
Monterey all the way over to Town Center...ah...Drive...and...ah...in the background you will
also see...ah...not only the porte cochere that is the highlight of the entry off the parking
structure into the mall, but also the theater behind it. Um...this parking structure is
festooned...um...largely as a result of some comments by the Planning Commission and the
Architectural Review Committee, with the creeping fig, very similar to what you have out here
on the Civic...um...on the City Hall. Um...and coincidentally, it's approximately the same
height, although the column spacing is about 60 feet intermittently. So um...that's about the
base spacing on the parking structure itself. Um...what we have done is to...um...also
address...um...a potential acoustical issue as it relates to this is a relatively tall parking
structure, and the intent is so that it doesn't seem very low and very threatening as you walk
under it. Consequently, at the outer edge of it, it will be approximately 20 feet in the air.
Um...what this does, even though it does follow the general contour of the existing site, is that
it...it creates...um...an open and airy feeling underneath it that's a lot less threatening to most
of our customers. Um...by virtue of having had this acoustical...ah...review done, what we've
done is...ah...it's shown that we can reduce the sound transmission that might go into our
neighbors by approximately eight decibels, and that's a pretty significant amount of transmission
loss. So what we've done is we've already incorporated into the spandle design...ah...the
recommendations of the acoustical engineer, which was to increase that height from 42 inches
to 54. Now that may sound strange-- it goes from 31/2 feet to 41/2 feet, but as the car drives by
it, it...it helps mitigate by raising the height of that wall so the sound goes up instead of out.
Um...in addition, as Mr. Drell described to you...um...along the...ah...Rancho Grande
elevation of our project, and we do have some gaps in the landscaping, it's quite mature now,
and 60- to 70-foot trees, and why there's some gaps there, it may be just...ah...that was part
of the design originally, or trees may have died over the years, whatever. But it's every bit of
our intent to...ah...replace those and fill in those gaps, trying to mitigate as much as we can the
height of that theater building. Now in response also to...um...comments by...ah...the City
Council, Planning Commission, and the Architectural Review Committee, what we have done
with respect to the theater itself is make a number of changes to reduce the height of it.
Originally when we came here before you, we were calling for approximately a 70-foot
building. That building...um...although there is a part of it that is at 70 feet still, it's in the
center of the building, and...um...it is only the part that has to be that tall to hide
the...ah...mechanical equipment for the theater. Around the perimeter, we've reduced the
heights of those parapets down to 66 and 62 feet, respectively, and placed all of the exiting
stairways on the outside of the building to modulate that big, long expanse of blank wall.
Um...if you'd like, I can advance the slide show to...ah...the slide that shows the exterior
rendering of the theater and describe to you these elements.
JMB Please, Skip.
RAS We've already seen them, but you go ahead.
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BAC All right... (unclear)
RAS (Unclear)
SK In...ah...in...in this rendering you're actually seeing it from the corner. This is the part, this
is the corner that's going to be closest to our neighbors to the north, and...um...one of the
things that's a little bit, well, it's hard for me to kind of point to it and, but in the foreground,
ah...right there...ah...that's one of the exterior...um...um...exiting stairs. And what it does
is by virtue of its stepping back and going forward, and the fact that by moving some of these
taller elements further back, it reduces the... um... the apparent height of them and their
imposingness-- we're trying to, by virtue of perspective as well as mitigation of the heights
themselves by reducing them, kind of step it back so it tends to recede back into the background
a little bit more. Ar-...aroun-...along the...ah...I'm going to go to another slide and show you
where the...the tall piece of the building is, just a moment. Um...this piece is um...you're
looking at the...the long um...axis of the building, which you...ah...you probably...you
actually never see. You can see it only a little bit in the upper...um...ah portion of this
elevation, but down below you'll notice that the only height that's 70 feet is
probably... um... something in the neighborhood, it's right there where Bill's pointing to.
Um...it's probably approximately 15 to 20 feet wide, and we've tried to push it as far back on
the building as we can so that we've...ah...basically hid the mechanical equipment but tried to
lower the building at the same time.
JMB Is there anything else you want him to show?
BAC (Unclear)
JMB What?
BAC I think everybody else has seen everything...
SK Oh...ah...incidentally...ah...Councilman Crites, I've already met with John Nagus. Um...he's
pretty...um...supportive of this, and we're going to work together
to...ah...ah...incorporate...ah...the Art In Public Places into our play area, which actually is
going to happen between the existing...um...sort of wall of where the gap is and the existing
theater— we have currently an area there that's...ah...it's filled with trees, it's probably the best
landscaped area on the site. And...ah...we're going to try and maintain some of that
landscaping and incorporate a children's play area and a fountain and some other area...some
other elements.
JMB Okay. Any other questions or...ah...I think Mr. Kelly has a comment.
RSK Yeah...you can turn the lights on for mine, I want to see everybody. Um...we...we have a
little list of...um...things here-- concept of double deck parking garage, concept of expanding
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Robinsons May, concept of stadium theaters, concept of Penney's, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera,
and I'm concerned that there isn't more definition here for the transit...ah...station that we're
going to be tying in, and I think that we have...um...ah...a great opportunity to do something
really spectacular there. Ah...with...ah...all...all of the SunLine buses making their transfers
right outside there in the street, it's always been a problem with people crossing the street and
jaywalking because you can't set it up, we got a wide street there. And so here we have an
opportunity, and we have...a...um...a grant to design the transit center. Um...we went down
to...ah...San Diego, and...ah...um...I know th-...there's...to learn more and see what they're
doing-- we went to the...ah...that the Fashion Valley Mall where they have an intermodal
station there. That intermodal station is tied right in with the shopping center, in fact, it's
closer to the building than the parking lot and the parking structure, and the manager
there...ah...was extremely...um...ah...ah...pleased and bragging about how wonderful that
center was. The light rail actually co -...light rail coming in there...ah...at the time I saw it
there were...ah...about six or seven buses there. We're doing a...a study, and I...I
guess...ah...um...Mr. Wohlmuth can tell us where that stands, but I am worried that somebody
is doing a study for $45,000.00...ah...but they're doing a study that's
completely...ah...unrelated to the project that's going on and that it's not being tied in with it,
and there's a...ah...a comment to set it off...ah...and get it away from the building so it
won't...ah...bother...or...or have a bad effect on the center. And I want to tell
you...um...having just seen presentations from these kind of little...ah...um...ah...intermodal
stations like we're building...ah...prize-winning architecture,
prize-winning... ah...ah...intermodal stations from all over the United States and from other
places in the world that we have an opportunity to do something really spectacular there.
Ah...we would...ah...we...we get good notoriety anyway right now with the Sun -...we're well
known throughout the nation, SunLine Transit is because of the things we're doing with our bus
and everything-- we have these beautiful buses, everybody loves our buses...ah...we want to
stick 'ern out in the street, we don't want 'ern to get near there, and I think that you are missing
a great opportunity if you don't...ah...put that...tie that in, you know, maybe even tie it in with
some kind of a restaurant there. But we should want to have a place where people can come
there and make their changes when they're waiting for the next bus that they can sit somewhere
and...ah...if we don't do something good with an intermodal station there when we're putting
$10 million into a parking structure, we're making a horrible mistake, and I, for one, if I'm not
satisfied that we're doing something, and it's tied in, and we're going to take advantage of this
great opportunity we have, I'm sure not going to vote for it! That's my humble opinion.
BAC Well I'll make one comment to the gentleman that's a little...that's different than Dick's, and
I understand why that's a concern to you. And so let me just pitch one more out. Um...I see
this, and I'm appreciative of I think the improvements have been made, but sort of like Dick's
comment with the $10 million, you know, that we're putting into this...I have a level of
disappointment that I'm sure that whatever you guys did, as an example in the public arts and
everything will be wonderful stuck in a play area and so on. But I think we're missing the same
level of opportunity of not taking our arts program and having it integrated into the physical
design of the buildings and various things, and so on and so forth, so that this darn thing looks
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splashy. A lot of other cities have done things like that, and it Looks good, rather than, once
again, "Well, okay, now we're done with all this, now we're in the play area, we'll stick a
fountain, or a statue, or this, or that." And I don't think that's the best use of our money, and
I've said it for months, and...and...I'm one person, and so be it, but I think we can make this
project a whole lot more of a wow than what I see so far and that. And I know we're just
conceptual, conceptual, conceptual, but by the time the conceptuals are done, it's over, and
we're left with...
RAS Unfortunately, you didn't see the presentation, there's a porte cochere as you come into the mall
that is very dramatic, and maybe we ought to take a minute and...ah...and review that...
BAC Well what I heard from...from them is that here's where they're going to put their AIPP
money-- that's what they just told me.
RAS Well...I...I understand. I understand. I understand, but it...it is unfortunate that you didn't.,
you weren't there for the total presentation.
BAC And I grant that, and sometimes my job doesn't allow it. So. So be it.
RAS I understand that. This is...
RSK It's still unfortunate.
BAC I agree.
JF I have a procedural question. Because I'm...a...I thought we had approved this in August, and
we just had a negative declaration in front of us tonight, of environmental impact.
PD N-... n-... we, by Minute Motion, conceptually approved, in essence, you gave them a real
strong wink. In terms of approving the resolution of approval with the conditions of approval
with saying, "Yes, you can build a 60-..64-foot high theater that looks basically like, and it
looks" ...that didn't occur.
JF That did not...it...and...is that occurring tonight?
PD Th-...that can occur tonight. Ah...remember at...at that time, staff, at that time, especially at
the time the report was written...ah...the theater was basically a...ah...undistinguished box.
By the time it got to the meeting, they had done some refinements to it, and subsequently,
they've done more refinements to it. So it has then gone to the Architectural Commission, and
now they've given it preliminary approval. So the...ah...again, based on your evaluation of
the design of the project, is it at a stage where...ah...you can say, in terms of
the...ah...physical dimensions, the general, you know, is this a point as a...as a...granted that
there's going to be again, more architectural refinements that...that you are going to be in a
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JF
position to be reviewing. Ah...in terms of the general, again, description of the exhibits that
you see, are they acceptable or are they not? Ah...or is...is...is a...is the theater as you see it
designed...ah...acceptable in terms of its physical dimensions given the design direction it has,
or is it not? Or...or is the Applicant...should the Applicant be directed to...ah...put it in the
ground? Ah...should they be directed to, again, change the architecture? Um...th-...those
are...ah...ah...ah...again, those are, that's a fundamental direc-...the Architectural Commission
has said yes, that the improvements you've made are now make it acceptable. Ah...th-...they
need a re -...a similar sort of reaction either positively or negatively from the...the Council to,
in the form of what we usually approve as saying yes, in general description, this is you can
build this. And that did not occur on the Au -...in the August meeting.
Well this ties into what Councilman Crites said. Typically, when we get a plan for approval,
we get blueprints, and we know specifically and exactly what's going to happen. And I was
at that meeting, and it was conceptual; I looked at those materials, which are all conceptual.
Ah...I see we've given conceptual approval, our Agenda packet said we're evaluating a
declaration of...ah...a negative declaration of environmental impact, which is not a specific
plan, per se. And...and I guess, if the question is, is it a negative declaration of an
environmental impact to put a parking structure on existing asphalt, my question is probably
yes, it is a negative declaration.
PD No... n-.. .
JF But we're talking about issues that have nothing to do with impacts on the environment.
RAS The way I look at it is this is a lot like the Clubhouse at our country club that we're building
right now. You saw the plan, you saw the layout, you saw where the garage is, you know the
height level, all that you know. Every piece has to go through Architectural Review and then
come back to us. The expansion of...ah...of Robinsons May has to come back to us. The
expansion of Macy's has to come back to us. The remodel of Penney's has to come back to us.
The addition of another department store there has to come back to us. This is a conceptual
plan to, hopefully, get this underway, because without that, they're not going to start. Now I'm
not suggesting that we shouldn't have the intermodal built in from the get -go, but as far as the
rest of the center is concerned, we went down there, we saw the plans, we saw stadium seating
theaters. We saw how the whole thing will layout, and conceptually, do you like it or you
don't, that's all.
JF Okay. So if staff is saying that Art In Public Places and dressing it up, the specifics will come
back to us at a later date...
RAD That's correct.
JF ...and we can add in the intermodal facility, but just, in terms of building mass...
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RSK Where is it now? Where's the intermodal...where's it at right now?
RAD Ah...Mr. Wohlmuth?
JMW The...inter-...ah...Parsons Group has, is currently our consultant in designing...um...the traffic
study, the transportation plan, the facilities layout for the intermodal station. We've been
working with Hahn-Trizec on...ah...the placement of that. It is currently in the
agreement...ah...we've identified...um...an area, which is in the north side of the parking lot.
We've talked about a corridor, a walk corridor to the building...ah...our concern in working
with Parsons and putting that intermodal station on the building or adjacent to the building is
that we are planning a little different facility, we're planning some long range parking because
of the need Palm Desert has for transportation to and from airport. For
example... um... um... the... ah... the train... ah... connection.
RSK There's a spine road that goes through there.
JF Right.
RSK That...
JMW Yes.
RSK That has the Ight on it and that goes next to the...
JMW Yes.
RSK ...residential area.
JMW Yes.
RSK And so...is...is...the...ah...intermodal station just on the north side of the spine road?
JMW The intermodal station is on the north side of the...
RSK How far?
JMW It is approximately...um...it starts at the end of Goodyear and goes all the way back
to...ah...the end of the property, approximately. So it goes from, I guess...um...the...the
spine...there's a spine road, and then there's another access to the fire station and Goodyear.
It would be from that acca-...ac-...ah...ingress/egress north, and Parsons is working on the
design to cor-...with SunLine and with the City of Palm Desert and with Hahn-Trizec to
provide...um...the necessary...um...bus turn connection. Um...remember, we're trying to
get... ah... the... um... the... airport transit and...
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RSK Everything.
JMW ...and everything in that facility. In addition,...
RSK Amtrak?
JMW Amtrak Thruway will be stopping...
RSK (Unclear)...not a train, it's just a bus.
JMW Amtrak Thruway will be stopping there. In addition, we're...we...in the agreement we've
placed...um...20 of...I...I believe the latest figure is 2,500 square feet of building for a coffee
shop or a...area that people can...um...
JMB Wait.
JMW ...wait for their...ah...transit. Um...but we've looked at this facility not only as a connection,
but maybe even long range parking. We...we've talked about secure parking because of the
need to have the vehicles that will maybe park there, do their weekend trip, and their vehicle
will there in the...ah...on Sunday evening kind of thing. So we've looked at a lot of different
issues. Parsons will complete the report, Dick?
RIF They've been working with SunLine and the...ah...um...Triz-...Hahn-Trizec group as well as
Mollie Doyle there. Ah...some of the things that...ah...have been mentioned by Councilman
Kelly are being considered by them. So the whole program, it's still got a ways to go. Ah...I
would say probably within the next...ah...45-60 days we'll have a report back giving
some...ah...pro-...some kind of a program on a layout.
RSK W-...well now you...it has a long ways to go but, you say, but...but we got all these beautiful
pictures about this part, why can't we have a beautiful picture that...the plot and that shows
where the intermodal station and everything is going to be also?
JF The -...they're not building the intermodal station, are they?
RSK Well I know, but I meant...my st-...they're not doing it, but staff is putting the whole program
together, and to me, that's inte-...that's an extremely important part...
JMW We place...
RSK ...of the project.
JMW We placed an envelope, a development envelope for the...the intermodal station into this
project. We will bring back that final report, designed for the intermodal station...um...ideas
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on how we'll accomplish the coffee shop. We're going to actually be applying for
some...ah...large grant monies to build this intermodal station as we come up to the funding
year, and we'll bring all that back to...ah...the Council...um...as soon as Parsons completes
their work with SunLine.
RSK Grant money is wonderful, but another worry I have is that...ah...we'll...five years down the
line we'll still be looking for some grant money, and there'll be no intermodal station.
And...the-...there are other ways to accomplish that also.
JMW Okay. It is in the 2010 Plan. We...we accom-...we intend on getting this in the agreement,
building an intermodal station, and applying for grant money, and we'll, if grant money's not
available, or we need to proceed sooner, staff will work on the budget process and bring that
to Council.
RSK By the way, I'm not interested in just only the intermodal station, I agree with...ah...Mist-
...Councilman Crites, because one of the problems there is that long...um...parking structure,
and there was some concern, I know when we were in San Diego with some of the other
Council members about that not having...being broken up some way. So I like the idea of the
long, of the parking structure the way it is-- I think it's great, but it's a real opportunity to do
something...ah...artistically to break that up so it looks better than it does.
JF
I have a question for staff. Will us approving this negative declaration of environmental impact
in any way preclude us addressing the concerns that Councilman Crites has expressed, that I
have agreed with, and also that Councilman Kelly has brought up this afternoon?
PD O-...o-...okay, you are not just, if you -...the Agenda item is not just approving the negative
declaration, and it's an amendment to a development plan, the reason why it's a development
plan is in those days when we approved this, it was a development plan, not precise plan. So
this is approving the project. You can, through the conditions, reserve...ah...ah...additional
review of any aspect of the project you want to resu-...reserve...I...I think the...the...the
critical, in my view, issue that has to be resolved is this theater. Is...is the architectural
direction of the theater, as presented...ah...with the height as presented...um...'cause that...that
is a...one of the major, major, major aspects of this...of this plan. Ah...and it's one that has,
that's not simply designed, it's got physical requirements, that theater has physical, internal
requirements which you can't modify. Ah...is that...is...is...are those exhibits that you've seen
acceptable? Right. There are no exhibits on the...on the...ah...intermodal
station...if...if...ah...you want to reserve the...I...for example the site plan does show the
location of that intermodal station. If you're going to ex -...exempt that and say no, as far as
we're concerned, it's not necessarily there. This approval does not freeze that location; it woul-
... it could go further... further south and right up against the parking structure, whatever. I
mean, that's something for further review. So you can accept any aspect...ah...you feel needs
accepting.
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RSK One more on...I...I would like to see included in any decision we make tonight concurrence
with the Council. Hopefully, ah... my fellow Council members feel strong about the
transportation center also. I don't know if you do or don't, and I don't know if you say, "Well
Kelly's just blowin' off again," or not, or how do you...the rest of you feel. Do you think
that's important, or not?
JMB Well I...I think it's important, but I also...I...I think it's a...I think it should be integrated in
with it, but I don't think that's TrizecHahn's, a part of their approval tonight.
RSK But it's our staffs problem.
JMB Yeah.
RAS Yeah. Well yeah, I agree with that, and I think it should be integrated within, and I think that
that could be...I would recommend that would be a condition added. But I still feel very
strongly that we need to approve this tonight.
RSK Yeah. I'm not...have any problem with that, but...but...in the...the part of it's not their
problem, it is their problem. It's their land we're doing it on. It's...it's an integral part of the
agreement they're going to make with them because we're doing it on their property.
RAS But it's our parking structure.
RSK Exactly. See it's all tied in.
JMB Yeah, but I meant they're not in the construction of...of adding that into their plan.
RSK But it all is a part of it because it's the part of their property, and a part of the m-...
JMB But I agree with the fact that we should see a picture of how it comes out, flows through there,
the same as you're talking about...
RSK Well I you know, I never...
JMB ...but it's their approval.
RSK ...heard their commitment.
RAS Let the developer comment.
WD Okay. In the agreement with the City over the parking garage is our commitment to provide
the pad for the...the...ah...multimodal transportation system. So the 2,500 sq-...foot pad is laid
out, and we have agreed to make that available to the City or any agency that will...will build
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and operate that system. Ah...we will also provide a...a shelter connection between there and
the mall as a part of our design, but we can't design to something that we don't know exists yet.
RSK Well yeah, I understand that.
WD But we're prepared to provide that as a future improvement.
RSK But also you have an interest in it because it's going to be a part of your complex, and so you
should be just as interested as any-...you...have an input to saying, "Hey you want to be sure
that's right," and fits in right, and is something special.
WD Well...we...we...since that's your part, we presume we'll have a chance to comment on that
when you do it.
RSK I'd like to think you'll be interested in making sure we do something.
WD But...but like we talked about it in San Diego, the Hopper for instance, that's something
that..that we need to also make...ah...accommodations for, because that wasn't originally
planned. But the Hopper would be, the Shopper Hopper?
RAS Yes.
WD Would be another connection that could be made from the transit facility to the entrances, each
of the entrances of the property, but the nice thing about that is it's a small enough bus, or fa -
...facility that it won't require the kind of design changes that...that the multimodal station will
because it requires...ah...separate asphalt for it and everything else to accommodate it.
JF
Well and I guess, since you asked the question, I would agree with Councilman Spiegel. I don't
know whether I'm for or against an intermodal transportation facility, I'm not sure I even know
what one is. Um...I know that we approved some money to do some preliminary engineering
and... and research to take a look at; I've read nothing about it, it has never been in a packet,
I defer to you in your wisdom on transportation and assume, therefore, it's probably...
RSK Mr. Spiegel, too, he's my alternate.
JF Well it's..it's....let's assume it's a good idea, it's not really in our packet tonight, and I think
the developer's expressed a willingness to work with us in a way that we're working with them
to make it a reality. I would like to find out precisely what it is we're voting on, or being asked
to vote on, if it's the theater, I'm prepared to do that; if it's the negative dec, I'm prepared to
do that. But at the same time, I want to be sensitive to the point Councilman Crites raised,
because it's my point as well, I would like to be able to go through the fine details of that
parking structure. Conceptually, I don't have a problem with it.
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—" PD Okay. Conceptually, in terms of the footprint and the height and the physical dimensions,
okay. Um...
RAD And the Applicant is now...ah...does contact...is working with John Nagus...ah...our Art In
Public Places...um...Coordinator on that in dealing with that, and...and mov-...dealing with
the entire center...
BAC Right. And I think we should...
RAD ...on those issues. So we will...and will continue to play on this also.
JMB That will all come back.
BAC ...and that will come back. You know if...if indeed what you're looking for is a...reconceptual
approval of the parking structure layout...
JF Theater height.
BAC ...but the one thing is the theater height, I think we ought to, as an example, also be able to
come back and look at, for instance, some of the exterior wall treatments and so on and so
forth. Because that may very well end up being something that we do with things.
And...and...and it's a personal opinion-- I always get quivery when somebody says, "You
know what? Let me tell you how we'll fix this, we'll cover it with a plant." And I love plants,
but...but somebody's telling me something when they say that's how we'll fix it's to hide it.
Maybe there are things we can do that both hide it and do things that make it so darn visible
that we'd enjoy seeing it, and so on and so forth.
RAD And...and...we will be...we will...that will come back to do you.
PD And...and we've attempted to do that. An -...and if you...if you saw the first drawing and see
where it is now, you'd, again...
BAC Yeah, that's what I mean.
PD Ah...and...and the Architectural Commission...and...and again, that...that back of that theater
you're going to see, and you...you see from the...ah...photo illustrations, you're going to see
it, and...and there's no landscaping that's going to...that's going to screen it from most of the
views, and...and the goal is to make it acceptable to see when you see it.
BAC That's what I mean, and maybe there's some things we can do that make it more than somewhat
Spanish, or whatever it has...
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RAS This whole project will take between three and four years from its start date, which God willing
will be right around the beginning of next year to finish. And all of the parts will be coming
back to this group.
JF And if...as long as I get a nod from Mr. Drell on that, I'm completely okay. I think the
developer's aware that this Council takes a very avid interest in developments of this scale.
Four of us spent an entire day with you looking at two other shopping centers in San Diego, we
brought our City Manager along, our Planning Director along, and conceptually, I don't have
a problem with voting on this tonight. But in terms of the details, I want to make sure that they
all come back to us.
PD Most importantly, there's an OPA out there which requires the approval, which makes the
whole thing happen, and without that, nothing can happen. So you always have that ultimate
hammer.
JF OPA?
PD The... the agreement, the business agreement relative to the participation of the City and
Agency.
JF Okay.
RAD Right.
JMB Okay. Any more questions, comments?
BAC I know that staff has all those issues down, and...and clarified for us, and the City Clerk's
office will have those in the Minutes, and so I'd move then for approval given the issues that
we've discussed today as being appropriate to return.
JF Second.
JMB Please vote.
RDK Motion carries by unanimous vote.
JMB Thank you.
For purposes of clarification, Councilman/Member Crites moved to reserve the right to further review
the issues, as he requested the City Clerk's office to duly note in these Minutes, of landscaping, theater
height, connectivity of the intermodal station, and placement of artwork for the Art In Public Places
requirement. Motion was seconded by Ferguson and carried by unanimous vote.
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`- IX. REPORTS, REMARKS, AND AGENCY BOARD ITEMS REQUIRING ACTION
A. EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR
None
B. AGENCY COUNSEL
Request for Closed Session:
Conference with Real Property Negotiator pursuant to Section 54956.8:
1) Property: Land located in Section 4 - Desert Willow
Negotiating Parties:
Agency: Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency/Carlos L. Ortega, Executive Director
Property Owner: Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency
Under Negotiation: Price Terms of Payment
Conference with Legal Counsel regarding existing litigation pursuant to Government Code
Section 54956.9(a):
a) City of Palm Desert v. REFCO Capital Corporation, et al., United States District Court,
Central District, Case No. CV92-7632
b) City of Orange, et al. v. Alabama Treasury Advisory Program, et al., Los Angeles
Superior court Case No. BC106461
C. CHAIRMAN AND MEMBERS OF THE AGENCY
None
X. AWARDS, PRESENTATIONS, AND APPOINTMENTS
A. APPOINTMENTS TO THE CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA
NO. 4 TO FILL THREE VACANCIES.
Mayor Pro-Tempore Spiegel moved to, by Minute Motion, appoint Marilynn Hamlet, Frank Proulx,
and Aulden Schlatter to the Citizens' Advisory Committee for Project Area No. 4. Motion was seconded
by Ferguson and carried by unanimous vote.
XI. PUBLIC HEARINGS
None
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XII. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
None
XIII. ADJOURNMENT
With Agency Board concurrence, Chairman Benson adjourned the meeting to Closed Session at
6:12 p.m. She reconvened the meeting at 7:08 p.m. and adjourned to Closed Session at 7:28 p.m. She
reconvened the meeting at 7:59 p.m. and immediately adjourned with no action announced from Closed
Session.
ATTEST:
LIZ
SHEILA R. G LIGAN, ENCY SECRETARY
PALM DESERT REDE LOPMENT AGENCY
JEM. BENSON, CHAIRMAN
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