HomeMy WebLinkAboutPA4 - Minutes - 06/15/097
PALM DESERT REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR
PROJECT AREA NO. 4
MINUTES
JUNE 15, 2009
CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Fred Benford called a regular meeting to order on Monday,
June 15, 2009, at 3:00 p.m.
ROLL CALL
Members Present: Members Absent:
Charles Ash Javier Lopez
Fred Benford Susan McMillen
Russ Campbell
Jane Daugherty
Robert Duncan
Roberta Grubb , 1
Kelly Litecky F�-PCa BY RDA 6—C'
Douglas Luhring ON q _ 04_ 09
Also Present: VERIFIED BY �9-Jk-
Martin Alvarez, Redevelopment Manager
Lauri Aylaian, Director of Planning Original on file with City Cler 's Office
Randy Case, Palm Desert Country Club
Phyllis Harkins, Palm Desert Country Club Association
Maria Hunt, Recording Secretary
Justin McCarthy, ACM for Redevelopment
Hart Ponder, Code Compliance Manager
Arla Scott, Senior Financial Analyst
Lt. Andrew Shouse, Palm Desert Police Department
Dave Simmons, Palm Desert Country Club
Robert Spiegel, Councilmember
Catherine Walker, Senior Management Analyst
John M. Wohlmuth, City Manager
Dave Yrigoyen, Director of Redevelopment/Housing
CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
MINUTES June 15, 2009
Ill. ORAL COMMUNICATIONS
Mayor Spiegel asked the Committee members to introduce themselves.
Member Ash requested an update on the Sheriff Station located in the
Palm Desert Country Club. Lt. Shouse stated that the City did contact the
owner of the complex and were able to negotiate a new contract for an
additional year lease at $1 per year. The Sheriff Substation will be open
for at least another year. Member Ash noted that the rent had been $1
per year and later was increased to $60,000 per year. The City had
decided to close the Substation because the new Sheriff Station would
service the area. In the meantime, the owners contacted the City and
offered them the $1 per year lease, so the City decided to keep the station
until such time as the new facility is completed.
IV. CONSENT CALENDAR
APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF THE CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE
FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4 MEETING OF MARCH 16, 2009.
With Committee concurrence, the Minutes of the April 20, 2009
meeting were approved with the following corrections: (1) Include
Councilmember Richard Kelly to list of attendees; (2) Under Oral
Communications change 300 feet to 15 feet.
V.
UNFINISHED BUSINESS
None
VI.
NEW BUSINESS
None
VI1.
CONTINUED BUSINESS
None
VIII.
OLD BUSINESS
None
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
MINUTES June 15, 2009
IX. INFORMATIONAL ITEMS
A. STATUS ON PALM DESERT COUNTRY CLUB GOLF COURSE
Justin McCarthy, Assistant City Manager for Redevelopment, reported
that the PDCC LLC had tendered a proposal to the City whereby the
City would acquire 10,000 rounds of golf per year for the sum of
approximately $200,000 or $20 per round. We have looked at that
and found that it is based on a number of assumptions that cannot be
validated. Staff's direction to date is that we are not prepared to
contemplate that participation. I think it would be helpful to put a
couple of things into perspective. The $200,000 per year is not fully
adequate to solve the challenges that are out at Palm Desert Country
Club at this time. The proposal requires approximately another
$450,000 in revenues to meet the objectives of the proposal. Of
those, $250,000 is contemplated to be revenues derived from the sale
of the 10,000 rounds, plus another $250,000 per year in ancillary
revenues. So that means you have approximately a $650,000 a year
challenge to right -size the asset within the parameters proposed by
the developer. I can't speak to whether it is accurate or whether it
would be appropriate. I just want to put that on the table so that
everybody understands that we are not just talking about $200,000
per year.
We estimate approximately 1,650 different lots in PDCC. If you
assume $200,000 per year, that is about $10 a month per lot. If you
reduce that by approximately the 850 homes that surround the golf
course, then you get to about $20 a month to support the $200,000.
So, there are a variety of options. One would be for the homeowners
to look at could they possibly be a part of the solution out there.
Another option is to look at an assessment district, and at this time,
we are trying to evaluate that to see if it is feasible.
Member Grubb asked what the $650,000 was that he had mentioned.
Mr. McCarthy replied that it is what we estimate the total revenues
necessary for the assumptions within the proposal tendered by the
developer. That comprises the $200,000 per year proposed as the
purchase of the 10,000 rounds a year by the City; another $250,000
that is assumed to be generated by the sales of those discounted
sales; and then another $200,000 of ancillary revenue. These are
averages. One of the concerns that staff has in terms of reading and
following a lot of the dialogue is that there may be this apprehension
that only $200,000 a year solves the problem. I felt it was important to
put that on the table so people understand the kind of dilemma that
the City is confronted with.
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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Chairman Benford inquired about the number of homes in PDCC. Mr.
McCarthy stated it depends on how you calculate it. We came up with
1,643 parcels, not including apartments, etc. It breaks down to about
1,540 single-family residences. You divide that into the $200,000 and
you get a sense of the requirement, if indeed the owners of the
residential properties participate at the proposed $200,000 a year.
Chairman Benford stated that those who do not live on the golf course
will be affected just as much as those who do live on the golf course.
I personally think that if there is an assessment that the City includes
everyone in the community because everybody would be affected
value wise. Mr. McCarthy stated that this is one of the challenges that
staff is confronted with when evaluating an assessment district
concept. There is a direct correlation between the benefit that accrues
to properties that abut the golf course, i.e. the view that they have.
You have this very sizable greenbelt that backs up to your property,
and it is a direct benefit. An appraiser could actually identify what the
premium value of that benefit might be. It gives you a straightforward
base on which you could allocate benefit and charge appropriately.
When you get to the lots that are not on the course, under the laws
and the structure of assessment districts, it becomes extremely
tenuous. That is one of the challenges with the assessment district
concept. Another complexity of this situation is that you have an HOA,
but it does not necessarily represent all the property owners.
Chairman Benford stated that the Council could definitely take into
consideration the benefits of each. Mr. McCarthy explained that the
City does not have the ability under the assessment district structure
to arbitrarily allocate. The benefit has to be defined through an
engineering process. It is easy to do with the lots that abut the course;
but it is much more tenuous and difficult to arrive at what a benefit
should be for those that do not. It would be a much smaller share of
the benefit and, therefore, the cost would accrue to lots off the course.
The question as to whether you can make a finding of benefit through
the appropriate process, if indeed that is possible, has not been
answered.
Mayor Spiegel asked Mr. McCarthy to explain how an assessment
district is set up. Mr. McCarthy explained that basically you identify a
public benefit. An engineering firm is hired to do a study to identify
how much that benefit accrues to each lot. A larger lot might have a
bigger share based on how much view they have. This is not quite
the same as evaluating the overhead undergrounding process. We
know these are defined costs to the undergrounding, and the costs
are usually spread by some kind of objective criteria in terms of lot
size, etc. We are talking about something a bit more ambiguous such
as what is the benefit of having a golf course right next to your house
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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or a block away. We would have to go through a process to identify
that benefit. From staff's perspective, I understand, having talked to
the HOA Manager, that there are challenges under the HOA approach
that are not even conceivable in theory that it could arrive at this with
a much less onerous process than the City could through an
assessment district.
Chairman Benford stated that this onerous process will take an
immense amount of time; Mr. McCarthy agreed. Chairman Benford
added that the golf course could be closed before an assessment is
approved by the City. Mr. McCarthy stated that we are not sure yet
whether the golf course will be closed. It may wind up going through
some sort of receivership process where at least a minimal operating
level could be achieved. Staff is talking to legal advisors to determine
what the City can do to at least mitigate this process. One of those
things might be that we intervene with the courts and request that
some minimal level of maintenance be maintained, at least to prevent
the course from going fallow and become a blighted condition that
existed prior to the redevelopment of the course.
Member Ash asked how much money the City of Palm Desert
receives from the State for redevelopment. Mr. McCarthy replied he
did not know off hand. He asked if they were just talking about Project
Area No. 4, or throughout the City. Member Ash stated that he was
not talking about the City. Member Ash asked if it was at Mr.
McCarthy's discretion on how the redevelopment money is spent. Mr.
McCarthy stated that they should take the word "discretion" out of that
dialogue. He stated that the Palm Desert Redevelopment Agency
currently gets approximately $80-$90 million per year in gross
revenue. A very sizable portion of that is passed through to the
County and other taxing agencies, substantially reducing that number.
Then you have debt service on the bonding commitments, which is
another substantial number that it is reduced. Plus, most of the
redevelopment money has to be spent in the specific project area
from whence it is derived. Therefore, how much the Agency gets
relative to this issue is not relevant; Member Ash disagreed. Mr.
McCarthy stated that it would be a fair discussion to say how much
does Project Area No. 4 get. Now if you are asking are there
adequate funds in Project Area No. 4 to try to respond to this
proposal, the answer is "Yes". That is a policy decision on the part of
the Council. There are a variety of alternatives that seem to be more
appropriate than tapping into public dollars.
Member Ash stated that one of his primary objections was when
Councilmember Finerty made the comment that was printed in the
paper that said she is more concerned about Desert Willow than
anything else in town. I know that it is a public course owned by the
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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City, but to make a comment like that says basically forget about
everybody else. He told Mr. McCarthy that he was not putting him
down or sticking up for the management because he had been misled
on this $200,000. My point is that I think that the golf course is going
to go under before any kind of assessment district is in place or
approved. We need to look to see if there is a way it could be helped.
Mr. McCarthy stated that there is one entity in this entire discussion
that no one has been willing to take into consideration, and that is the
lender, who has substantial debt on the property. Is the Lender just
going to sit idly by and let the value of securing its debt completely
wither on the vine? That question has not been answered yet.
Chairman Benford asked if he was indicating that they might
repossess. Mr. McCarthy replied that all lenders have an ability to
foreclose on a property. If you foreclose on a property, especially if it
is a revenue bearing asset, you do not want it to go to zero revenue
so that all its value gets destroyed, and the security for your loan and
your ability to recover at a higher percentage is destroyed in the
process. We need to understand that there is another player beyond
the City, the developer, and the community. Where does the lender
stand in all this? None of us know.
Chairman Benford asked Randy Case to present his comments. Mr.
Case reported that many questions have been raised and people
want answers. The street markings and signage for the golf cart path
crossings have finally been completed. The Executive Course was
closed on June 1 and will not be watered or mowed for the summer
for the over -seeding process. It is a financial issue for us because we
are losing money maintaining the course.
Chairman Benford asked if he was the majority of the financial
ownership of the company. Mr. Case replied that there are three
owners. The ownership used to be Dahoon Investment Corporation.
In 2006, it was transferred to PDCC Development LLC, who is the
owner of the golf course and property. He explained that he owns
15%, Larry Kosmont 15%, and Dahoon 70%. He stated that Mr.
McCarthy had done a great job, and they were privileged to be
working with the City and the Committee. Unfortunately, we are at a
crossroads. There are 130+ courses out here and this is one of three
or four that gets no money from homes that front the golf course. We
got into this development knowing that.
Member Ash asked Mr. Case how much PDCC received from D.R.
Horton on the sale of the lots. Mr. Case replied that 95 lots were
entitled with the City's help, and 92 were sold for about $14.5 million.
In 2003-2004, the golf course was closed to operations but not for
maintenance. It costs about $2 million to maintain a golf course.
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When it is closed, it takes about $1.5 million to maintain. It cost $1.5
million ongoing for three years for maintenance during the renovation,
plus $13 million for the renovation. That has put us where we are
today. There is no hidden agenda. Because of our overruns, for which
we take responsibility, higher gas prices, and the economy, we have
$1.5 million behind us that we have to take care of. We are $17.5
million into it, which is $4 million less than what we have. It is not like
we took the money and ran; we put it all back into the golf course and
maintained it to the level that was necessary to get it open in 2006.
Member Ash asked if PDCC Development, LLC would be willing to
open their books to the City prior to any consideration that they might
have. Mr. Case replied absolutely, we gave their consultant all the
numbers in January/February. There is no tape running on the side for
me, my partners, or anyone else. It costs what it costs to operate a
golf course. Unfortunately, the market is different today than it was
three years ago. It is about trying to preserve what we created out
there, and for which we received an award in 2007, and not having to
go back to what it was before.
As far as the $200,000 per year, the things in the paper, media, and
what Mr. McCarthy talked about, this was a cooperative discussion
among City staff, me, and the ownership of Palm Desert. Is $200,000
a year going to make it for us? No, it is not. What it was going to
enable us to do was to go back to Wilshire State Bank, the major
lender who has the First Trust Deed in the amount of $6.8 million. We
have met with the bank several times, and have another meeting set
up in ten days to capitalize that cash flow stream. We thought it was
a good idea for citizens to get a discount at Desert Willow, and why
not give them another opportunity. We have the capacity in the high
season. The City asked us all those questions, and we gave them all
those answers. It does sound like a bailout, but it is not. We would be
helping 65,000 Palm Desert residents enjoy play at $25 at Palm
Desert Country Club. People need another option. Courses like ours
are either city -owned courses or they have backup from the
homeowners. Unfortunately, we were formed in 1962 and they didn't
think about it then. Now, it is impossible.
Question was raised as to who gets the homeowners' fees that are
paid annually. Mr. Case replied that the HOA gets the fees, the golf
course gets nothing. All the golf courses in Project Area No. 4 receive
money monthly. I am not advocating an assessment. We are looking
for possible solutions, and one of them is the City's assistance. It was
the City staff who came up with the idea of the City buying rounds in a
discussion we had with them. We explored the idea, and decided we
could do that. Now, it sounds as though we are threatening Desert
Willow. The economy is tough. In the long-term prosperity of our
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course, it needs either an assessment or it needs some assistance.
Let's at least observe it, recognize it, and find a way to fix it. We fixed
the course, and it is one of the best in the entire area. We don't want
to lose that.
Chairman Benford asked if an assessment is approved, does it have
to be voted upon by the area residents. Member Ash stated that if it's
the same format as the undergrounding, it would take 70% of the vote
to even put it out for vote. Then, it would take 51 % of the homeowners
to approve the assessment district. Mayor Spiegel added that some
people would have more of a vote than others based on the size of
the house and its location.
Mr. Case addressed a couple of items that Mr. McCarthy had
mentioned. We are working extensively with the lender, Wilshire
State Bank, and they have been very patient with us. A couple of
meetings have been scheduled with their executives next week to try
to figure out how they can play a significant role. We went to them
first. The other item is the discussion about the $650,000. We opened
in 2006, and we knew that the first year would be a loser. It was
about a $1 million loser; second year was about $600,000; and this
year it is about $350,000. We are working toward a profitable
venture. We do not need $650,000 to make this thing work. The
$200,000 doesn't do it, because I have to get rid of $1.5 million that
was one of the leases I'm carrying. We're optimistic that by next year
we will be cash flow neutral. We are right on the numbers for this
year, not $650,000. We will be happy to share all those and more if
that is what is needed. We have been working for two full years
towards profitability, but have been hit by double digit unemployment,
high gas prices, and no economy. We have had a productive first half
of the year. We will have the water and electricity tomorrow, but the
day after that I don't know.
Member Grubb stated that each time Mr. Case came to a meeting he
told us wonderful things about what's going on with the golf course.
The one thing that is missing is that we should see some sort of
financial statement. You think that it takes just $200,000 to get you
out of trouble; then someone else says it would not be $200,000 but
$650,000. Then if you wanted to assess those that abut the golf
course, it would be about $62 a month for 12 months and that would
bring in $650,000 based on 850 homes. Mr. Case replied that they
could provide simple numbers such as revenue and expenses. There
is nothing proprietary, nothing hidden, and no agenda. Our only
agenda is 5,000 people. Most people have asked us, why not just
walk away? We have a reputation here and in Southern California.
We are proud of what we built. I may never recoup a dime of the
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money that I put in, and I am not walking away from this and neither is
Larry Kosmont.
Chairman Benford announced that there were some questions from
the audience. He asked that they limit their comments to three
minutes and to not repeat what somebody has already commented
on.
Dennis Davis, 77-330 Colorado St., Palm Desert, noted that Mr. Case
had mentioned that Horton had paid $14 million for the land, and
another $6.8 million was borrowed from the bank. So you are really
talking about $22 million, and going through all that in three years.
Mr. Case replied that when they started the project, he had stood in
front of the Council in 2004 and advised them that the budget would
be about $9 million, which included the $6.8 million plus the lots. He
added that they got sued, and other things had happened. Instead of
$9.1 million, it ended up costing about $13 million to build it. In
addition to that, operating it negatively daily for 5 years has gotten us
to where we are. We spent about $22 million. Mr. Davis stated that
we've heard the term "bailout", and thought it was unwise to look at it
as a bailout situation. We are concerned about the homes and the
values of 5,000 property taxpayers. The reason that the picture of the
rounds wasn't considered by one of the Council members is because
they felt it would be in direct competition to Desert Willow. Actually, I
think it would be an adjunct to the golfing experience in Palm Desert
to have this kind of facility available because there are many times
during season and after season that you can't get a tee time at Desert
Willow. Some of this traffic could be routed. The experiences are not
exactly the same because Desert Willow is a more difficult course and
more upscale situation, but our course and facility are nice. I think it
might be an adjunct to the City of Palm Desert to have that available
to them as opposed to not have anything available to them.
Chairman Benford asked Fred Simmons if he still wanted to comment
on reviewing the PDCC books, to which Mr. Simmons replied that
enough had been said.
Jim Reithoffer, 43-360 Illinois Ave., stated he was a PDCC
homeowner with a home on the golf course. There are three people
who are seriously impacted by this whole situation. The developers,
to my mind's eye, have justified that they made an investment and
things happened. I believe that their interests are sincere to preserve
what they created, and I see the tremendous impact it has had on this
neighborhood. It turned a "slum" into something that we have pride in.
All of us were major benefactors from that and I think we are all very
grateful, or should be, at least to the development. As such, we will
be negatively impacted just like the old timers who saw when it
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happened. We stand to benefit, the club stands to benefit, and most
definitely the City has a major investment in that they have put that
substation at the mouth of our development for a reason. We have a
very vulnerable and very tenuous position in that area with 50-year old
homes ranging around 1,000 square feet, that is on the brink of being
a sustainable reasonable neighborhood or being a slum.
Since they have brought in their development, we have seen a huge
influx of personal individuals with pride developing their homes,
increasing the tax base for the City, and minimizing the crime issue.
The City has a large investment in it. We, the benefactors, particularly
those on the golf course, have a major investment and benefit that we
should be grateful for. So I see three people who should get together
and do some heavy lifting as a group to solve this problem. One is to
protect the City and its integrity; and the other is the neighborhood
influence and benefits that we all enjoy. I would hope that some
committee or citizens' committee could get together to analyze this
situation to see what everybody can do to make this a tenable
situation. There is no reason why this neighborhood has to become
what it once was, and which took 17 years to crawl out of.
Don Colletta, President of the Men's Club of the Palm Desert Country
Club, 43-790 Venice Drive, La Quinta. He stated he was speaking for
the nine member board and also believed for the entire Men's Club
membership. I have been a member of PDCC since 1989. 1 have
seen many changes of ownership over the years and have
experienced all degrees of turmoil. I will share a time in the early 90's
when the course was unattended and overgrown. My neighbors and I
had to sleep with loaded guns, as we feared for our lives with all the
uninvited activity that was going on after dark on the course. Areas,
as large as this Country Club if left to go seed, invite some
undesirables and the danger that accompanies them. The City has
spent a lot of money remodeling and revitalizing this area, and I
cannot accept letting this Country Club go under without a fight. We
must do something to keep this Country Club alive. Homeowners'
property taxes have to be reassessed, hence lowering the tax
revenue to the City in the event this club goes to seed. We are an
ungated community and do not have homeowner's revenues
supporting the golf course. I read a letter in the Desert Sun's Opinion
section discussing a possible solution on Sunday. That solution
would charge the homeowners an assessment protecting the club
from this recurring problem. This strikes me as very viable. The
article reads a modest yearly assessment is a reasonable way to
maintain the community, as well as protecting the value of individual
providence. The terms "bailout funds" or "welfare" are being used to
discourage any type of short-term or long-term solutions. We have
the perfect facility to handle the golfers of any age and a reasonable
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fee. My final point is that the publicity this situation has generated will
put the real estate activity around the course at a complete standstill,
unless a solution is reached quickly. This problem affects many
people, their homes, and their savings. We, the members, are willing
to work with the Committee for a fast and reasonable solution.
Lena Slayton, 77-275 California Drive, referred to Member Grubb's
calculation. If she's right, and it only takes $62 from us, why would we
not do it to save our golf course? I live on the golf course and I do not
want to see it go bad. There is a lake out there, and I am scared to
death that it may draw unwelcome activity. We should do whatever it
takes to save the golf course. Member Grubb noted it was just her
own math. Ms. Slayton stated she pays $300 to the HOA, and she
has been disappointed with them because they don't take care of
business. If they get $300 a year, why can't those of us who live on
the golf course at least shell out $200? It is just a suggestion.
Gary Houtz, 77-370 Minnesota Ave., stated he had a couple of quick
observations. This all began because a previous owner let the
property run down into a condition that was pretty much unplayable
and sad. I am a little unnerved by the fact that the same owner owns
70% of the company that runs the golf course. Secondly, I own
several properties at PDCC, all on the golf course, except one. I paid
premium prices for the lots on the golf course. My property tax is
based on the fact that I paid more for my house than the guy across
the street that is not on the golf course. Lastly, I do not want the golf
course to go down. If it is not able to be maintained by the current
owners, perhaps there is a possibility of the City of Palm Desert
becoming the owner, as has been mentioned in the media.
Randy Talmage, P.O. Box 4842, Orange, CA, stated he and his wife
were buying a house in the area, and were concerned about this
special assessment going up the following year. Chairman Benford
pointed out that Member Grubb's $62 could be a little on the high
side. It could be much lower if it's spread beyond those that are on the
golf course.
Carol Benford, 42-880 Tennessee, Palm Desert, thanked Don Colletta
for referring to the letter in the Desert Sun that she had written. I am
sad that the word "bailout" continues to be used because that sends
shivers down everybody's spine these days. I am sure the City is not
happy about what has occurred here and having to deal with this
circumstance. What follows is not going to be easy for them or for the
residents. I really do feel that all of the residents need to step up and
be part of the solution. With the number of homes in the Country
Club, if there is an assessment, either through an assessment district
or homeowners' organization, it would be a fairly small amount that
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everybody would have to pay. Some residents would say, and I have
heard this, I don't five on the golf course, I don't play golf, and I don't
even like golf. Everyone should care about the value of their property
and the safety of their neighborhood. In gated communities, no one
can say, well I don't use the pool and I don't play tennis, so therefore I
don't have to pay my assessment. It doesn't work that way.
Everybody has to maintain the integrity and the safety of their
neighborhood and their community. What I would hope for from the
City would be some wisdom, may be some flexibility and to help out
with this problem. I definitely feel the residents have a responsibility
here too.
Ray Hofcos, 77-365 Missouri Dr., Palm Desert, stated he was a
homeowner at Palm Desert Country Club. He came to California in
1950 while he was in U.S. Navy. I lived in the City of Torrance in
1957, which was the all American city. I was on the formation
committee for the City of Carson when it was becoming a city. Also
lived and worked in Hawthorne for 37 years. The reason I mention
this, is because I have lived in Palm Desert for 20 years, and I think
this is one of the most progressive cities that I have ever seen. The
City does a number of things for the residents, such as music in the
park, fireworks show, and parks and recreation. I want to remind you
that Joe Mann Park was property donated by PDCC HOA to the City,
where we now have a dog park and recreation facility. The greatest
thing is the Set -to -Save Program, which if people haven't taken
advantage of it they have lost something because it is a great
program. Now we have two proposals. I really think this is not a
bailout, but a purchase by the City to provide the residents with
something nice. How many times can a person play a round of golf at
a country club golf course for $25. 1 think it is a win -win situation
because the City keeps their tax base, the revenue keeps up, doesn't
devalue our homes, and the residents keep Palm Desert Country Club
going.
Jerry Archer, 77-185 Michigan Drive, Palm Desert, stated that this
was the first time he had approached a group on this type of subject
matter, and hoped that he did not offend anyone with his comments. I
have lived in Palm Desert Country Club since 1988, and have owned
a house on the golf course since 1990. 1 have seen a number of
owners come and go, and nobody has taken care of this course like
the current owners. I would be a shame to let it go. There has been a
lot of talk of different avenues to support this endeavor to keep it
going, which would be beneficial to both the City and those of us who
live in the Country Club.
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I personally think that the Homeowners' Association needs to be
disbanded. I am spending $300 a year for a facility that I don't use. I
heard that there was a proposal originally presented by this
development group to purchase that Association. They would replace
it with some new facilities that would still provide more benefit to those
of us that live in the club than supporting all the outside groups. Not
only that, but we could take the revenues they have built up to
purchase it and refund it to homeowners who have been paying into
this and have not been using it for all these years. Then turn around
and have that same assessment, which would probably be even less,
charged to each of the homeowners. They would be given a social
benefit in the club with more benefits, and it would resolve a lot of
these financial issues. I would think that if that could happen that this
assistance for buying these rounds of golf could probably be
eliminated in two to three years. I really do support this group and
what they are trying to do. I think our City ought to step up for the
almost 2,000+ homeowners that live there. This would benefit all of
us.
Chairman Benford asked Mayor Spiegel to comment on the
homeowners' association and what the City can or cannot do. Mayor
Spiegel stated that the City cannot do anything about the
homeowners' association. If you are talking about the PDCC, what it
was when I came on the Council 14 years ago and what it is today, it's
like day and night. What that golf course has done for the community
is really dramatic. I am not saying the money was managed properly
because I know nothing about that. It used to be part of Riverside
County. There were no curbs, gutters and the streets were not
maintained. We have put some moderate income housing in there
that looks terrific, and have torn some things down and have built
them up again. Joe Mann Park is a great little pocket park.
Mayor Spiegel mentioned that a comment was made that Palm Desert
Country Club is a threat to Desert Willow. It is no threat to Desert
Willow, nor is Desert Willow a threat to Palm Desert Country Club.
Palm Desert Country Club is not the only golf course in our City that is
in trouble right now. If we were using that ugly word "bailout" to come
up with some way to give money to PDCC, I know of five other course
owners that would be in my office tomorrow asking, what are you
going to do for me? Assessment districts can't go up just because it is
more expensive next year; every raise would have to be voted on. As
Charlie Ash indicated, you need 70% of the people saying "Yes let's
go out and vote". All you need is 51 % of the people voting for it to
create it.
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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Barbara Wallen, 43-655 Tennessee Ave., Palm Desert, stated she is
a local realtor who has lived on the golf course in Palm Desert
Country Club for 21 years. I have sold seven houses in Palm Desert
to Canadian people who do not live in the state. They rent the houses
and are not able to play Desert Willow when they come down two to
three weeks a year. There are heavy restrictions on who can play at
Desert Willow. It would seem to me that you could expand those
qualifications to those people, especially the Canadians, who are
watching their dollars and would be very happy to play at PDCC. It
would be a tremendous credit to the City. Personally, I would be
happy to pay the assessment, but asked that it be included in her
property taxes. Mayor Spiegel stated that the assessment would be
included in the property taxes.
Member Ash stated he wanted to speak as a resident and not as a
member of this Committee. He wanted to respond to Mr. Archer's
comments. The City has never offered to buy this facility. I spend a
lot of time on the Homeowner's committee. When someone buys a
piece of property within the confines of the PDCC HOA, they are told
that they have to become a member of the Homeowners' Association,
whether you use it or not that's your choice. There are two distinct
groups. There is the original group of 958 homes that belonged to the
homeowners. There was some financial difficulty with Oliphant and
some of the original developers, so two tracts were sold, which
reduced the amount of homes. Those two groups are not part of the
homeowners' association. When you buy a piece of property within
the confines of the PDCC Homeowners Association, you have to join,
whether you use it or not that's your choice. You have the right to use
the hall and pools at any time. I tell everybody you have two choices,
pay your homeowner's dues or sell your house and move.
The other point is that when this group came along and said we are
going to do this and that, the City somewhat got behind everything. I
was one of the members that helped sell it. We thought that with the
City behind it we would never find ourselves in this situation again.
Well, here we are. I can certainly understand where the City stands.
As the Mayor commented, if they approved any kind of loan for Palm
Desert Country Club, there would be another five course owners in his
office tomorrow. 1 think that we all need to come up with some means
of solving this. It's not going to be easy, and a tax assessment district
is going to be a tough sale. I don't think people would go for it, even
though it is going to keep up their property values.
Member Campbell stated that prior to this meeting he had done some
checking. I do know that I can back up what Mayor Spiegel said to
one degree, and that is I am quite familiar with the general manager
who is watching this closely. He will be in the Mayor's office the next
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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day. I also know of a business owner who is watching this closely and
will be in here. We have a City who has been cutting back trying to
cut about $5 million. The problem you are faced with is that this is not
the entire City of Palm Desert. This is one area and the City Council
must be aware of the entire City. There are other golf courses and
other businesses that are hurting so bad, that I would recommend to
the City Council a "No". Then you have to work it out yourselves
because I don't believe the City can afford to take on this risk.
Question from audience: "How can they afford not to?" Just think of
the taxes that you would lose on the valuation of all those properties
that are involved. I am for Palm Desert 100%, and I don't want to see
them lose all that valuation by becoming a slum area. They used to
call it the ghetto. We don't want that again, and neither do you if
you're a Palm Desert fan.
Member Campbell replied that he is a fan and has lived here many
years. I have served on several different committees and I do care.
As the Mayor can testify, I care very much about this city. They cannot
take on all the costs of this entire city's businesses and golf courses
that are in trouble. It is just not possible. If they were to take it on, you
would find the City in trouble just like the State of California. We
cannot be myopic about this. I apologize if I have upset you.
Chairman Benford stated that he disagreed with Member Ash's
comment that it would be difficult to get 70% of the homeowners to
vote in favor of looking into an assessment district, based on the
comments from this audience. He asked Mayor Spiegel about the
mechanics to get this started. Mayor Spiegel referred the matter to
Mr. McCarthy.
Mr. McCarthy stated it would be best to do a formal poll of the
community. It could be via letter to see what the response is. If staff
was directed by the City Council to do a poll, we would be more than
happy to do a poll. I would hope that the poll would reflect that the
property owners are prepared to self -assess through either an HOA or
an assessment district. Mayor Spiegel stated that the Committee
needs to make a recommendation to the City Council. If that is the
recommendation of the Committee, then it will go to the City Council.
Member Grubb stated she needed to know more about the HOA. If
the HOA is collecting $300 per year, it could raise the amount and
have some of the funds go to the golf course. Member Ash asked to
keep the HOA out of it because it has nothing to do with this problem.
Chairman Benford asked for a motion.
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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Motion was made by Member Campbell and seconded by
Member Ash to recommend to the City Council that a letter be
sent to all the homeowners requesting their feelings towards an
assessment of some type. Motion was approved by unanimous
vote.
Question from audience: Would it be possible for the City of Palm
Desert to guarantee a loan in the interim period so that the golf course
does not go into disrepair? Mayor Spiegel replied that if the
assessment district is created, he was sure the City would have the
ability to provide funding to cover that assessment until the money
comes in. Homeowners would not be paying the money until they pay
their taxes, which the soonest would be in November. If the golf
course cannot exist until November and there is an "X" number of
dollars coming in, I'm sure there is a way that we could garner those
dollars that are required to keep the golf course going.
The resident wanted to know how soon the letter would go out. Mayor
Spiegel responded he did not know because he is only one vote.
There are five of us and we need three "yes" votes to send the letter
out. We have a meeting a week from this Thursday, and it could be
agendized for that meeting. Mayor Spiegel suggested that they attend
the meeting and express their feelings.
Member Grubb stated that the Committee needs more information on
the poll. Would only those properties that abut the golf course be
assessed? Mayor Spiegel stated that the purpose of the poll is to find
out if homeowners are interested in an assessment district. It won't
guarantee an assessment district, but it will start the wheels moving.
Questions from audience: Is it true that the City would not allow the
golf course to go under? Does the City have a maintenance
agreement with the golf course owner? If they don't have any money
and the grass starts growing, is the City going to step in and take care
of that problem? Mayor Spiegel replied that he could not answer those
questions, and as he had previously stated, he is only one vote.
Question from audience: What are the developer and owner going to
do if the City is not willing to assist, or if they are not able to hold out
until the community decided what to do? Mr. Case replied that they
are optimistic that some sort of solution could be worked out, whether
through an assessment, investor, or the bank. I can't give you an
honest answer about how long our funds are going to last. Mr. Case
stated that it would be unwise for the bank not to step up and do
something so they do not lose their investment value. Mayor Spiegel
asked Mr. Case to let the City know how they proceed. Mr. Case
reported that the 2009-2010 reassessment value had been received,
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CITIZENS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE FOR PROJECT AREA NO. 4
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which was $5 million less. The reassessed value of the property is
between $7.1 to $7.2 million, which was based on the $13 million
value and not on what it is selling for today.
Question from the audience: Would it help to attend the Council
meeting to encourage the assessment of the properties, or to give
them some financial breathing space in reassessing properties? Is
there any way the Committee could be helpful in getting it further
reassessed? Mayor Spiegel replied that the reassessment is done
through the County.
X. REPORTS AND REMARKS
A. COMMITTEE CHAIRPERSON/MEMBERS
B. AGENCY BOARD LIAISONS
C. PLANNING COMMISSION LIAISON
D. STAFF
XI. ADJOURNMENT
The next meeting is scheduled for July 20, 2009 at 3:00 p.m. There being
no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 4:27 p.m.
CMaria Hunt, Recording Secretary
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